Garlic: Tips and Troubleshooting, Selecting, Storing, Recipes, Safety

[Dave the Cook]

Given the price and the "J&R Music" appellation, I'd bet Cuisinart has discontinued it. Better get yours quick.

[g.johnson]

The OED includes the following definition for plate.

To put on a plate; to serve upon a plate.

They date it from 1970.

[mixmaster b]

WOW.  amazon has the second one for 15 bucks.  i can assure anyone who minces a lot of ginger or lemongrass that this would be the best 15 bucks you'd ever spend.

Tommy-

Does this thing work well on small amounts of stuff? I have always been frustrated using a cuisinart or blender for smallish quantities, because the stuff gets flung up on the sides of the bowl and doesn't pulverize properly.

I am currently in a get-rid-of-extra-gadgets mode, but if this device works, it would be worthwhile to keep around, if only for making Thai style curry pastes.

Also, does it chop the garlic into pieces or pulverize it into paste?

Thanks!!!

[tommy]

Tommy-

Does this thing work well on small amounts of stuff?  I have always been frustrated using a cuisinart or blender for smallish quantities, because the stuff gets flung up on the sides of the bowl and doesn't pulverize properly.

absolutely. it does things even a small food processor can't.

you can avoid paste if you don't pulse for long. or you can make paste if you do pulse for long.

[Dave the Cook]

BTW, where is this recipe that gives me an excuse to use a half-cup of chopped garlic?

[project]

  Suzanne F:

 

  A French apple tart with cinnamon ice cream, caramel

  sauce and mint oil -- sounds good except possibly

  for the mint oil!

 

  Most fields bring in lots of jargon. Reasons

  include (1) creating an 'in' group, (2) building

  barriers to entry, and (3) getting shorter

  descriptions of concepts common in the field but not

  elsewhere.

 

  Worse than "plate the dish" and "give it a good

  chop" are abbreviations such as IP which might mean

  "internet protocol", "integer programming",

  "interior point" method or "I plate"!

 

  Dave the Cook:

 

  Any noun may be verbed.

 

  Terrific! To verb or not to verb, that's the

  question. Whether to be verbed by others and, then,

  to react by verbing them -- or some such nonsense.

 

  g.johnson:

 

  Thanks for the OED (Oxford English Dictionary?)

  refutation of my objections about 'verbing' the noun

  plate. I have to defer to the English because they

  are so good with our language, almost as if they

  invented it!

[project]

  Dave the Cook:

 

  BTW, where is this recipe that gives me an

  excuse to use a half-cup of chopped garlic?

 

  Well, it was in the topic on good things learned on

  eGullet. There I learned about

 

  Gray Kunz and Peter Kaminsky, 'The Elements of

  Taste', ISBN 0-316-60874-2, Little, Brown and

  Company, Boston, 2001.

 

  and there learned that to make food taste good, need

  enough of salt, sugar, acid, and pepper or forget it

  (down the drain).

 

  Below is the recipe as I currently do it. For the

  sake of definiteness and precision, I include some

  brand names of ingredients I have been using, but I

  have no financial interest in any of the vendors.

 

  For the meat, I buy a whole pork loin in Cryovac at

  Sam's Club. I get a piece of about 8 pounds and cut

  with plane of knife perpendicular to the long axis

  of the hog and get four pieces of about 2 pounds

  each. Each piece is about 6" long with a roughly

  oval cross section. I cook one of the pieces and,

  for each of the other three, place it in a labeled 1

  gallon freezer bag and freeze it.

 

  Pork Loin with Broccoli in

  Spicy Orange Sauce

 

  Pork

 

  1 1/2 pounds of bite sized slices,

  1/16" to 3/16" thick, about 1"

  by 1.5", of trimmed fresh pork

  loin

 

  Spices

 

  1/2 C minced fresh garlic

 

  3 T Tone's (Sam's Club) crushed red

  pepper flakes (4 T is a bit too

  much)

 

  Stir-Fry Sauce

 

  1/2 C Chinese Pearl River Dark Soy

  Sauce

 

  1/3 C dry sherry wine

 

  1/3 C Heinz distilled vinegar

 

  1/4 C sugar

 

  orange juice to make 2 C

 

  1 T sesame oil

 

  2 T grated fresh frozen peeled ginger

 

  2 T of orange peel-sugar mixture

  (made from 1/4 C of grated

  orange peel from Valencia

  oranges mixed with 1/2 C sugar).

  Might try orange marmalade as a

  substitute.

 

  In a 2 cup glass measure, combine first

  four ingredients. Add orange juice to

  make 2 C. Add sesame oil, ginger, and

  orange peel mixture. Stir to dissolve

  sugar.

 

  Corn Starch Mixture

 

  3 T corn starch

 

  3 T water

 

  Combine in a small bowl with a small spoon

  for stirring.

 

  Vegetables

 

  13 ounces of fresh broccoli flowers,

  washed, drained, broken into

  bite sized pieces. A good

  substitute is 13 ounces of

  frozen fresh whole green beans.

  Broccoli I have used is from the

  bags of fresh broccoli flowers

  by Foxy at Sam's Club. The

  green beans I've used are

  Hanover The Gold Line Petite

  Whole Green Beans (loose and

  frozen in a bag) at Wal-Mart.

 

  5 ounces of slices of fresh carrots

 

  8 ounces of slices of fresh yellow

  globe onions

 

  Cooking Oil

 

  1/4 C Wesson Canola oil

 

  Technique

 

  If pork loin is frozen, then defrost in

  microwave 10 minutes at 10% power, rotate,

  repeat.

 

  For garlic, it is convenient to start with

  a bottle of fresh peeled whole garlic

  cloves (Spice World, at Sam's Club).

  Since the root ends may be bitter, for

  each garlic clove, trim off and discard

  its root end. Mince the garlic in nut

  chopper.

 

  In 5 quart Farberware pot, bring to boil

  two quarts of water. Add pork, separate,

  and cook until surfaces change from pink

  to white. Dump into colander set over a

  bowl. Pork will throw off 'scum'; rinse

  scum from pot.

 

  Add oil to pot and heat. Add onions and

  carrots and cook with constant stirring

  until the pieces are all hot, a little

  cooking has started, and the oil has

  gotten some flavor. Add the garlic and

  hot pepper flakes, get wet with the oil,

  heat with constant stirring until fragrant

  and without drying or browning.

 

  All at once add the stir-fry sauce. Use

  the stir-fry sauce to stop the cooking of

  the garlic, pepper, etc.

 

  Stir corn starch mixture.

 

  Working quickly to avoid overcooking the

  solids, add the poached drained pork. If

  using green beans, add those. Bring to

  boil with stirring to get all solids hot

  and coated. If using broccoli, add it,

  bring to boil, and stir but don't try to

  'cook' the broccoli -- it will get cooked

  enough.

 

  Stir corn starch mixture and add in a

  stream over much of the pot contents.

  With constant stirring, bring to a boil

  (which will be enough cooking for the

  broccoli), let the sauce thicken and coat

  the food, and remove pot from heat. Done.

  Sauce should be dark, glossy, and fairly

  thick with about half of the sauce coating

  the food solids.

 

  Tasting

 

  The flavor noticed first is the bitter

  orange peel. Next is the orange flavor of

  the peel and the orange juice. All the

  other flavors are supporting except the

  hot pepper which lasts.

 

  There is a lot of sugar, but (1) the

  proportion of sugar in the stir-fry sauce

  is comparable with what is common in

  Chinese cooking, (2) Kunz does mention

  sugar, and (3) the sugar may help balance

  the hot pepper and counteract the bitter

  orange. Further, as we know from BBQ,

  sugar and pork go well together.

 

[project]

  Dave the Cook:

 

  More on the recipe:

 

  In Chinese stir-fry, supposed to plan the shapes of

  the ingredients. Okay, the theme I am using is flat

  rectangular pieces for the pork, onions, and

  carrots. The broccoli or green beans are in

  'contrast'.

 

  To get roughly flat rectangular pieces of yellow

  globe onion, I start with a large onion, call the

  root end the south pole, cut through the Arctic

  circle and the Antarctic circle, discard the two

  pole pieces, cut the through the equator, and, for

  each resulting half, make a shallow cut along a line

  of longitude and peel the half. Then I cut a few

  layers deep along lines of longitude and separate

  the pieces between the layers. The main tool used

  is just an old

 

  Veritable Breswick

  Sabatier Paris - France

  Chef au Ritz

 

  carbon steel chef's knife with a blade about 10"

  long and a plastic cutting board.

 

  For the carrots, I start with relatively large

  carrots, peel them, and slice them with, for each

  carrot, the plane of the knife perpendicular to the

  long axis of the carrot to form truncated cones with

  altitude about 1.5". Then I get out two small

  wooden boards (redwood, hope it's not toxic) and,

  for each carrot piece, hold it between the two

  boards and make several parallel equally spaced cuts

  with the plane of the chef's knife parallel to the

  long axis of the carrot. The result is flat

  rectangular pieces maybe 1/8" thick and about 1.5"

  long. For large quantities, a mandolin cutter would

  work better for the last cutting operation, the one

  exploiting the two boards.

 

  To cut the pork into pieces something like the

  onions and carrots, I start with a 2 pound piece of

  pork loin as described in post above. The piece

  will be about 6" long and have roughly oval cross

  section. I make cuts with the chef's knife parallel

  to the long axis of the backbone of the hog so that

  the resulting pieces have cross section about what I

  want for rectangular pork slices. From each of

  these pieces, I trim and discard the thin layer of

  fat. The result is some pieces, each piece about 6"

  long and with cross section about like the carrot or

  onion pieces, say, 1" by 1.5". Some of these pieces

  have some separate muscles joined with connective

  tissue; for those, I separate at the connective

  tissue, trim it, and discard it.

 

  The only step left is to slice the pieces with the

  plane of the knife perpendicular to the long axis of

  the hog. The dish is supposed to be 'meaty' so I

  don't try to make the slices as thin as most lunch

  meat or cheese slices. Maybe the slices are 1/8"

  thick. I try to work quickly, and I find the

  results okay. In some Chinese cooking, the meat is

  so thoroughly cut and looks so much like the

  vegetables that it is difficult to find in the final

  dish. With my dish, the pieces of meat are shaped

  about like the onion and carrot pieces but still are

  obviously meat.

 

  Nearly everything in the dish is very common in

  China, US, France, and Italy, etc., except for

  sesame oil, ginger, and soy sauce which are widely

  available but more common in China. While I doubt

  that this dish is in the 'style' of any 'school' of

  cooking in China, they have all the ingredients,

  generally are awash in creativity in cooking, in

  principle could cook this dish, but I doubt that

  they would!

 

  However, sometimes I wonder about hogs in China:

  Looking at books on Chinese cooking, it is obvious

  that the hogs there have skin, bellies, ribs, feet,

  cheeks, and front shoulders, but I begin to wonder

  if they have loins and hams? Hmm?

 

  In Sam's Club, ribs with bone in them and a lot of

  fat sell for much more per pound than loins with no

  bones and very little fat. Hmm. I'm leaving the

  ribs to those other guys and going for the whole

  boneless well trimmed loins!

 

  I started the cooking trials using a Chinese round

  bottomed steel wok 14" in diameter with one steel

  handle, outdoors, over a propane burner with 170,000

  BTU/hour of power. Now I am partial to just my old

  5 quart Farberware pot, indoors, on the larger

  burner of my electric stove.

 

  I started out doing a 'stir-fry' using light cooking

  oil. Soon enough I noticed that I used a lot of

  oil, over 1 C per trial although not all of it ended

  up in the final dish and a lot ended up on my

  glasses, in my hair, up in smoke, etc. So, I worked

  to reduce the amount of oil used, and this is the

  reason for poaching the pork slices. I retain some

  oil for cooking the onions and carrots because I

  noticed that the oil gets a LOT of flavor from the

  onions and carrots, and also I want some frying in

  hot oil of the garlic and hot pepper flakes

  (assuming that this frying helps the flavor, but

  have no very good evidence so far).

 

  There is more below:

 

  Notes

 

  This dish looks like a 'stir-fry', but

  there is very little 'frying' here.

 

  If use the green beans mentioned above,

  then cutting them in half would make the

  dish easier to eat.

 

  At times, e.g., when cooking this dish in

  a wok over high heat, have thought that

  getting some of the sauce, after the corn

  starch was in, hot enough to burn,

  'caramelize', a little added some nice

  flavor. The sticky stuff left on the

  cooking spoon is plenty good!

 

  There is a lot of sauce; counting the oil

  and corn starch solution, etc., there is

  nearly 3 C. But this is a big dish, about

  1 3/4 quarts, nearly twice the usual 1

  quart Chinese carry-out volume. With the

  rice to soak up some of the sauce, the

  final dish is not like soup or stew but

  has sauce proportion comparable with many

  Chinese carry-out dishes.

 

  The measurements given were carefully

  made. The volume measurements, e.g., 3 T

  of corn starch, are all level using

  standard measuring cups and spoons. The

  measurements in ounces. e.g., 8 ounces of

  onion pieces, are weights using scales.

  The measurements that are sensitive are

  (1) for the stir-fry sauce and (2) for the

  corn starch mixture. E.g., 2 T of corn

  starch instead of 3 T will yield a thin

  sauce; 4 T of corn starch instead of 3 T

  will yield goo (spicy orange glue).

 

  Here the ginger is just grated frozen --

  freezing is one way to preserve fresh

  ginger. One alternative might be to mince

  unfrozen ginger and heat it in the oil

  with the garlic and hot pepper flakes.

 

  For the ginger, the measurement is with

  the grated ginger packed firmly into the

  measuring spoon.

 

  Starting with frozen pork loin works fine;

  given gentle defrosting, tough to tell

  didn't use fresh pork.

 

  Calories

 

  The pork is beautiful lean pink meat. Raw

  it may be under 30 C per ounce -- assume

  30. So, estimates of the calories are:

 

  720 pork

  625 oil

  256 sugar

  160 soy sauce

  150 corn starch

  116 garlic

  86 onions

  80 sherry

  72 orange juice

  60 carrots

  13 ginger

  -------

  2338 total

 

  Eating

 

  To eat with this, I make rice: In an old

  2 quart Farberware pot, place 1 C long

  grain white rice and 1 3/4 C water. Over

  high heat, bring to gentle boil, reduce

  heat to very low, cover, leave for 20

  minutes, remove from heat. "No, daughter,

  I know you are 'perfect' as your mother

  says, but you don't make 'perfect' rice by

  'simmering and stirring' it."

 

  In a 1 1/2 quart Corning glass bowl, place

  on one side 1/2 the rice and on the other

  side 1/2 the pork dish. Eat.

 

  Refrigerate the rest of the rice and pork

  dish. To eat later, combine in the glass

  bowl, add about 3 T of water, cover, heat

  for 10 minutes at 100% power in microwave.

 

  The rice is about 772 Calories. So, the

  total is 3110 Calories, and half the total

  is 1555 Calories.

 

  Variations

 

  If somewhat less sauce is wanted for rice,

  then there is enough sauce here for at

  least a few more ounces of meat and/or

  vegetables. Even if the total weight of

  meat and vegetables is left the same, the

  proportions could be changed.

 

  Might move to a dish with less emphasis on

  vegetables. So, could cut the pork into

  match sticks -- proceed as above except

  stack the slices and cut once more. Use

  more pork, maybe 3 pounds. Then could

  marinate the pork and coat with a light

  breading as is common in Chinese cooking.

  Get some oil that has cooked sliced

  onions, carrots, ginger, minced garlic,

  and hot pepper flakes and has been

  strained and use that oil to stir-fry the

  pork. Drain the pork then continue with

  the stir-fry sauce but including some of

  the oil. Top with shredded fresh

  scallions.

 

  Once added 1 t of five spice powder, and

  it dominated the dish. But, 1/4 t might

  do some good.

 

  Questions

 

  Q. 1. Got the orange peel from Valencia

  oranges. Did rinse the oranges and

  used only the dark orange and light

  orange parts and none of the white

  parts, but the peel is quite bitter.

  Partly I mixed the sugar with the

  orange peel because grating the peel

  from 4 pounds of oranges took a while

  and I wanted to preserve the peel

  from all that work.

 

  Does the sugar help counteract the

  bitterness?

 

  Do other orange varieties have less

  bitterness or more or better orange

  flavor in their peel?

 

  Q. 2. Is there any hope for five spice

  powder helping this dish? That is,

  perhaps for some reason, five spice

  powder is just incompatible with the

  rest of this dish.

 

  Q. 3. Curiously this dish has no stock or

  broth. Would a good well made fancy

  Chinese stock from chicken and pork

  with scallions and ginger, etc.,

  instead of the orange juice provide a

  better 'base' or 'foundation' for

  these flavors? Or would such a stock

  just confuse the flavors?

 

  Q. 4. Also curiously this dish has no

  fungus, no mushrooms, no wood ears,

  certainly no truffles. Is there a

  way to have fungus help this dish?

  My guess is "No", but I am not sure.

 

  Q. 5. How could molasses be used to help

  this dish? Yes, the 'dark' soy sauce

  may already have some molasses.

[Vanessa]

  For garlic, I start with a one pound jar of fresh

  peeled garlic cloves (Sam's Club).

Does this mean you buy your garlic ready peeled? Or have I misunderstood? Could this have something to do with why your garlic doesn't taste as you would like?

v

[project]

  Vanessa:

 

  Does this mean you buy your garlic ready

  peeled? Or have I misunderstood? Could this

  have something to do with why your garlic

  doesn't taste as you would like?

 

  The garlic is a bottle of fresh cloves, peeled.

  They are not packed in water or oil and are just

  loose. They are fairly perishable, and I suspect

  that they are not cooked or pasteurized. I suspect

  that the peeling is done by soaking the cloves in

  water or some such.

 

  My view is that the cloves are fine, essentially the

  same as get when start with whole bulbs, separate

  the cloves, and peel them.

 

  I have done this dish, and others, starting (1) with

  bulbs of fresh garlic and (2) the fresh peeled

  cloves of this bottled garlic, and I can see no

  difference.

 

  Much of the flavor of garlic is from a reaction

  between two chemicals that are separate until a

  clove is cut or crushed. My understanding is that

  once the reaction starts, the garlic should be used

  quickly -- within minutes.

 

  In the bottled garlic I buy, the cloves are intact

  and the reaction has not started.

 

  I do not like bottled minced garlic; the ones I have

  tried taste stale, like the garlic was minced too

  long ago.

 

  What I object to in both bulbs and whole peeled

  cloves in a bottle is the botanical variety of the

  garlic -- it is too mild. There are stronger

  varieties, e.g., Rocambole.

[awbrig]

and is the taste compromised the longer they are held? Thanks...

[torakris]

Is it better to keep them in the fridge?

I keep mine in a terra cotta container and they seem to last for quite a long time.

Of course garlic never stays very long in my house.

[jhlurie]

Varies with the type of garlic, I think. The "storage" time varies widely.

[Suzanne F]

Don't really know set times for garlic keeping. BUT: if you get green shoots coming out of the ends of the cloves, you've kept it too long.

And like so many other items that "breathe" in storage, garlic keeps better with some exposure to air. That's why the terra cotta thing works well. If you keep it sealed in a plastic bag, the moisture will build up and mold will grow.

[Lesley C]

The problem with the garlic you find in supermarkets sold between December and May (often from China, Argentina or Mexico) is that it’s been stored in refrigerated conditions for up to 8 months before sale. Not only is it far from fresh, but the cool temperatures cause it to dry out, discolor, and lose its potent flavour. It's best to stock up on locally-grown garlic at the peak of the season (September and October here in Canada) and store in a dark place in your kitchen. It should keep well until next summer.

[Aurora]

I keep mine in a hanging wire basket. I have always been under the impression that keeping garlic in the refrigerator accelerated the loss of flavor and made it mushy.

Garlic usually keeps about two months if properly stored. Cloves that I have broken off from the bulb will keep for about one week provided there is enough skin surrounding them.

[Nick]

Good, organically grown garlic bulbs will keep all winter. Store the same as onions and shallots. For some reason, the cloves after being broken off from the bulb won't keep very long.

[by350]

A few questions about garlic:

1. When you buy it...is there a way to tell if one is better than another?

2. Once you break it open and start using cloves...how long does the rest of it last?

3. How powerful is one clove? Are there any guidelines when cooking to know how much to use?

Thanks in advance!

[PCL]

Let's see... welcome to eGullet first of all...

now that's out of the way...

1. Generally I look for plump cloves, clean 'husk', no bruising. You don't want the root ball to be exhibiting signs of wear and deterioration. Like all vegies really, though someone will take me up on that one I'm sure... ok, plant based food product...whatever, it's late here

2. I keep my garlic in a terracotta container with lid. It's porous enough so it breathes, and it's dark so it doesn't start to sprout. Once they sprout, forget it.

3. As to how much to use... well, trial and error, but generally it's got to do with what you're cooking.

Here's my two bits worth. Good luck

[Bicycle Lee]

with garlic, you never want the heads you grab in the store to be soft and squishy in any way. As far as after you open it, I can't really tell ya...cuz at my house the garlic never lasts long enough to go bad...but if it gets soft or brown then it is not good. One way to ensure it's preservation is to roast it. It gives it a new flavor, but it keeps it from going bad...at least for a long time...

[ronnie_suburban]

Check out this current thread...it's full of great info (and links to more great info) on garlic.

Garlic Thread

And welcome!

=R=

[GG Mora]

The head shouldn't give at all when you squeeze it. Firmer garlic = fresher garlic. Run from any garlic showing green sprouts. Fresher garlic seems to be available in smaller markets; farmer's markets are always a good source, as are produce markets and food coops; never buy garlic from Costco and avoid buying it in large chains. Fall is a good time to buy garlic (when it's recently harvested); spring is a time to buy garlic very carefully.

The strength of garlic varies wildly from one variety to the next and depending on freshness (fresher = stronger). Don't bother with elephant garlic unless you're only buying it for display (no discernable garlic flavor*).

This is just personal preference (based on some inherent laziness) but I always look for the head with the big cloves vs. the head with lots of little cloves. Peeling garlic can be a PITA. Bigger cloves = more garlic with less work.

*Since I'm new here, I should warn the community that I tend towards the hyperbolic. Thus, when I say that elephant garlic has no discernable garlic flavor, what I mean is that I've never come across elephant garlic that wasn't exceedingly mild (read: boring).

[specialteach]

After reading this thread I am surprised that no one mentioned roasting garlic. It is simple, delicious and makes your whole kitchen (or apartment if yours is small like mine) smell amazing.

All I do is preheat the oven to 450 and wrap a head of garlic in aluminum foil. Roast in the oven for 35-45 minutes, depending on the size of your garlic. Once it is roasted, squeeze the individual cloves to get to the garlic.

Some variations include cutting off the top part of the garlic head before roasting or rubbing it with olive oil.

My favorite ways to enjoy roasted garlic is spread on a baguette with some soft brie and in mashed potatoes.

[mrbigjas]

OK so last night I made a salad dressing that was basically a vinaigrette with minced garlic & ginger, some miso, light soy and rice vinegar.

Q: is it safe to store in the fridge for a few days, or like raw-garlic-infused-oil is there a botulin risk? I'm thinking the salt in the soy sauce and the acid in the vinegar might make it OK, but I'll toss it if it's not.

Edited February 3, 2004 by mrbigjas (log)

[Kenk]

Your vinaigrette should be fine for a few days.

Botulism develops in an air free environment. Associated with garlic in oil.

The vinegar in the vinaigrette will raise the acidity levels that will resist bacterial growth.

Good question.

----------------------------------

by the way, Why would anyone pump a deadly toxin into their face unless absolutely necessary?(BOTOX)