New Wegmans

[jhlurie]

Dammit, why won't they put one in Bergen County?

forget bergen, jason-

Actually, Rockland County, New York would probably be the best place to draw the upper-middle class crowd from both Westchester and Bergen counties. Put it next to the Palisades Mall.

you guys have access to all kinds of decent food stores

Sadly, that's not really true. Plenty of good restaurants, and a good supply of ethnic markets, but the supermarkets aren't that extraordinary.

[Jmoryl]

Actually, Rockland County, New York would probably be the best place to draw the upper-middle class crowd from both Westchester and Bergen counties.  Put it next to the Palisades Mall.

That's right: only wealthy people deserve good food.

OK, I'm being a bit flip, but I still get a bit hot under the collar when I remembe Wegman's from the bad old days of the late '70s - early '80s. Living in inner city Rochester then, Wegman's hadn't quite become the phenom it is now, but it dominated the local market. It had closed most of the mid sized markets in the city and was concentrating on building up the superstore concept in the suburbs (e.g. their flagship Pittsford store). The city stores that remained were wretched - dirty, stale veggies and meat, etc. In fact a friend who worked one in one of the big suburban stores told me they would shrink wrap stale veggies to send into the inner city stores for sale.

I was trying to live without a car, so had to rely on these stores. Strangely enough, Tops, based in Buffalo, was the only chain that would open a clean, modern store in the city. When Wegman's pulled up in some struggling neighborhoods it only accelerated the decline....

[tommy]

Actually, Rockland County, New York would probably be the best place to draw the upper-middle class crowd from both Westchester and Bergen counties.  Put it next to the Palisades Mall.

That's right: only wealthy people deserve good food.

OK, I'm being a bit flip,

i hope so, because the point, i think, is that wegman's most likely puts a lot of thought into where they're going to place their stores, i'd imagine, to maximize profit, among other things. it has nothing to do with who "deserves" what, but rather, who is more likely to support the store. and from what i've seen, the current day wegman's isn't an inexpensive venture to start up and maintain.

[StInGeR]

Dammit, why won't they put one in Bergen County?

forget bergen, jason-

you guys have access to all kinds of decent food stores

we need one in sparta!!!!!

unfortunately the demographics say the area isn't wealthy enough to support it; ditto trader joe's

I'm with you suzi -- Wegman's in Sparta definitely works for me. Hell put it in the Rockaway Mall and I'll stil be happy.

Cheers

Tom

[Lreda]

Morristown? East Hanover? Why the hell do they need a Wegmans? These are the kinds of people that eat at chain restaurants! Have you guys seen the crap that passes for most restaurants on RT 10? (okay, maybe not Lou Reda's place. And I like Penang in East Hanover)

(okay, maybe not Lou Reda's place.) Crap.... Maybe not? ...That's a very hurtful quote. I waited a day to post this because I wanted to compose myself but I don't understand why you would decide to word your post that way. I didn't realize you were disappointed when dining with us.

[herbacidal]

QUOTE (Jason Perlow @ Jun 7 2004, 11:53 PM)

Morristown? East Hanover? Why the hell do they need a Wegmans? These are the kinds of people that eat at chain restaurants! Have you guys seen the crap that passes for most restaurants on RT 10? (okay, maybe not Lou Reda's place. And I like Penang in East Hanover)

(okay, maybe not Lou Reda's place.) Crap.... Maybe not? ...That's a very hurtful quote. I waited a day to post this because I wanted to compose myself but I don't understand why you would decide to word your post that way. I didn't realize you were disappointed when dining with us.

If I read that correctly, I read that as saying Lou Reda's place and Penang in East Hanover were the exceptions to the crap that most restaurants on route 10 pass for.

Edited June 9, 2004 by herbacidal (log)

[Jason Perlow]

Morristown? East Hanover? Why the hell do they need a Wegmans? These are the kinds of people that eat at chain restaurants! Have you guys seen the crap that passes for most restaurants on RT 10? (okay, maybe not Lou Reda's place. And I like Penang in East Hanover)

(okay, maybe not Lou Reda's place.) Crap.... Maybe not? ...That's a very hurtful quote. I waited a day to post this because I wanted to compose myself but I don't understand why you would decide to word your post that way. I didn't realize you were disappointed when dining with us.

Lou, I was referring to some of the other stuff on RT 10, not An American Grill.

[scott123]

I'm not sure this will prove to be that profitable for Wegmans. That location is practically next door to Costco and only a few blocks from Pathmark, Stop & Shop, Shop Rite, Kings in Florham Park and Trader Joes. Regardless of the wealth in Morris County, the upscale supermarkets just aren't doing the kind of business that the bargain places are. The bottom line is that for the most part, Shop Rite and Costco have just about everything you can get in Kings/Stop&Shop and Pathmark for considerably less money. The only exception to this Trader Joes. Trader Joes not only has different products but the products they do sell that are the same are cheaper than shoprite. This is why they're making money hand over fist.

And calling it the "Morristown" Wegmans, is ridiculous. Someone needs to acquire some map reading skills.

[tommy]

And calling it the "Morristown" Wegmans, is ridiculous. Someone needs to acquire some map reading skills.

why? morristown is a large well-known town. that's the point, which i think is explained in the first post to some extent.

[Curlz]

why?  morristown is a large well-known town.  that's the point, which i think is explained in the first post to some extent.

A little perspective from those of us who live/have lived in Morris County...it's VERY obvious that isn't Morristown. The E.H. location is at least 7 miles from the center of Morristown. They may as well put something in Ridgewood and call it the Meadowlands Area if they're going to go that route. If you want to get really technical, it's almost on the Livingston border.

[Rachel Perlow]

And calling it the "Morristown" Wegmans, is ridiculous.  Someone needs to acquire some map reading skills.

Yes, it is just as ludicrous as calling the Giants and Jets NY teams instead of NJ, where they actually play. I wonder, do the players pay their taxes to NJ or NY?

But to get back on subject, there are a lot of places we liked along Rt 10. Besides American Grill and Penang, we enjoyed going to Tratoria Toscana, Bella Rosa, Don Jose, East Tokyo (love that bowling alley adjacent setting), the Whippany Diner (not the Golden Touch, blech), Mr. Chu, Bogey's, Nikko, even Il Capriccio (Jason loved the food, I can't stand the garishness of the exterior decor). We just don't get to these places anymore being that we don't live in the area anymore.

I think Jason was referencing the other types of places on Rt 10, like Macaroni Grill, Chili's, Chevys, and the fast food places like Taco Bell, McD's, BK, etc.

[tommy]

They may as well put something in Ridgewood and call it the Meadowlands Area if they're going to go that route.

frankly, i'd more expect them to put something in Rutherford and call it "the ridgewood xxxx".

space is at a premium. well-known towns are full. the Giants play in NJ. the "NY offices" of countless companies are located in Jersey City, Fort Lee, and Weehawken. and who the hell knows what town Newark airport is in. i've learned to get over it.

[Curlz]

frankly, i'd more expect them to put something in Rutherford and call it "the ridgewood xxxx". 

Now wouldn't THAT be nice...

[jsfein]

And calling it the "Morristown" Wegmans, is ridiculous. Someone needs to acquire some map reading skills.

Its really no different than Wegmans calling its Mercer County Store the "Princeton Wegmans" when in reality the store is in West Windsor. Its just a label using the name of a recognizable town.

[phaelon56]

We have so damn many Wegman's around here that we just refer to them by the name of the road or street they're on Oops... that wasn't your problem... was it....

Tommy - is "xxxx" better than "XXX"? Rutherford definitely lacks anything that could be construed as XXX (at least not since I moved away from there).

Of course we also have the Park and Orchard restaurant in Rutherford that is named for the intersection of said streets which are actually in NYC (admittedly... the restaurant was once located there). That very same restaurant also identifies itself as being in Rutherford but I believe it is just over the borough line and actually located in East Rutherford (which lacks the cachet of Rutherford when it comes to restaurants).

Then there's the store in NYC where I once bought a cell phone: 32nd Street Wireless - it's located on 35th Street. Go figure.

[scott123]

Its really no different than Wegmans calling its Mercer County Store the "Princeton Wegmans" when in reality the store is in West Windsor.  Its just a label using the name of a recognizable town.

Yes, it is different. West Windsor is a bordering town to Princeton. East Hanover is 4 towns over from Morristown. If a business in a bordering town wants to play the fuzzy border game, that's one thing, but 4 towns and 6 miles away. Nope. A spade is a spade.

You know what I think? I think some bigwig at Wegmans has been lusting after a prestigious, well situated "Morristown" store and they're being sold this bill of goods as "close enough."

It's a shame because Morristown would be a huge opportunity for Wegmans. Right now the two supermarkets we have are abysmal, one being heinously overpriced (Kings) and the other, filthy (A&P).

[tommy]

scott123, does morristown have the room for a wegman's? these stores, from what i've read, require a great deal of space and supporting infrastructure. at the end of the day, morristown is the most well-known town in the area of the proposed store.

[Curlz]

I wondered the same thing, Tommy--I can't think of any part of Morristown proper where there's that much sf available that wouldn't be ASTRONOMICAL cost-wise.

East Hanover actually makes sense to me (I know the territory--lived and worked out there for a good chunk of my life)--it's easily accessible to folks in Whippany, Parsippany, the Hanovers, Florham Park, Morristown AND Livingston ($$), Madison and Chatham ($$$) and certainly within reach for those in Short Hills ($$$$$). Hell, I drove from southern Bergen Cty to the Trader Joe's in Florham Park just last weekend!

People WILL travel if they want to get to a good store. I sure do!!

[tommy]

and i would urge anyone who thinks this is some sort of wegman's conspiracy to see my above posts re: NY Giants, NY corporate offices, etc. it's SOP, and there're plenty of other things for me to worry about. i'd hope the same for everyone else. well, not the plenty of things to worry about part, but, you know.

Edited June 10, 2004 by tommy (log)

[phaelon56]

People WILL travel if they want to get to a good store.

Word - what Curlz said.

I think some bigwig at Wegmans has been lusting after a prestigious, well situated "Morristown" store and they're being sold this bill of goods as "close enough."

Wegmans' is as shrewd and savvy as Starbucks or any other major rapidly expanding player. They do really serious demographic studies and they know how far people will drive for a good store. Talk to people whove tried to get their product positioned to eb sold by Wegman's stores and you'll find that they don't get sold a bill of goods on anything.

Furthermore, as has already been pointed out... they need a huge plot of land and will not pay through the nose for it. Figure a store of 120,000 square feet minimum with a hell of a lot more parking than NJ stores typically provide. Add in the requirement for Wegman's to pony up to the town for beefing up and reconfiguring the adjacent streets or road to handle the new volume of vehicular traffic. It's no wonder they haven't touched Bergen County yet. The payback peiod is just way too long. They put a store in six miles from Morristown this year or next and in four to five years when that store is really hitting its stride... residential development density in that area will likely be high enough that people will really think of it as "the Morristown Wegman's" even though it's not technically in Morristown.

I guess it's different further out in NJ but when I lived in Rutherford I'd drive six miles or more in a heartbeat to get to a really good grocery store (but there wasn't oen available to drive to that was anywhere near that close).

[LNorman]

I'm disappointed to read that Wegman's par bakes its bread and ships to the individual stores. I was mad at ShopRite for doing that with the "Le Brea" brand of breads.

Can anyone recommend a good bakery in Woodbridge or surrounding towns that has artisanal breads?

[scott123]

scott123, does morristown have the room for a wegman's?

It's true, Morristown doesn't have the space for something like a Wegmans, but neighboring town Harding Township does. With the exception of Kings, there wouldn't be a supermarket for miles.

[scott123]

I think some bigwig at Wegmans has been lusting after a prestigious, well situated "Morristown" store and they're being sold this bill of goods as "close enough."

Wegmans' is as shrewd and savvy as Starbucks or any other major rapidly expanding player. They do really serious demographic studies and they know how far people will drive for a good store. Talk to people whove tried to get their product positioned to eb sold by Wegman's stores and you'll find that they don't get sold a bill of goods on anything.

Alright, as I was typing that notion, a small part of me was saying "Scott, you're talking out of your ass." It's official. I was.

[MsSumida]

So last night after another great cheap dinner at Penang in East Hanover ($25.00 including tip for 2 apps. and one entree) I'm doing the left turn onto Route 10 and realize I'm at one of the busiest intersections, and this is where the Wegman's is going to be.

OH MY GOD...you can't even drive in that area duiring the week.... I really hope someone is going to be smart enought to say we need to re-design this intersection with no cost to the taxpayers please in less tahn 3 years of work time. Otherwise I guarantee, I will not be going to Wegman's or anyplace else on Rt. 10...I won't be able to get there without packing a box lunch!

Edited June 11, 2004 by MsSumida (log)

[Curlz]

I think the location is actually a bit further west up Rt 10 from the Liv circle, but trust me, the traffic issues are no better there.