Iron Chef America (Part 1)

bpearis · April 24, 2004

Alton is great -- funny, smart, knows what he's talking about -- but to do it all himself, there's just no dynamic. It's hard for anyone to just talk and talk and talk and make it interesting. You need someone to bounce off of, a color guy. Or have Alton be the color guy. It was just a bad decision and one I can't believe they made. And the floor guy just seemed like someone off of E!'s red carpet team. Clueless.

I thought the panelists were fine, actually, especially compared to the ones on the USA version. No one refused to try anything or made an "icky" face. This show is serious about the food, the way it should be, but there was no electricity, excitement. If this turns into a regular series, I'm sure these issues will be addressed and fine-tuned.

Do we need three threads on this, though? Moderator merge power.... activate!

Gifted Gourmet · April 24, 2004

In my heart of hearts I know Tony Bourdain would have given it the zing and wit it needed .. too bad he didn't want to be one of the judges :rolleyes:

which he had mentioned here at eG some time back ... mores the pity ... :hmmm:

tommy · April 24, 2004

it should be live with interactive commentary from people on egullet. that would help alton a bit with the give-and-take.

Mabelline · April 24, 2004

#1.Still drooling over the kitchen.

#2. They fell down on the job---there was no RoccoWare in sight! :biggrin:

#3. I saw a glimpse of our very own Chris in his colorful shirt, on the first show. :smile:

And, #4, I still think I saw some big-assed eggs (and that's big)!! :laugh:

It was way cooler than the Shatner one. But remember, the viewer panel walked it away for Sakai. If it had been in Japan, he'd have won, as well.

And lordy I have not seen such pretty scallops for way TOO long.

Edited April 24, 2004 by Mabelline (log)

hannnah · April 24, 2004

I really got the feeling that Alton Brown hasn't watched a lot of the Japanese episodes. It only takes seeing 2 or 3 Sakai battles to know that when he pulls out the ring molds, it's going to be one of those little layered things, not "some kind of custard." Also, Brown could have laid off the "ewww, fish ice cream" stuff - that should be no real surprise either, particularly since there was some kind of ice-cream-made-out-of-weird-stuff every other Japanese episode. One of them even did the fish ice cream with fish skin crunchy once.

Overall, I think they're on the right track; it just needs some work - for instance, if they do it again I bet they'll pick the best of this round of judges, rather than the random assortment of people who were willing they had for this one. It's definitely better than the Shatner version, either way.

Tim D · April 24, 2004

Even though it defintely needs improvement and the end result was strange to say the least. I am hopeful that it will become something worth watching. It was head and shoulders above the other American IC's and the now infamous Morimoto vs. Flay battle.

Alton was fine, but he must have a foil to his banter, otherwise it becomes overly simplistic.

Is it possible that Sakai was short a dish and couldn't have beaten Flay because of that handicap? I am not 100% sure but I thought that Sakai only had four plates, so his score couldn't add up to victory. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

ExtraMSG · April 24, 2004

I think it's good that AB added judgments about the food. They always did on ICJ. It adds character. btw, didn't Sakai do a custard? I thought it was something they might have added in post from AB.

mrbigjas · April 24, 2004

I thought it was a lot of fun, even with all the issues mentioned so far. And despite my long-time dislike of Bobby Flay, his dishes looked really freakin tasty. I'm gonna give Flay-bashing a pass for a little while.

hjshorter · April 24, 2004

I also think that Alton did an outstanding job, but could use a guest sidekick.
but, hopefully, not the hapless oriental lady he often picks upon mercilessly at his local, Atlanta Bed Bath and Beyond!

Huh. "W" never struck me as hapless.

I saw parts of the show - ( the chairman's intro, Alton talking to Morimoto before the show, etc.) but didn't end up watching the whole thing. Part of the original's interest, for me, was cultural and there was none of that here. ICJ seems to have more tension; I was absorbed enough to want to see the winner. It's still head and should above that dreadful Shatner version. Holy cow that was awful.

I agree with those that think Alton needs a foil - hey, maybe Rooney needs a job! :raz:

Rachel Perlow · April 25, 2004

I think they just need to sit Alton with the judges so that they can ask him questions or as two of the three judges were obviously knowledgeable about food, they could have a discussion.

I think that they should have made Alton sit down and watch a season's worth of ICJ, it was completely rediculous that he was totally surprised by the fish ice cream. Most of the people watching this are already IC fans, so he looks doubly foolish.

I think Fat Guy needs to be a judge. Here's his intro: "Co-Founder of the internet's largest food discussion website, where he is known as Fat Guy, former lawyer, turned food writer and Elle columnist, Steven Shaw!" Sounds just as qualified as the Bon Appetite editor, and that "TV Personality" whose name I can't recall.

As for the final results of the show, the only part of the score that surprised me was that Sakai got fewer points for presentation, his presentation was much nicer. I was not impressed with Flay's overflowing coconut reasoning -- I thought it just looked sloppy. What works for a clear liquor does not necessarily work for coconut fish soup. I thought what he might have done was pour boiling hot water over the spices in the service plate for a Trio like aroma element.

Someone else mentioned the judges might have not cared for the unusual Japanese tastes in Sakai's food: remember that frequently in ICJ it is pointed out how the chef's would do research into the judge's tastes. I think that Sakai did not do his homework. He prepared dishes just as he would for ICJ and did not take American judges into account. (Caveat: I was booing the screen when Flay was introduced.)

This one has substance and drama (the unveiling of those flopping trout, the fact that PETA is probably pissed at watching Flay throw one around and then dispatch its head with a cleaver, was fun). It just needs a little more time to come into its own and be tweaked a little, I think.

Yeah, I expected a "animals were killed in the making of this production" card during the credits! They did cut to a wide shot away from the fish decapitation just as the cleaver was coming down, though.

I agree with those that think Alton needs a foil - hey, maybe Rooney needs a job!

That's it! Rooney should be the floor reporter!

bpearis · April 25, 2004

Maybe I'm just getting used to the ICA format, but episode 2 (batali vs. morimoto) already seems better. more interaction between alton and the floor guy (who still seems clueless).

Singapore · April 25, 2004

Maybe I'm just getting used to the ICA format, but episode 2 (batali vs. morimoto) already seems better. more interaction between alton and the floor guy (who still seems clueless).

I agree with you, but I will say that the floor guy seemed to be a lot more active than in the first battle.

tommy · April 25, 2004

i think a lot of the sterility that we're seeing is due to what someone suggested, and that's that the voiceovers are done after the fact. i hope i'm wrong, or at least i hope it doesn't continue to seem that way to me, but i can't help but think that alton isn't doing this stuff off-the-cuff.

Foodie_Penguin · April 25, 2004

I've seen both episodes so far. I've been disappointed with both.

A spoiler in my TV listings warned of a surprise ending but I couldn't work it out. The Kitchen Stadium needed a live audience during the recording and there was little no chitchat during competition from the judges. There was little entertainment value to the show. That was missing.

As for the food, by the end of cooking time, I was convinced that Sakai would win, based on the presentation and ingredients alone so I was most shocked that Flay won. I guessed 'cos he stuck to familiar cuisine (southwestern) with little innovation, the judges could happily tuck into food not dissimilar to what is found in his restaurants (just a guess).

Also, what's the fixation with seafood? Both battles have beem with seafood. Is a fish produce a major sponsor of the mini-series?

The reporter in the kitchen is pretty useless and I'm disappointed that Alton has honed his Japanese language pronounciation.

Overall, the entertainment and humur in ICJ is missing. The American version is quite sanitized. Maybe the aim is to have IC appeal to a wider audience.

Foodie Penguin

tommy · April 25, 2004

Maybe the aim is to have IC appeal to a wider audience.

i'm no TV mogul, but i'm going to have to go ahead and guess that you're probably on to something there.

TrishCT · April 25, 2004

Monday morning, it will all be a little clearer....I hope.

ferdlisky · April 25, 2004

Maybe I'm just getting used to the ICA format, but episode 2 (batali vs. morimoto) already seems better. more interaction between alton and the floor guy (who still seems clueless).

Chris Cognac, correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't the Morimoto/Batali episode filmed first, Sakai/Flay second, and Puck last? But that said, I just watched the first two and was really disappointed in the floor guy. More commentary would have been great. However, I think Alton did a very good job.

mongo_jones · April 25, 2004

sakai wuz robbed. morimoto wasn't--did anyone catch how he thought he had won for a split second when the new chairman said "chef m.." only to finish with a "ario"?

so, is this going to be a series? this wasn't just a one-off special event? if so, i have to say food network is being very restrained about not telling us where the new show's regular slot is going to be.

if it is going to be a series they need to make some improvements. i agree with most of what people have said here: better floor reporter, more alton interaction, no more canned coconut milk--especially when you have real coconuts in the kitchen (and someone needs to tell alton the difference between coconut milk and coconut water).

they also need much better judges. the chef guy is okay (though i think he might be a little too diffident--possibly a little awed by chefs with higher wattage? where is his restaurant and what is his cache? ), but everybody else has sucked so far. no more j. peterman from seinfeld or cast-members from the show du jour. there should be at least 2 people who know about food. but, on the other hand, we should be glad that rachel ray is not the designated giggler. the show also needs a little more over the top pomp--i miss the swelling music, the chairman's mid 15th century fashion sense, the operatic biographies.

but, on the whole, i liked it.

were tonight's shows just a repeat of friday's? or did i miss a couple of battles?

FistFullaRoux · April 25, 2004

I'm surprised you didn't mention the producer-lady in the "making of". A culinary hottie.
Me too! and I am a practicing (still perfecting though!) card-carrying heterosexual!
She seemed very knowledgeable and she should have been more prominently featured even!

She should have been on the mike with AB. She knows her stuff, she was the one feeding AB the info. Put the dorky floor walking guy at the desk with AB, and make her the floor reporter. It's essentially what she was doing anyway, but off camera.

bpearis · April 25, 2004

i think a lot of the sterility that we're seeing is due to what someone suggested, and that's that the voiceovers are done after the fact. i hope i'm wrong, or at least i hope it doesn't continue to seem that way to me, but i can't help but think that alton isn't doing this stuff off-the-cuff.

tommy, you're right. i'd say half of alton's commentary was done in post. you can just tell by the way it sounds. iron chef japan seemed like it was made like a sporting event -- edited on the fly. this iron chef is edited like a reality series, after the fact, creating drama where it doesn't exist with narration to fill in the gaps.

personally, i thought j. peterman was among the best so far. he obviously likes food and is at least somewhat eloquent. the o.c. chick (and i LOVE the o.c.) started every comment with "wow, i've never had INGREDIENT before..."

Edited April 25, 2004 by bpearis (log)

lala · April 25, 2004

Wasn't that chef/judge guy on a ICJ episode? I seem to remember him totally flopping... he has some restaurant in Vegas, and seems to be a real wanna-be.

They need better judges, and they should be the ones asking semi-informed questions, not the floor guy who misidentified every single foodstuff that he described. Without an audiance, it just seemed sterile, as everyone has said. A few times Morimoto did some mugging for the audiance, but the audiance wasn't there.

One thing that I don't remember seeing on either version is how the Chefs decide what to make - they all just sprint off and start chopping. I'd love to see the huddle and strategizing at the beginning.

So far the secret ingredient has been something live that must be killed. Is this a trend for this series?

SteveW · April 25, 2004

Wasn't that chef/judge guy on a ICJ episode? I seem to remember him totally flopping... he has some restaurant in Vegas, and seems to be a real wanna-be.

You must be talking about chef Kerry Simon. He was a challenger on the ill-fated UPN Iron Chef USA. I've videotaped the Iron Chef America episodes(including the preview show), but haven't watched it yet.

-Steve

ExtraMSG · April 25, 2004

Maybe I'm just getting used to the ICA format, but episode 2 (batali vs. morimoto) already seems better. more interaction between alton and the floor guy (who still seems clueless).
I agree with you, but I will say that the floor guy seemed to be a lot more active than in the first battle.

I thought that AB and the Floor Guy did a much better job in the second episode. That'd be interesting if it was actually the first episode filmed.

The judges still were rather useless. Occasionally they say something interesting, but I also get the feeling that the editors need to let them speak a little more. The editors treat them like sources for pull-out quotes for a movie commercial: "It's greeeeat!" -- J Peterman, actor with really cool voice. Let them give a full description of why they like it. I swear they cut them off in mid sentence a couple times.

I also think it would be nice if they added some intros to the chefs and ingredients in post. That's a nice thing about ICJ. I wanted to know more about those trout, eg. Tell me what makes spiny lobster special. Etc.

Helena Robinson · April 25, 2004

tommy, you're right. i'd say half of alton's commentary was done in post. you can just tell by the way it sounds. iron chef japan seemed like it was made like a sporting event -- edited on the fly. this iron chef is edited like a reality series, after the fact, creating drama where it doesn't exist with narration to fill in the gaps.

One reason for ICJ sounding "like a sporting event" may be because the announcer's "day job" was/is sportscaster.

In a book I read about the original show, the sportscaster/announcer said his approach was to call the matches like car racing events. NASCAR, anyone? (Perish the thought!)

TrishCT · April 25, 2004

Maybe I'm just getting used to the ICA format, but episode 2 (batali vs. morimoto) already seems better. more interaction between alton and the floor guy (who still seems clueless).
Chris Cognac, correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't the Morimoto/Batali episode filmed first, Sakai/Flay second, and Puck last? But that said, I just watched the first two and was really disappointed in the floor guy. More commentary would have been great. However, I think Alton did a very good job.

You are correct, Batali v. Morimoto was filmed first, then Sakai v. Flay. For some reason they decided to switch the order for viewing.