Cooking Classes - What Up in the Next 3 Weeks?

[origamicrane]

ok so i got a nice 3 week break between jobs and so i'm looking for some food things to do.

So i booked my one day fish, knife skills course at billingsgate seafood training school for next week.

Going to call up degustibus tomorrow and see how much their one day bread making course is.

I remeber reading about a chocolate course in one of the fancy chocolate store in london but i can't remeber the name of it, anyone know which store it is?

So looking for a few more things to do, any suggestions?

I already looked at leiths, cordon bleu, cookeryschool, divertimenti, books for cooks and the two above.

Ideally want something short and not too expensive.

Actually if i walked into one of my fav restuarants and offered to pay them £100 to teach me one of their dishes you think they would go for it??

hmmm... i wonder maybe i make a visit to patisserie valerie tomorrow

ok this might be a little risky but if you are a chef and want to offer me some tuition let me know.

[Gary Marshall]

forget paying cash, why don't you ask your favourite places if you could work unpaid as a stagiare?

i'm sure you could get something to gain some experience

cheers

gary

[origamicrane]

forget paying cash, why don't you ask your favourite places if you could work unpaid as a stagiare?

i'm sure you could get something to gain some experience

cheers

gary

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thought about doing that

but worried i'll spend 3 weeks washing dishes and chopping vegetables

[Brithack]

pretty sure the chocolate class is at l'artisan du chocolat on lower sloane street.

or it could be pierre marcolini at ken high street.

but i think it's l'artisan.

[Matthew Grant]

forget paying cash, why don't you ask your favourite places if you could work unpaid as a stagiare?

i'm sure you could get something to gain some experience

cheers

gary

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thought about doing that

but worried i'll spend 3 weeks washing dishes and chopping vegetables

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I wouldn't worry too much about washing dishes but everybody has to chop. You won't get treated so well in the kitchen if you go in there with grand ideas about cooking straight away. Remember, the chefs working in whatever restaurant you choose have probably worked in the trade for a few years, why should some wannabe be able to come along and jump straight in at the top and start prepping signature dishes? Having said that if you spend some time there they will soon allow you do do more exciting things if they think you are up to it and aren't getting in their way. Ask a restaurant if you can spend a couple of days in the kitchen, its very enjoyable and a big eye opener.

[alexw]

I could let you work for a day if you like, lots of chopping and no pot washing, probably a little spinach picking too, but then you can't have the smooth without a little rough. If you are interested in a day in a 5* hotel kitchen the PM me with your phone number and I'll give you a ring.

Alex.

[origamicrane]

forget paying cash, why don't you ask your favourite places if you could work unpaid as a stagiare?

i'm sure you could get something to gain some experience

cheers

gary

←

thought about doing that

but worried i'll spend 3 weeks washing dishes and chopping vegetables

←

I wouldn't worry too much about washing dishes but everybody has to chop. You won't get treated so well in the kitchen if you go in there with grand ideas about cooking straight away. Remember, the chefs working in whatever restaurant you choose have probably worked in the trade for a few years, why should some wannabe be able to come along and jump straight in at the top and start prepping signature dishes? Having said that if you spend some time there they will soon allow you do do more exciting things if they think you are up to it and aren't getting in their way. Ask a restaurant if you can spend a couple of days in the kitchen, its very enjoyable and a big eye opener.

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true true!

my favourite cheesecake of all time is the one at valeries

so i think i will have a chat to the kitchen there.

should have time today will pop in later.

[origamicrane]

I could let you work for a day if you like, lots of chopping and no pot washing, probably a little spinach picking too, but then you can't have the smooth without a little rough. If you are interested in a day in a 5* hotel kitchen the PM me with your phone number and I'll give you a ring.

Alex.

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really? cool

will pm you for more info

[dellis453]

ok so i got a nice 3 week break between jobs and so i'm looking for some food things to do.

So i booked my one day fish, knife skills course at billingsgate seafood training school for next week.

Going to call up degustibus tomorrow and see how much their one day bread making course is.

I remeber reading about a chocolate course in one of the fancy chocolate store in london but i can't remeber the name of it, anyone know which store it is?

So looking for a few more things to do, any suggestions?

I already looked at leiths, cordon bleu, cookeryschool, divertimenti, books for cooks and the two above.

Ideally want something short and not too expensive.

Actually if i walked into one of my fav restuarants and offered to pay them £100 to teach me one of their dishes you think they would go for it??

hmmm... i wonder maybe i make a visit to patisserie valerie tomorrow

ok this might be a little risky but if you are a chef and want to offer me some tuition let me know.

←

[dellis453]

How about a wee trip to Edinburgh? We've got a great cookery class taking place on 19th April http://www.discoverthetaste.com/events/cookclass_05.htm

or a foodie walking tour on 23 April visiting some gourmet hotspots in Edinburgh ...

[origamicrane]

How about a wee trip to Edinburgh? We've got a great cookery class taking place on 19th April http://www.discoverthetaste.com/events/cookclass_05.htm

or a foodie walking tour on 23 April visiting some gourmet hotspots in Edinburgh  ...

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Edinburgh is a lil' out of my way seeing as i'm in london

but thanks for the tip.

[origamicrane]

Hi all

!!WARNING!!

!!long post!!!some of it convulted!! lots of spilling mistakes!!

Yesterday took up AlexW's kind offer to do a stagiaire (trainee) day at Indigo Restaurant in London.

Seemed a little random at first to be actually offered a trainee day from a post on line but as they say never look a gift horse in the mouth and after the last couple of months with my tv malarkey was more then happy to go on a little faith.

I shouldn't have worried Alex and his team were a really nice bunch, very friendly and welcoming and more then happy to answer all my questions and let me wander around the kitchen. In fact everyone seemed to be really interested in making sure that I got all answers I wanted to know.

Thanks again Alex hope I didn't get in the way too much and say hi to the rest of the team for me will definitely take up your offer for another stage when the winter menu comes through and if you ever need help let me know

especially if its a computer or chinese food related question

Ok The following post is for people that think they might like to work in the catering trade. My background is an IT consultant but family business is a chinese restaurant and takeaway as such I grew up in the kitchen cooking is very much in the blood. I hope to one day open my own restaurant serving what I would call modern oriental cuisine and others might call fusion alhough they would be wrong

The reasons I went for this training day are

1. I wanted to see how a Western kitchen was run compared to a Chinese kitchen.

2. Hopefully pick up a few cooking tips to improve my own cooking.

3. Maybe get some inspiration.

4. Have some fun and try some great food.

So arrived at 9am met Alex and got changed into whites.

Then Alex gave me a tour of One Aldwych showing me around the hotel facilities and the two restaurants in the hotel Indigo and Axis.

Then into the Indigo kitchen were I met the brigade.

So here is a list of what i did.

Morning: 9am-3pm

First task dice pancetta a nice simple task to begin with just to warm me up and to make sure i'm not a complete beginner. straight after that went on to pastry and following a recipe made a thyme scented cheesecake scented cheesecakes.

After that helped cook the risotto well to be precise stirred a massive pot of risotto rice. Watched Alex make a lobster stock. Then onto touch to watch the lunch service. As the orders were being plated Alex would let me taste the food and explain what each dish consisted of.

Evening: 3pm-10pm

Helped pipe ganache into chocolate shells, dip in melted chocolate and cover in cocoo powder to make the truffles very fun but messy job.

Peeled sweet potato an carrots.

Then came the really fun part it was the staff tasting of the new menu

So the kitchen cooked off one of every dish and then took it downstairs where each dish was explained to the staff and then we dived in. I got to try every dish on the menu and pretty damn good if you ask me

After the tasting made some raspberry and cinnamon muffins,

chopped some potatoes, cooked some mushrooms, and as promised picked some spinach, watch them cook for the evening service now i know how to get that really crispy skin on to a fillet of fish, chargrill some veg, help plate a load of desserts do two main courses.

So what did I learn ?

Some of the stuff i'm about to say is pretty obvious and some of it is generalised and it is only my opinion and i am comparing a surburb restaurant to a 5 star hotel restaurant.

Learnt that western and eastern kitchen are very similiar in operation but its the implementation thats different. A western kitchen is more regimented and jobs and roles are specific. In a chinese kitchen each person looks after a different section of the larder but when it comes to cooking everyone cooks everything.

All recipes and methods were documented try finding a recipe in a chinese restaurant!!! Also daily duties were written down and timetabled.

There is a lot more wastage in a western kitchen edible food that looks subpar will be chucked.

Think one of the things that did surprise me was that you can get more out of your suppliers then just a cheap price and a xmas gift as Alex makes deals with his suppiers to provide training days for his staff. Which i think is a great idea.

All through the day I found that I was asking question less about cooking and more about management, logisitcs and just generally running the kitchen. Any questions I had about cooking seemed to be answered by just watching them cook but it was the way that the kitchen was ran that was very different to chinese restaurant. For a start everyone I met and spoke too generally had an interest in cooking you may think that is pretty obvious but this is not true in a chinese kitchen. In fact all the workers that have actually worked in my familys restaurant I think I can only remeber 2 that were genuinely interested in the food and one of them was a English guy strangely enough named Alex??!

The one overidding thought I had in my head the whole day even on the train home was not if i'm going to open my restaurant but when and how i would set up the kitchen and run it.

Going to do a lot of thinking and cooking over the next few weeks and think i will try and get a trainee day at nobu or hakkasan to see how they combine western and asian staff and cooking.

But had a very fun day, learnt a lot and ate a lot of good food. But be in no doubt that it is hard work and a tiring day I was on my feet for 13 hours and I wasn't even do any heavy work or cooking and still feeling tired.

But i would highly recommend doing this for everyone interested in cooking or if you have a urge to work in a kitchen.

oh just to show how much of a food geek i've become was really pleased to try out different knives as i got a wusthof and global knife but never used a kyocera ceramic, shun or porchse knife

[origamicrane]

oh and there's more

I got another training day organised for this weekend

180 vegetarian lunch service in a buddhist temple in london.

this should be interesting

[adt]

So how do they get that really crispy skin on to a fillet of fish??

You could let us know here if you don't want to be accused of drifting off topic... although you'll have to endure my overlong musings on the matter.

[alexw]

adt, I have posted my kitchens technique where you asked.

Origamicrane you are vey welcome, and no you didn't get in our way, well thats a lie but only because my kitchen is the size of your average shoe box.

One point to note for other readers is he kindly omitted the small part during evening service where it nearly all went wrong and I did my hopping up and down shouting a few choice phrases to some of my boys, GR I am not but neither will I serve crap to my guests. Food went well for the 2nd day of my menu and the boys on the whole when they found their focus did a great job.

It was very kind and I hope that you did truly get something out of the day, after all I got my spinach picked (as promised).

Alex.

[silverbrow]

Origamicrane what was the Billingsgate course like? I'm also about to have some time off between jobs and have reserved (although not paid for) a place on the course. Did you find any other decent, short cooking courses? Did you do a stage at Pat Val?

btw and off topic - thanks for the recommendation of Atari-Ya for fresh fish, the tuna I got was fantastic.

[origamicrane]

Origamicrane what was the Billingsgate course like? I'm also about to have some time off between jobs and have reserved (although not paid for) a place on the course.  Did you find any other decent, short cooking courses?  Did you do a stage at Pat Val? 

btw and off topic - thanks for the recommendation of Atari-Ya for fresh fish, the tuna I got was fantastic.

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hi

due to my new job starting early ?I couldn't find time to go to the fish course will have to leave it for another day or might just get a stage at one of the fish restaurants?

hmmmmm..... hehehe

anyone reading this from J sheekeys? fish works? cafe fish? that can offer me a stagiaire day ??

Found a few short course that looked interesting

some at leiths, cordon bleu, cookeryschool, books for cooks, divertimenti, etc

just not during the time I had off work.

Again because the job started early it scuppered my plans for a stage at valeries but I still plan to go there sometime really want that cheescake recipe!!

in fact will probably contact a few of my fav restaurant to see if i can get a trainee day with them.

In fact had to take the day off work to take up alex's offer of a stage but it was well worth it

yeah atari-ya is great isn't it

feels like you popped into a local fishmongers in Japan.

hmmm i wonder if they be willing to train me up???

i have been a customer for 10 years now???

There is also an interesting second hand japanese store opposite north Ealing station on Queens drive seems like all of the japanese family when they leave the country sell their equipment to them and sometimes you can find some interesting crockery and cookware.

[origamicrane]

the continuation of Sam's further adventures in cooking!!!

so yesterday went to help cook at the Buddhist temple in town.

Now just for some context I am technically a non-practising buddhist

but i have a good friend that is and she knows I am a cookie so asked me if i'd liked to help out with the cooking for their monastic retreat.

For the monastic retreat the nuns and faithfuls spend a whole day in silence and in religious contemplation, prayer and meditation.

Ok on to the cooking

arrive at the temple at 9am. I am met by my friend and a team of 15 student volunteers.

We have 3 hours to cook 3 dishes, 1 soup and rice for 100 people

that include nuns, congregation and staff.

so the dishes are all 100% vegetarian and are

Stir fried chinese spinach in garlic sauce.

Stir fried mixed veg (broccoli, shittake, white cabbage, carrots.)

Mock meat in a mock oyster sauce (soya)

Fried Rice with veg

Plain rice

Vegtable broth soup.

So my prep work is to help wash and chop a box of broccoli

peel, slice and dice a box of carrots,

wash and chop two large bags of chinese spinach,

chop 2 white cabbage

chop mushrooms

chop and core apples

With a team of 15 people this prep work takes about 1 hour.

meanwhile two industrial sized rice cookers are steaming away.

Usually it is the nuns themselves doing the cooking but today as the numbers are so many they have asked people to volunteer and there are two professional cooks in the kitchen.

All the dishes are stir fried in the largest woks I have ever seen, they are about 1 meter in diameter and 40 cm deep and they are stir frying with 2 metal spades ( well very large spatulas) on a tiny 2 wok burner!

The cooking is industrial cooking and nothing as refined as in Indigo. But the difference here is that there is something else in the cooking a spirituality.

What I haven't said so far is that everyone is calm, everything is smooth and if it wasn't for the buddhist service being broadcasted all through the temple everything would have been silent!! It is very strange cooking will you are constantly bombarded with buddhist mantras. Imagine cooking to gregorian chanting i think it might bring your cooking closer to god

All the food is cooked before 11.30 and here comes the fun part!!

the kitchen is in the basement but the service hall is on the top floor

which is 6 flights up with no lift!!!

Oh! and you have to remove your shoes half way up the stairs before you enter the prayer hall. So there are 15 of use running up and down the stair carrying large rice cookers, big pots of hot soup, trays of cooked veg, pot of boiling water for the food warmers.

The tables are set up and the food is ready. Then the reverend leads the faithful up the stairs to the food hall while singing mantras.

Here to me comes the most fascinating part were as we on egullet consider some food to be religious experiences this really was. Were as some of you may give thanks before you eat a meal this was far more significant.

The reverend speaks about the food before during and after the meal. She explains how to eat the food, the placement of the food on the table, the importance of the nurishment, the importants that even whether you hate or like the taste of the food you should not hate or be greedy for the food and be aware of the nurishment of the body the food provides.

After the meal, we cleaned up and the reverend came in to thank the volunteers. It at this point that my friend tells me that she has been to a monastic retreat in taiwan where a 1000 people were served meals in total silence and all within a few minutes.

This was fascinating to me as i have never comtemplated food in such depth.

Up until now food has always been a scientific or mechanical thought process

follow the recipe getting the flavours right, pairing dishes and wines etc,

how many of you have considered the spiritual importance of food?

Oh and finally the food was pretty good from a non-vegetarain point of view the mock meat was actaully quite tasty .

[origamicrane]

Hello

This morning I’m still very tired and blurry eyed after having to wake up at 5am yesterday and then driving across town in the pouring rain to get to Billingsgate fish market.

I haven’t been here in two years and last time I came it was the weekend before Xmas and that was like going to a rock concert that smelt of fish.

Anyhoo I was meant to do this back in April but due to work constraints had to put it off.

Originally I was planning to go on the £175 knife skills course but then a few weeks back I saw a Free introductory course into fishmongering.

heck! it’s a lot cheaper then £175! so I thought I give it a try.

Billingsgate Seafood Training School

Free Introductory Course in Fishmongering.

The official website is here

http://seafoodtraining.org/

So woke up at 5am and arrived at Billingsgate at 6:15am

you have no idea how hard that was for a 9-5 IT desk jockey

But standing in the freezing October morning rain looking at Billingsgate I had a warm fussy feeling that I was back on familiar ground

(I lived for 5 years in Limehouse on a road called Salmon Lane no less).

So went into the market and went to the school located on the first floor

there were half a dozen people there already, all looking far more awake then me, drinking tea and chatting about food (aren’t we always!).

So after a quick coffee Charlie Caisey the course instructor came in and we went round the room and each gave our name, rank and serial number and reason for attending.

Three of them were planning to become fishmongers, one was opening a fish retailing business dealing directly to the catering trade, one was a private caterer himself and one wanted to open a restaurant

This course is primarily targeted at the potential fishmonger and not the caterer or the foodlover this is to quote Charlie a “bread and butter” introduction to fish mongering but they welcome anyone that is interested in the fish trade.

We started off with a tour of the market so it’s on with the white coats.

Charlie has worked a lifetime in the industry and to say that he is knowledgeable would be an understatement but the first lesson he thought us was that there is always something to learn.

Over the next 2 hours Charlie guides us around the stalls as he goes he picks up some examples of fish shows us how to identify species, what to look out for, how to look for good quality fish, how the industry operates, how the market works, a little history about the firms that operate their, how to read the market and availability and therefore the price of fish, which firm specialise in what, how the antiquated porterage system works, how the number of species available on the market has grown from a few dozen to over 150 species, what fish would be acceptable for a caterer and what would be acceptable for a fish monger, to if possible AVOID going to the market on a Saturday morning!

and loads of other good stuff !!

Along the way we get the full flavour of the market noise, the hustle and bustle, the banter! The tooing and throing of porters as they constantly shouting at us to mind our feet. The swearing! Everyone there seems to know Charlie on a “Hi Charlie! you still alive?” basis!! To which Charlie replies with “I can’t afford to die yet!”.

Yes! I am very much back in the East End!

A Health and safety inspector calls out to Charlie and tells him he has something interesting to show us. He opens a box with a big red “C” sticker stuck on it and inside are 4 or 5 salmon. The salmon are not silvery and shiny like salmon normally are but more orange and green skinned and they have more pointed head. At first I thought it was bad salmon but then the inspector says it’s been impounded as it is mature salmon. Mature salmon is salmon that is in it breeding cycle and it is illegal to catch and sell as it endangers salmon stocks and he also said it didn’t taste as good. Charlie explains the role of the inspector within the market who constantly test and check the quality of fish being traded the legality of the species being traded and their powers of confiscation. The inspector said that the market was pretty well behaved and to some extent self regulated as if the stall owners find something irregular they would usually inform them.

Half way through we stopped of at a stall selling smoked fish and the stall owner is kind enough to let use have a nibble on a piece of hot smoked salmon after a slight hesitation from the delegates we dive in and wow!! It’s lovely! Yes it thoroughly deserves to be called Salmon bacon!

So round about now the market is clearing up and we head to the cafe for a rosey lee and bacon sarnie well it is 9am and we are in the East End.

So back up to the training room and its blue aprons, boot covers and sharp knives time!.

Into the demo room we go and Charlie proceeds to show us how to fillet a plaice.

head off

knife it down the back

sweep

other side

ta daa!

few minutes later

by the way this is my handiwork ! Not Charlie’s!

I’m confused I always thought flat fish was meant to be hard to fillet?

But this was really easy!

Well 4 plaice late its break time and time for another cup of cha!

Over the last few hours we have formed an opinion of Charlie and as an ex-eastender I think its safe for me to say that he is a diamond geezer!

Charlie is a lovely chap. All through the tour he answered all our questions, he’s friendly, animated, entertaining and informing.

He is full of stories about his life and times at the market and listening to him you can’t but help smile.

He’s one of those lucky people that enjoys what he does and he has been rewarded for his passion.

He is a gentleman, but he says it like it is! and makes no apology for not being politically correct, hurrah!!

So back to the training room and this time its whiting

whiting

whiting

down spine

cut to the other side

other side

fillet off

Now this is Charlie’s work and not mine

here’s my attempt not so good

have filleted mackerel and trout before but whiting is a lot harder

it is soft and my knife is very sharp that I am cutting through bones as I try to follow the line

oh! Well! better get down to some pin boning.

Well we had 2 Whitings each and my first attempt was better then my second!

Well bugger! I’m Chinese! I eat my fish whole! Well that’s my excuse anyway

So what did I learn from Charlie?

1. There is always something to learn

2. There was no real right way to fillet fish

Everyone has there own style and it’s the end results that count, he told us a story of a fishmonger in a competition that filleted a shark of something using a butter knife!

So to each their own.

3. The most important lesson he taught us was that “time is money” and “fish is money” get the most out of your fish! A few ounces wasted on each fish soon adds up and you can make each and every fish look gorgeous on your slab but if it takes you twice as long to serve customers it will hit you in the pocket.

Well its 2pm and it’s the end of the course. We do a quick wash down of the work area and then we pack up our fish to take home!

Yes! not only is the course free, they give you tea and coffee, 4 plaice and two whitings and that’s not all!! they also give you free sandwiches for lunch! A fish identification dvd and a knife skills video!!

Wow! Guess there is such thing as a free lunch!!

All they ask is for you to email or send them a feedback letter.

I thoroughly enjoyed my time here and it a excellent course.

Charlie is a lovely person and an excellent teacher.

And the people that run the school are all really nice people too boot and not to mention generous.

I would thoroughly recommend this course to anyone that’s is interested in the fish trade.

Also wanted to add after this course you will have the confidence to have a go at fillettign and preparing a lot more fish and also probably more inclined to do your fish shopping at Billingsgate.

Edited October 14, 2005 by origamicrane (log)

[Tepee]

Glad you picked the right course, Sam! Thanks for taking us through the course, good job with the plaice fillet....eeww...your camera must smell now. The whiting I can get ahold of here are just a quarter of that size.

[origamicrane]

Glad you picked the right course, Sam! Thanks for taking us through the course, good job with the plaice fillet....eeww...your camera must smell now. The whiting I can get ahold of here are just a quarter of that size.

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waterproof camera

just give it a rinse:)