what do YOU personally expect of a chef?

[Gifted Gourmet]

What do you expect of a chef?

keeping in mind though that the vast majority of diners never physically get to know or even see the chefs preparing their meals, it is not the spark that counts but the results that appear on the plate and how they appeal to the eye, the nose, the palate and an overall aesthetic.  Does the spark "show" on those dishes – damned right it does

from Daniel Rogov ...

more than just what is revealed it is personal expression, some kind of tour through taste regions and lands afar I've not dared venture into yet.. always expect more than I get to taste

from Geetha ...

I tend to think of chefs, if not as fine artists dealing in pure abstraction, at least as applied artists not much different from architects who satisfy our need for shelter as chefs satisfy our need for nourishment. I'd expect an architect to provide more than just respite from the elements and a chef to provide more than just sustenance. That more can come in emotional terms such as by the wonderous quality of a sauce, or in intellectual terms by making me think about my meal in such a way as to increase my delight in what I'm eating.

from Bux ...

As for me? Personally, I have come to expect, and this came with trying some delightful tasting menus recently, a lot of creativity, intellect in making variations on a theme, and even a bit of humor (which I have seen here in Atlanta at the highly innovative Blais: foie gras shake, a tiny caesar salad served in a sardine can, a Tang gelatinized cube as a finale, etc.).... and, again, at Manresa when David Kinch presents his formidable "The Egg" ...

Something which speaks of what the chef wants to convey in whatever fashion he/she chooses .. what is the message? possibly a true manifestation of his personal passion?

[Carrot Top]

Difficult. And hard to define taken out of context...and each context is different.

We were speaking 'great chefs' previously...my mind is stuck there, so...

1.Spark..something magical...indefineable. A vision...an approach...an offering that only that individual person can or does offer, translated into a meal through...

2. The amount of attention and care that is shown in the food through...

3. Technical capabilities and through...

4. Ability to instill the specific vision and technical capabilities in their staff for consistency.

This is probably the most boring-looking list I've ever written, but I know you are anxious to get the talk going, Melissa...and I often feel that way, so here I will just offer up my boring list.

There is a lot more, but let me go take a nap, for I've bored myself to sleep.

Will try again later...

[markovitch]

honesty

[Gifted Gourmet]

honesty

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Care to expound just a bit on that?

Your comment reminds me of those made by a character played by Charles Grodin in The Heartbreak Kid (1972),written by Bruce Jay Friedman and Neil Simon, in which Grodin visits his girlfriend's parents in the snowy midwest and says, "These are honest peas and honest carrots, sir, and I love your daughter."

[markovitch]

well, Bourdain and a good deal of other food writers commonly refer to 'honest' food, which I read as the idea that a chef is presenting the best possible product that they can make, selling it at a fair price and not cutting corners, abusing employees, screwing over purveyors, etc. In an industry where (commercial) success and failure can often be a question of pennies, a Chef who does not compromise his/her commitment to their craft is the best kind of chef.

Having worked for a few meglomaniacal, dishonest chefs, I really appreciate the ones who don't f*** around and take care of their business like real, honest, people.

[Gifted Gourmet]

gotcha, markovitch ....

[arielle]

well, Bourdain and a good deal of other food writers commonly refer to 'honest' food, which I read as the idea that a chef is presenting the best possible product that they can make, selling it at a fair price and not cutting corners, abusing employees, screwing over purveyors, etc.  In an industry where (commercial) success and failure can often be a question of pennies, a Chef who does not compromise his/her commitment to their craft is the best kind of chef.

Having worked for a few meglomaniacal, dishonest chefs, I really appreciate the ones who don't f*** around and take care of their business like real, honest, people.

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I agree with you, Markovitch, and I'd like to add that I think 'honest' food includes non-pretentious, well-executed dishes that are authentic and 'true' to their origins. That is to say that ironic twists such as the elevation of junk food to haute status can work really well, but if chefs are over-reaching themselves.......sometimes what you really want is just a nice plate of al-dente pasta with some olive oil and sauteed garlic, or perhaps a fillet of fresh snapper, pan fried, and served with some sea salt, a grind of black pepper, a squeeze of fresh lemon and a sprinkling of parsley.

Okay.....that's a little too simple. But you know what I mean...

[Carrot Top]

sometimes what you really want is just a nice plate of al-dente pasta with some olive oil and sauteed garlic, or perhaps a fillet of fresh snapper, pan fried, and served with some sea salt, a grind of black pepper, a squeeze of fresh lemon and a sprinkling of parsley.

Okay.....that's a little too simple. But you know what I mean... 

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It doesn't sound too simple at all to me, arielle. It sounds like care was taken in thinking of taste combinations, attention was given to what the tummy and tongue are really in the mood for, and balance was considered in the overall scheme.

Prepared with technical skill...that is a meal fit for any demanding hungry person that was interested.

Sometimes (in my opinion often) simplicity can be the best.

[adegiulio]

While well prepared pasta with oil and garlic, or fillet of snapper are very tasty, simple dishes, I expect more from a chef than that. Most of us can knock those dishes out of the park in our own kitchens. While I don't expect chefs to be as off the wall as Dufresne or Adria, I expect a little more attention than excrutiatingly simple food would provide...

[Carrot Top]

Mmm hmm. In terms of desiring creativity, or a higher technical level of artistic knowledge, yes...that could certainly be something that someone would wish to see in a chef.

But...in a chef that chose to prepare the more simpler offerings of food, I would expect that they be able to do it with a better and clearer technical precision than the usual home cook...starting with taking the time and effort to procure the best ingredients available.

This sort of time and effort for a simple meal is not generally taken by the home cook...and it might be that, as a chef spends ten or twelve hours a day doing just this job...and has focused a great deal of time in attaining technical precision...the final result should sing.

Including equipment issues. Most home cooks do not have the access to the same quality equipment or pots/pans etc. that a professional kitchen would.

But having said all this, if one can match say...what one might find in terms of taste and quality that a simpler offering from a well-considered fine dining restaurant might have...then by golly! Definitely eat at home. The chairs are more comfortable, always.

Not to mention the price.

Edited October 24, 2004 by Carrot Top (log)

[Carrot Top]

I do wonder what the 'breakdown' would be...of people who if asked on a daily basis where they wanted to eat...whether more would say a place that offered the simpler basic things, perfectly prepared....or whether more would say a place that aimed higher in terms of creativity et al...

That would be fun to find out....

What it would 'mean'? Who knows. Just fun to find out...

[Daniel Rogov]

At the risk of being pompous (I am sometimes accused of that and sometimes even acknowledge it) let me put forth what I refer to as my "hypothesis of expectations" as it refers to dining out in general and chefs in particular.

One decides, for a multitude of reasons, to enter a specific restaurant and from the moment that decision is made, all that surrounds us leads us to construct a series of expectations. If an eatery cries out "fast-food" by its plastic tables and stools fixed in place and photos of the fare over the counter where orders are placed with clerks in uniforms, one pretty much knows what is in store for them and from that, the aromas, the other diners in attendance, one has a certain set of expectations.

On another hand one walks into let's say what I call a quasi-German weinstub in an American city, replete with waiters and waitresses in lederhose, heavy plastic beams designed to look like old oak, and huge beer steins, one has another set of expectations, in this case of mass-market food that may be tasty but certainly has very little relationship to "the real thing".

On yet another hand, we walk into a restaurant, are greeted by a formally attired maitre or matiresse d'hotel, note a dining room of impeccable décor, find menus bound in leather and a wine list often thicker than the last book we read, we build yet another set of expectations.

In the first case, I would not even dream of finding a chef and possibly not so much even a cook as a young person trained to man the appropriate food-producing machines. In the second, not so much a chef but a cook, possibly one with a fairly untrained staff. In the third, however, my expectations are far higher.

As to our hopes for the food. Once we have committed ourselves to dining in any of these three places, all will be fair and legitimate so long as our expectations are met. I have no right to complain about the quality of a Big Mac because I knew well and damned right what I was gong to get when I ordered it. My expectations were met and all should be well. At the ersatz German establishment, if my cordon bleu is made of flattened and pounded chicken or even turkey breasts and not veal, I should also have no complaint. That is what the restaurant led me to expect and in that I accepted their terms.

When it comes to the fine restaurant and the chef, the same applies. So long as our expectations of the service, ambiance and culinary level of the dishes we receive meet the expectations that were set up for us, all is fair. Receiving a Big Mac at McDonald's is perfectly acceptable, receiving that at Chez Panisse or Alain Ducasse would not be. To use another example, I anticipate one thing when I order a liver pate in a Jewish restaurant in Tel Aviv, another when I order it at a phony or mass-market French restaurant in San Francisco, yet another when I order it at a neighborhood bistro in Strasbourg, and yet quite another when it is offered to me at Guy Savoy's in Paris.

Thus, in a simple phrase, my expectations of the chef are those that are built for me and those that I accept when I enter a specific restaurant. If the restaurant does not set up the set of expectations that I wanted in the first place, I simply should not have entered or, having done so, should have left without dining. On the other hand, even in the simplest of eateries, if the food meets those expectations, I wil be pleased. In a "better" restaurant, if the chef and/or restaurant outstrip my expectations, I will be delighted. If they do not live up to my expectations, I will be disappointed

[Larry 1749]

I think their is a diference betweed a cook and a chef. The title of chef implies that the person has taken some formal training or proven them selves in order to attain this pasition.

When I eat at a resturant that names their chef I have one major expectation.

The food should be better that I can make at home.

There is nothing more depressing than spending you hard earned dollars in a highly rated resturant and discovering that you could have done better yourself.

[Gifted Gourmet]

When I eat at a resturant that names their chef I have one major expectation.

The food should be better that I can make at home.

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With all due respect, Larry, and deference to your personal culinary skills about which I really know nothing, aren't you setting the bar pretty low for most people?

Average restaurants often offer meals I can not make at home yet I don't consider them to have terrific chefs .. or possibly even cooks ...

I still expect much more of a chef than using what I can prepare being the "gold standard" ...

[Carrot Top]

As usual, I have to admire what seems to me to be both clarity of thought and thorough coverage of the situation in Rogov's post.

How could there be more to say?

Expectations.

But then, in thinking more, and in reading the part of Bux's post that you included in your question, GG, my mind wanders off a bit to a more global picture....and here is where it lands.

Is it possible to separate the final perceived performance of the chef...from the performance of the service staff and management of the restaurant?

Is it all about the chef?

Or is the true and final experience of the meal actually a product of some sort of teamwork...each facet affecting the other...to reach the final culmination of how the guest enjoys (or not) the food at table...

[adegiulio]

I don't think it sets the bar too low to say that chefs should be able to prepare things better than I, or Larry, can at home. Like you say, for most people, this is setting the bar pretty low, but I think in the context of eG and its participants, the bar should be higher. I don't think the people here are "most people" when it comes to cooking and food.

Having said that, I'd like to toot my own horn and say that most things I eat in restaurants I could prepare as well or better at home. The reason I go out is so I don't have to bother. That, and to see other people and be a part of society.

[Carrot Top]

When I think of dining at restaurants...and sort through memories to capture what has remained in my mind as representing the highest level of experience...the architectural creations on plate...no matter how stunning....and even (though these remain, stronger...) the novel flavor and texture combinations...that one has the chance to experience at three/four star restaurants...they all pale and disappear under the weight of three memories.

These three memories of food at restaurants eclipse any others: The most beautiful and...mouthwatering...intensely naturally flavored vegetables I have ever tasted, prepared by Bradley Ogden. A steak that made me want to hide under the table and live there forever, nibbling on leftover bones...at Peter Lugers. And a piece of salmon that was the ultimate epitome in simplicity that made an operatic magnificence of a tiny perfect piece of pink fish...at Le Bernardin.

Three simple offerings. Yet not quite so simple, for they each were the works of a master. Unadorned masterpieces.

And no, it was not the accompanying wine that made them so.

Edited October 25, 2004 by Carrot Top (log)

[Carrot Top]

Sorry. I promise to be quiet after this.

Here it is, for me.

In the best of circumstances...and forgetting about McDonald's or Ye Olde Scratchy Pants Ale House...

I expect a chef to show me the inner soul and defining spirit of the food(s) they choose to work with.

[Gifted Gourmet]

Is it possible to separate the final perceived performance of the chef...from the performance of the service staff and management of the restaurant?

Is it all about the chef?

Or is the true and final experience of the meal actually a product of some sort of teamwork...each facet affecting the other...to reach the final culmination of how the guest enjoys (or not) the food at table...

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Since I see the chef as having the "vision" for the final result produced, I can say that it is the chef who directs and ultimately is responsible for the completed dishes .. and, yes, of course, the help received for the entire prepartion is important ... but the "vision" ...

[Daddy-A]

Thus, in a simple phrase, my expectations of the chef are those that are built for me and those that I accept when I enter a specific restaurant.  If the restaurant does not set up the set of expectations that I wanted in the first place, I simply should not have entered or, having done so, should have left without dining.  On the other hand, even in the simplest of eateries, if the food meets those expectations, I wil be pleased. In a "better" restaurant, if the chef and/or restaurant outstrip my expectations, I will be delighted.  If they do not live up to my expectations, I will be disappointed

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Wow Daniel, you are so pompous! (kidding)

I would only add that expectations can be built up over time, i.e. if I have been into a restaurant a number of times, and have come to expect a certain level of quality, I expect that level of quality to be maintained.

I bring this up as an addition to Daniel's excellent answer, to account for a number of little places I frequent throughout the city. If you were to walk into them for the first time, you would have very low expectations. But I can assure you those expectations would change after your first visit.

So I suppose I am adding an expectation of consistency to Daniel's reply, and making it my own.

A.

[jsolomon]

Honestly, I expect an experience at a real restaurant with a real chef [read "places not available in Lincoln, NE"] to be reminiscent of an opera or another like-minded classical music concert. I get told what I am going to get without any pretense or other B.S. With that description, I expect to be able to make a reasonable facsimile of the food myself, just like I can purchase the sheetmusic and perform a solo (especially since I read sheetmusic).

But, that's only the first approximation.

Further, I expect the presentation and the atmosphere to be more-or-less "on". I expect the staff to be inobtrusive yet attentive.

Beyond those, like a good musician, I expect the chef to bring out nuances and interpretations in the food that I hadn't noticed there before in the case of new foods or a new chef. In the case of a restaurant/chef which I've experienced before, I expect either the same interpretation, or something new. Either one is acceptable.

However, what I don't want is fad and/or pretension. Working at a university, I have plenty of those to go around.

[Busboy]

Competence and consistency.

[Gifted Gourmet]

Beyond those, like a good musician, I expect the chef to bring out nuances and interpretations in the food that I hadn't noticed there before in the case of new foods or a new chef.  In the case of a restaurant/chef which I've experienced before, I expect either the same interpretation, or something new.  Either one is acceptable.

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Well said, jsolomon, and I enjoy your analogies as well here!

[abbe]

What do you expect of a chef?

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i expect them to hate my guts, curse at me often, and occasionally even lob a dish at me (which is why i learned to hone my catlike reflexes)

oh you meant as a DINER

never mind

[Larry 1749]

By expecting chefs to prepare a better meal than myself, I do not think I am setting the bar to low.

I would have to belive that the majority of peope here are above average cooks and therefore demand more from their dining experience.

When I go to an upscale resturant I want, no expect a great meal. If I am spending $150 + on dinner it should be better that I can make. I am not a chef, just a passionate amateur who loves to cook. I have been in the resturant business an know what it takes to produce good food.

How many time have you eaten in a good resturant and said to your self I could have done better?