Bar Etiquette Question

[tryska]

if a regular comes into your bar and asks you to make him a drink, and make it really strong - do you feel this is an insult to your bartending abilities?

Edited December 12, 2003 by tryska (log)

[Busboy]

Do they always do this? Or did they just have a bad day?

[tryska]

they never do that - it was a bad day.

[Squeat Mungry]

I take it this was a mixed drink? Is it their usual? Doesn't sound too different from asking for a double.

[tryska]

well let me explain - a friend of mine was asking me if i knew and it has actually happened to me before too.

my friend had a stressful day at work, went to his usual place to get a drink, asked for his usual (rum and coke, twist of lime), and asked that he make it strong - the bartender was like - "don't you think i know how to make a drink?"

my friend was a bit taken aback.

the time it happened to me, i was at my usual place and with a bartender, who, while not my favorite, was one i've ordered drinks from before on several occassions. I had just been laid off that day, and when i asked for my drink (stoli raspberry and sprite), i asked him to make it as strong as he possibly could - he said to me " i know how to make drinks - this is my profession, you know." well he gave it to me, and i paid him and left my customary tip - at this place the drinks were $6.50 - i left him $2.50.

well a few hours later my favorite bartender was there - and he asked me how i was and i told him i'd gotten laid off and wasn't happy. he immediately gave me one on the house and it was a double, with some sympathy and an offer to come work with him. I gave him $5 bucks.

the first bartender saw this and mentioned that the other bartender got a bigger tip than he did. I didn't mention i got comped - and i'm not sure if my favorite bartender mentioned it to him or not.

so basically 2 different bartenders, similar situations, similar comments. so i have to ask - is it an insult? if so I won't make the mistake again.

Edited December 12, 2003 by tryska (log)

[Squeat Mungry]

Hmmm. Well, I can understand how some bartenders might get defensive, though I don't think I personally would take it as an insult, and I certainly would never snap back at a customer. Also, depending on the bar, the barkeep may be worried about being perceived by management as a "heavy pour" -- not a good thing from management's point of view!

Generally, as a patron, if I think a standard pour is not going to cut it for me for whatever reason, I'll specifically order a double.

Hope that helps.

Cheers,

Squeat

[tommy]

i'd say that any snippy reponse from a bartender is a queue that it's time to find a new bartender.

[tryska]

Generally, as a patron, if I think a standard pour is not going to cut it for me for whatever reason, I'll specifically order a double.

i think i shall do that from now on, instead.

[tryska]

i'd say that any snippy reponse from a bartender is a queue that it's time to find a new bartender.

a queue or a cue?

;-) just messing with ya. i agree tho - i think it's never a good idea to be rude when you work for tips.

[Busboy]

If someone the server knows is that the bar -- and I'm sure anyone who drinks stoly raspberry and sprite sticks in the bartender's mind -- says, "gimme the usual and make it a strong one," that's a cue for the bartender to say "what's wrong" rather than "don't tell me my job." Especially give the way you must have looked after being laid off.

[JPW]

I've got to say, that if it was a customer who was a regular, or even one I recognized, I would have had no problem with the request or a little bit of an extra pour.

ESPECIALLY for one who regularly tips $2.50 a drink.

Most GOOD bar managers expect a certain amount of "spillage" and would not discipline/fire a drink slinger for the occasional comp or extra. Many even encourage a certain level of it. Unless, of course, this is either a) a corporate run bar, or b) in Canada or elsewhere where the laws suck.

[JPW]

well a few hours later ...

my favorite bartender was there - and he asked me how i was and i told him i'd gotten laid off and wasn't happy. he immediately gave me one on the house and it was a double, with some sympathy and an offer to come work with him. I gave him $5 bucks.

after a few hours of stoli+sprite you may only have thought it was comped and you may only have thought it was $5

[tryska]

If someone the server knows is that the bar -- and I'm sure anyone who drinks stoly raspberry and sprite sticks in the bartender's mind -- says, "gimme the usual and make it a strong one," that's a cue for the bartender to say "what's wrong" rather than "don't tell me my job." Especially give the way you must have looked after being laid off.

and having been on the other side of bar (not serving alcohol - it was a juice bar - same basic customer service tho) i agree with you. if it were me - "what's the matter?" would have been the first thing out of my mouth.

just wasn't sure if this was something taught in bartender school or not. cuz i'd never run across that reaction before, and definitely not twice in 6 months.

[tommy]

i'd say that any snippy reponse from a bartender is a queue that it's time to find a new bartender.

a queue or a cue?

;-) just messing with ya. i agree tho - i think it's never a good idea to be rude when you work for tips.

yeah. i looked at it three times and figued "eh, that's close enough". the math dork comes out in me when i least expect it. and least need it.

Edited December 12, 2003 by tommy (log)

[tryska]

well a few hours later ...

my favorite bartender was there - and he asked me how i was and i told him i'd gotten laid off and wasn't happy.  he immediately gave me one on the house and it was a double, with some sympathy and an offer to come work with him.  I gave him $5 bucks.

after a few hours of stoli+sprite you may only have thought it was comped and you may only have thought it was $5

*lol* it was my second drink of the evening! alcohol is not a good friend to me. i'm a nurser and a lightweight. (before anyone thinks i'm a true barfly )

[beans]

A bartender that allows that to translate into a salty "don't tell me how to do my job" is in desperate need of a prescription for an attitude adjustment of say, like manning the service bar on a Monday afternoon shift, or two. As a patron, don't worry about it too much. It's more about them than you. And! Shame on them! Tips are discretionary!!!!!

It is a request, often a direct order, that happens all of the time. Deaf ear and a smile. Patrons always hope for a little extra or 'the hook up.' Where I work there is a fair amount of leeway with "shift leaders" and senior bar staff (somehow I don't like how that last part sounds! ). No one gives away the house, but there is a dance to the whole fostering good will/repeat business. Then there's always that one bad apple that expects it.

So, it all depends. When it is a group of loud, obnoxious young men on the hunt that are constantly dogging each server/bartender for the hook up they get what everyone else receives -- the standard pour. Usually someone from the bar staff will, with much charm, tell them if they want a double, then order one!

If it is a regular that never abuses that sort of deal, well then a treat every now and then, can and may happen.

If I'm behind the bar and someone that walks in with tragic news as a lay-off, I'll buy them the drink. I do that often for a visiting buddy or another in the biz that stop by to have a drink, or two, at my bar. Depending upon management I'll start a tab under my name and pay at the end of the night with management ringing and closing the check.

[meatloaf]

A few things to remember:

Do you ever go to the deli and order;

Give me a pound of shaved roast beef, and make it extra heavy?

does it matter how you word it?

Hey pal, I'm extra hungry, can you shave me some roast beef and make it extra heavy?

If you go back later and your friend is working and he gives you extra and then leaves extra fat on the next one to cover the loss...who has done their job right? Should they be offended?

Maybe if you had prefaced it with being extra hungry and not asked for extra maybe you would have gotten extra from both. Welcome to politics and the concept of graft.

Realize that the vast majority of bar guests try to get a little extra. Whether by asking for it heavy or ordering it in a way they think will baffle or that the barkeep just won't get. My favorite? Can I have a martini on the rocks in a snifter? Hey aren't you gonna fill that up?

The possiblities are endless, maybe the bartender just had ten of those people in a row, and overheard you say you were unemployed. Then wondered why you were ordering drinks and asking for them strong (extra). And pondering why you were spending any money on booze if you couldn't afford it. Why should the barkeep pay? Maybe in getting defensive it was displacement --just what came out instead of directly asking why...

A relationship with a barkeep is a lot like dating, you have to have chemistry or it will seem hollow and mediocre. It requires a little give and take. I never went to bartending school. I don't know any good bartenders that have. But I would say that there be a class for people to order and sit at a bar. Or a decent restaurant for that matter.

Other notes to remember. Leaving a big tip regularly may get you "in" at a place but that isn't necessarily a rule. Some people aren't worth the hassle even if they tip huge.

Going to a place once and judging a barkeep on one visit is silly. Go back a few times, if you click great, if not go someplace where you have a better experience or go to a different bartender. Bartenders are personalities like, say, radio announcers. Would you fire H. Stern for saying please or a normally pleasant one for being short now and then? no Any manager who fires a good bartender for being snippy one time is my cue to get a new manager.

As for the simple answer. Maybe his wife left him or maybe his kid told him "I hate you" right before work. I would say he was, for whatever reason, having a bad day as well and won't remember the incident the next time. Or will and will remember that he could have been more tactful and make up for it next time....

Oh yes please and thank you still go a loooong ways.

out

[tommy]

Then there's always that one bad apple that expects it.

i had the balls to bust the balls of an irish bartender (at an irish bar) that didn't throw me a buy-back. now this was a place that i found myself in several times a week on a good week. the guy damned near threw a pint glass at my head. i took something away from that little exchange.

[fresco]

Then there's always that one bad apple that expects it. 

i had the balls to bust the balls of an irish bartender (at an irish bar) that didn't throw me a buy-back. now this was a place that i found myself in several times a week on a good week. the guy damned near threw a pint glass at my head. i took something away from that little exchange.

This being Canada, it never comes up, because it's illegal for a bar (or a bartender) to give a customer a free drink, or I guess, for that matter, a heavy pour.

[WHT]

if a regular comes into your bar and asks you to make him a drink, and make it really strong - do you feel this is an insult to your bartending abilities?

Yes! Or the person needs help with a drinking problem.

[deibu]

This would never happen here in SC, where all "intoxicating liquors" must be dispensed by the mini-bottle... Drinks are always the same strength no matter what - 1.7 shots per drink. And a double is always two minibottles. Even MADD is lobbying to get rid of this old law...

[Pan]

Even MADD is lobbying to get rid of this old law...

Seriously? If so, what do you think could explain that?

[jsolomon]

I always thought the protocol was to ask "can I have something legal that will take away the pain?"

[JAZ]

A few things to remember:

Do you ever go to the deli and order;

Give me a pound of shaved roast beef, and make it extra heavy?

I don't think your analogy holds at all, at least not for some types of bars (I'm thinking neighborhood bars with lots of regular patrons). A neighborhood bar is not like a deli, period.

And I think it's clear that Tryska knew the bartender(s) fairly well, so it seems it was a regular hangout. In that case, at least at the bars I'm familiar with, it would be perfectly acceptable to make a comment like that. And I think most bartenders who work at such places would understand it for what it was -- bar shorthand for "God, I've had a horrid day; I need a drink and the stronger, the better." Maybe they'd pour heavy, maybe they wouldn't, but they wouldn't get offended.

Realize that the vast majority of bar guests try to get a little extra.  Whether by asking for it heavy or ordering it in a way they think will baffle or that the barkeep just won't get.  My favorite?  Can I have a martini on the rocks in a snifter?  Hey aren't you gonna fill that up?

In my experience, this simply isn't true.

Going to a place once and judging a barkeep on one visit is silly.  Go back a few times, if you click great, if not go someplace where you have a better experience or go to a different bartender. 

Again, I think it's clear that Tryska did not wander into a brand new bar and ask an unknown bartender. Look at the original post, and you'll see the phrases "usual place," favorite bartender," etc. While a request like that isn't appropriate for an unknown place, I think it's a whole different story in one's "usual" place.

[beans]

First, welcome to eG meatloaf.

Okay, overall, I'll have to say 'I hear ya.'

Why should the barkeep pay?

I'd like to address this as I never felt as though I should pay for anyone else's drinks. It is my pleasure to purchase a deserved cocktail for another for the sheer benefit of their smile. I come from a long line of angry and hostile lawyers that sent me packing for a new profession -- and bingo! I found bartending (or rather there are moments I feel like it found me). The customer service of my time spent in retail or food and beverage was purely for the instant gratification. Somehow it has amounted up to some other nice bennies too.

A relationship with a barkeep is a lot like dating, you have to have chemistry or it will seem hollow and mediocre.  It requires a little give and take.  I never went to bartending school.  I don't know any good bartenders that have.

Bartending School? (may cause a new thread ) I certainly did not! Bleh. Food coloured waters and being given a print out of basically our own [my on again/once off again place to work] Drink Recipe book regurgitated and rebound. (Yes, it in fact has happened).

But you are correct with that observation between tender and regular. Excellent analogy. Like many desired relationships, it requires effort and compromise too. I love my local dive we hit after we close, despite the lovely bar god "Mark" didn't previously know how to make a Rusty Nail. It was his attentiveness, even temperment and general positive, cheerfulness that won us over, and much of my own evening's tips transfering into his jar.

Any manager who fires a good bartender for being snippy one time is my cue to get a new manager.

As for the simple answer.  Maybe his wife left him or maybe his kid told him "I hate you" right before work.  I would say he was, for whatever reason, having a bad day as well and won't remember the incident the next time.  Or will and will remember that he could have been more tactful and make up for it next time....

Aw durn. This is where we part meatloaf. I've always been of the philosophy of leaving home at home which is probably why I really dug the Hard Rock training philosophy of each and every time a bartender starts their shift, they are in fact throwing a party. (rather empowering come to think of it) Use that money making opportunity! A tip jar may overfloweth....

Oh yes please and thank you still go a loooong ways.

Always lovely, however not necessary. After all this is the service industry, and coming from both retail management and a law background these social niceties were even *more* rare. The whole concept of being thanked for efforts made to affect an enjoyable evening for another, were heady and profitable.

Glad to see another that works behind the mahogany. I hope you stick around meatloaf and see all of what eG has to offer.