No non-smoking section in Restaurant?

[klemmerm]

Does anyone happen to know what the current state law is regarding having a non-smoking section in restaurants? I went out for a burger at Arthur's in Hoboken recently, and when my wife asked for a table in the non-smoking section, she was informed that there wasn't one -- the entire restaurant allows smoking at all tables.

I'm just courious if that is even legal in a large NJ restaurant these days. Seems kinda fishy -- like perhaps they are pretending they are just a bar or something, and not a restaurant.

-karl

[Rosie]

There is information about smoking laws on the NJ GASP website.

Here: http://www.njgasp.org/

http://www.njgasp.org/d_legis.htm

[ghostrider]

A local coffee shop has a sign in the window, "This restaurant does not offer a non-smoking section, as allowed by law."

Arthur's is perfectly legal, not being fishy at all. They should, however, have a sign similar to the above somewhere, the law says they have to post their smoking choice.

[menton1]

Last Sunday's NY Times NJ section said that the legislature will be considering an anti-smoking law in the new session. This has apparently been gaining momentum again. If it passes, there will be the usual outcry from the smoking contingent and the bars, and then after a few months it will settle down and it will have proven that there was no loss in business. Go Trenton!!

[menton1]

Smoking is now banned in restaurants in:

Ireland

Italy

India

Norway

Hong Kong

New Zealand

Closer to home:

California

New York City

Boston

Florida

DC Suburbs (Maryland)

Hawaii

and scores of other US municipalities...

Restaurants are still thriving in these locales. Definitely NOT a ruse. Plus, the NY Times is not given to printing propaganda. The article is not online yet. When it is, I will post the link.

Also, here is a blurb from a business expert: Smoking Bans actually increase restaurant business

Edited January 12, 2005 by menton1 (log)

[hitmanoo]

Does it not stand to reason that there is a niche for non-smoking restaurants. If you can serve good food with good service, in the right atmosphere, and CHOOSE not to allow smoking, perhaps you'd find a crowd receptive to your services.

The boost/decline of actual business dependent on smoking is a little silly. People have to eat. I'm sure that smokers and/or non-smokers aren't going to do all of their own cooking due to the various restaurant policies.

For example, I just haven't mastered my skills at Thai cooking. Until I do, and probably even after that, I'm going to go to some Thai restaurants regardless of their individual smoking policies.

[richl2214]

Looks like the NJ proposed ban is generating the predicted bluster...

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Of course it will cause bluster. The way you presented your side was akin to hearing the "Nyah, nyah, nyah, nyah, nyah, nyahs" as I pass the school playground.

Regardless, I don't see why both types can't coexist. A establishment should be allowed to decide if patrons can smoke or not, if and only if, they offer a smoke free space for the non-puffers.

I do disagree that bars won't be hurt in the wallet by a smoking ban. For example, me and some friends go to a local bar that allows us to smoke cigars. We do this almost bi-weekly. We always drop at least a 3 to 4 hundred at the place when we go with tip. If the ban does pass and we can't smoke there guess where we WON'T be spending money anymore? 2 of my friends lost bartending jobs in NY about 3 months after the ban. The owner couldn't afford to keep them because business dropped significantly for him. These aren't hokey statistics of slanted lobby views, just facts. It will hurt Atlantic City in a real way if the ban includes them. That's not hard to figure out.

The ban is going to have a big problem passing if they have "preferential" treatment and exclusions for just the casinos. It won't fly. The litigators are licking their chops over this one and hundreds of bars and eateries have them on retainer already to challenge a law like that which would obviously be very unfair to the smaller establishments. Bottom line is if the casinos can't be exempt without causing a statewide lawsuit, it ain't gonna pass.

This inside info is from friends of mine who are big judiciary and political lawyers in NJ. Oh, they also happen to be the guys I share cigars with.

[tommy]

The boost/decline of actual business dependent on smoking is a little silly.  People have to eat.  I'm sure that smokers and/or non-smokers aren't going to do all of their own c

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i don't think it's silly at all (although i don't think that anyone here knows the actual impact). i think there's a real correlation between how much time people spend at a restaurant/bar and how much money they spend at that restaurant/bar. i also think there's a real correlation between how much time people spend at a restaurant/bar and how comfortable they are being there. and i also think there's a real correlation between how comfortable smokers are and their freedom to smoke at a restaurant/bar. i think those points are pretty strong...although i'm no business expert like radio personality and consumer advocate http://clarkhoward.com.

[pete ganz]

I'm a smoker and have no problem with a ban on smoking in restaurants. In bars, however, I think it should be the owner's decision. A bar is a place where people go to drink, smoke, listen to loud music, etc. There should at least be a choice between a smoking/non-smoking bar rather than an all out ban. I'm sure both types of operations would do just fine.

[=Mark]

Was in NYC over the holidays, and frequented a number of favorite old bars like PJ Clarks, McSorleys and Old Town Bar. Was pleasantly surprised and greatly enjoyed the fact that there was no smoking. The difficulty in getting a decent spot at the bars belies the claims about business being hurt...

[Vincent Vega]

I have never smoked but the anti smoking bunch offend me more than smokers .The only thing I can see as reasonable for those against smoking is to require a SMOKING ALLOWED sign where appropriate .

As an aside I remember the Las Vegas casino's back in the '80s installing smoke eliminators ( some kind of electrostatic precipitator ) which seemed to work well . Why not let the owners have the option of installing the smoke eliminators or not .

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agreed. What ever happend to the free market? If you dont like smoke - dont go to restaurants that allow smoking. You dont have a "right" to eat in a smoke free privately owned restaurant. You do have the "right" to cook your own meal in your own privately owned home if smoking bothers you so much. Take your pick.

Our country is becoming a bunch or cry babies.

[shugga]

The no non smoking area is the reason I will no longer frequent restaurants like Arthurs any longer.

As an old ex smoker (+30 years) I find the smell of smoke offensive. And love the fact that the bars in NYC no longer allow smoking. I no longer have to shower and wash my hair immediatly upon returning home from an establishment that allows smoking.

But I do believe that smokers are citizens too and have the right to smoke if they wish. But I have the right not to patronize the places that allow it in the entire restaurant or bar. It's all about choices isn't it?

[Susan]

This article about the no-smoking bill was in today's Star-Leder.

http://www.nj.com/search/index.ssf?/base/n...starledger?ntop

[richl2214]

I hope they ban alcohol in bars and restaurants too. It kills way more people than smoke does. That includes self and others around you(drunk driving)

[menton1]

What ever happend to the free market?  If you dont like smoke - dont go to restaurants that allow smoking.  You dont have a "right" to eat in a smoke free privately owned restaurant.  You do have the "right" to cook your own meal in your own privately owned home if smoking bothers you so much.  Take your pick.

Our country is becoming a bunch or cry babies.

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By this logic, we could also say that if you get the urge, you could urinate in the corner rather than use the rest rooms...

But, have no fear, New Jersey will be joining the list of smoking banned States (listed above) and the over 300 American municipalities that have banned smoking in restaurants

[richl2214]

No way Gormley allows this to effect Atlantic City. It stood a real shot before they included the casinos back in the bill. Committee votes mean very little in NJ especially when they are held just for the press. This one is a long way from over imho.

Edited March 15, 2005 by richl2214 (log)

[Kit]

As much as I think it won't go through thanks to A.C., it would be so nice to go to a bar and not have to send my coat to the dry cleaners the next day just so it wouldn't reek. And for anyone that tells me to find a non-smoking bar, you try finding one that everyone wants to go to. I (sorta) feel your pain, but since it's directly benefitting me, I honestly (and selfishly) don't care.