Ground Bacon/Beef Burger – Tips?

[Tatoosh]

I've started experimenting with a bacon burger recipe.  I cure and smoke my own pork belly bacon and grind the beef, usually a leaner selection.  I've done it twice now and the flavor is exceptional.  Some of the best burger I've had in my 60 plus years.  It is a 60% lean beef and 40% hickory smoked bacon ground and mixed, a bit of pepper and Worcestershire sauce added.  There is some variation but I think it is 70/30 or 75/25 in terms of meat to fat ratio once combined.  But there are a couple of problems.  

1) The patty tends to fall apart. The burger patty does not have the cohesion a normal burger does.  

 

2) If I cook the to medium well done - due to the bacon - it tends to be a dry.  If I back off the temp, it is a bit pink in the interior and I worry about that.  With ground beef that would be no problem. But with ground bacon as a significant percentage of the patty, I do.  We are currently cooking it on a griddle, with water and cover.  

 

Problem #1 puzzles me and i'm not sure how to remedy it.  Bread crumbs?  I don't want to make meatloaf, so I tend to shy away from that.  I could compress the burger more but I don't want to produce a hockey puck.   

Problem #2 is a temperature thing, so I am guessing I need to be in the 165F/170F area through the burger.  Current burger patties are 5 ounces and are thicker so making them thinner might help.  I will play with that, but I'm looking for a consensus on what temp I should be aiming for in terms of safety.  I serve these to a wide range of folks, many of them in the over 65 (so in the "at risk" category) so I want to keep things safe.

 

 

Note:  I make my own cure mixture, dry cure the pork belly for 7 days, do a warm smoke (charcoal and hickory), and finish it in an oven to an internal temp of 150F before chilling to slice or grind it.  

[CatPoet]

I use  egg and breadcrumbs in my bacon burgers, and no they dont become  meatloaf since I have less breadcrumbs in this then in a meatloaf.  They tend to be pinkish even when done to safe eating temperature due to the bacon.  Now I dont remember the  temperature of hand, I use instant  thermometer who has set temp for ground meat.

Edited August 15, 2014 by CatPoet (log)

[FeChef]

How are you cooking these? I shape the patties and freeze them. Once frozen i sous vide them at 140F for 2 hours. There is barely any shrinkage and the patties are firm and can be quickly charred on the grill. By far the best method for perfect burgers.

[Chris Hennes]

I don't know how you make your bacon, but if it's basically already cooked via hot-smoking I don't know why you'd need to get the temp up to 165°F. When I've made these I simply cooked them to medium rare and didn't worry about it. Obviously that doesn't mean it's perfectly safe to do so, but it's a data point anyway.

[Tatoosh]

CatPoet, thanks for sharing that.  I may give it a try as I do want a consistent product that hangs together well.  Do you have an amount you use per pound or kilo?  

FeChef, I"ve been freezing them for storage, but thawing and cooking on a griddle with a dome to hold the steam from a healthy splash of water.  Flip and and second splash of water.  Then top with cheese, etc etc etc.  I do have a sous vide setup so I can try the 140F or whatever temp produces the best result in terms of taste and appearance.  

Manager, I'm not sure about the meaning of "just a data point"?  I do my bacon with a dry cure of Prague Powder #`1/Pink Salt #1 - along with salt and sugar proportioned.  Original cure recipe was derived from Charcuterie (Ruhlmand & Polcyn, 2005) and a couple of other sources.  I cure for a week at 40F, rinse off, soak to remove some of the saltiness,  and then warm smoke over charcoal and hickory for 2 hours.  I finish in an oven to 150F internal so we can capture the bacon grease for other uses.  

I serve this to a wide range of folks, but a significant portion are in the older "at risk" population so I want to be sure that I keep it safe. The pink color is a no go due to cultural and culinary history where I am.  I need to serve the burgers with at least a brownish interior.  I can probably count on one hand the number of folks that would belly up to a medium rare anything here.  (Note: I am currently outside the States and in SE Asia)  

I am so pleased with the flavor of this burger.  I will keep at it until I find that balance of presentation and flavor.  Thanks everyone.

I've been doing some research courtesy of Google.  Food safety org recommends a 155F for ground meats and I think that may address the cultural issue with pink meat at the same time. I will try setting up to sous vide at 145F and then at 155F to compare the outcome of the two burgers for appearance and flavor. FoodSafety.org Handout

A question for the grinding.  I generally grind the meat once and I may try grinding it twice for finer result and better integration of the mix.  Do you grind for medium mix (larger discernible pieces) or finer mix (a more consistent appearance throughout)?      

Edited August 15, 2014 by Tatoosh (log)

[FeChef]

 The pink color is a no go due to cultural and culinary history where I am.  I need to serve the burgers with at least a brownish interior.

 

If you do decide to try the sous vide method, you might want to try 145F instead of 140F if you dont want any pink. I might even go 147F just to be safe. This may or may not affect shrinkage though.

[Tatoosh]

Thanks FeChef, that makes sense.  I will try some of the patties I already have made with this approach.  I'll start with the 145F and see how the appearance comes out.  

[Shalmanese]

If you want better cohesion, salt the meat ahead of time, let them rest, then mix into patties. The salt will draw out the myosin and form more of a sausage like texture. Experiment to see where you prefer on the crumbly/sausage texture spectrum.

[CatPoet]

1 kilo  ground meat

300 gram coked riced potatoes

250 ml water, milk or beer.

2 eggs 

 

 

or

 

1 kilo ground meat

100 ml  bone dry  breadcrumbs or unflavoured rusk

200 ml water, milk or beer.

2 eggs. 

 

I have two version due to friends with gluten intolerance. This seams to work for me.  But the problem is the curing salts often dyes the rest of the meat pinkish, you would have to use soy or  brown food colouring to avoid this.

[Tatoosh]

Shalmanese - Thank you, I will give a bit of salt a try the next time we grind bacon and beef.  I had stayed away from adding salt because I'd read it could cause the meat to lose structure.  But falling apart while cooking is unacceptable and a finer texture is a trade I'd make as long as I end up with a decent burger.  In fact, one of the criticisms of my first attempt at grinding the bacon/beef burger was the need for a bit more salt.  

CatPoet - I appreciate very much your sharing the ratios with me.  We will try the dry crumbs first - 100 mg per kilo of ground meat.  I will run a number of test batches next month when we do process meat again. We only have lager beers here - there is a dark lager, Cerveza Negra that I will give a try.   

[CatPoet]

Tatoosh: We use a type of  breadcrumbs that been dried out in the oven until brick hard and then finely milled. Those are the ones I prefer to use.

[Tatoosh]

CatPoet - I was planning on drying out in the oven and grinding some white bread.  The potato version is appealing too but I do prefer them as a side dish, to be honest.  Thanks for the heads up on the bread crumbs.  

[CatPoet]

Well the potato version is used when we have gluten intolerant friends over   otherwise I use fine milled breadcrumbs.

[Tatoosh]

CatPoet, that is what I figured regarding the potatoes.  So far i have seen people talking about gluten free here but rarely asking for or requiring it.  I'n sure it is more of a concern elsewhere.  So while I will try a couple of variations during our next grind, I've settled on 1) a double grind for finer texture, 2) your egg/bread crumb mix 3) more salt during the mixing.

For the temperature question as it relates to appearance, I am thinning the patties out for simpler cooking through out. I will try a sous vide setup soon as well. I will shoot for a 145F to 150F internal (when on the griddle without sous vide) and the 145F to 147F when I try the sous vide approach.  These are close to the finishing temps when I make my bacon.  And of course, even when heat finished, bacon requires more cooking before consumption, none of us are pulling bacon out of the fridge and eating it straight, though we might do that with a hotdog which is usually finished to the same temperature range. (Okay, we might have done it with the hotdog when we were a kid, if not now.)

[Tri2Cook]

I'm not a fan of egg and bread crumbs in burgers but I'm interested in hearing what you think of it once you try it. 

I think the problem you're having is largely related to the bacon being cooked going in. 40% of your mix is pre-cooked and cooked meat just doesn't bind to much of anything too well. The raw meat holds things together when you make your patties but there's no real bond and everything goes it's separate way once cooked. Just for comparison, try it once with raw bacon and I think you'll be pleasantly surprised how well things hold together. Sufficient additional binders (eggs, etc.) will help but I think you'll be happier without them.

[c oliver]

A couple of things:

 

o  There is basically no trichina in commercial pork and hasn't been in decades so don't worry about the bacon

 

o  I put my burgers, home ground, on the grill on one of those 'holey' things that you can grill vegetables on.  No problem with them falling through the grates.

 

o  Okay, one more  I use a long turner so I can slide it all the way under and past the burger.  Helps.

[Tatoosh]

c. oliver, good points - but I'm not in the USA.  I am in SE Asia where the food supply is not nearly as strict in terms of regulation or even consideration of the end user.  Charcoal made of treated 2x4's (or their metric equivalent) are not all that uncommon.  Selling of "twice dead" carcasses is illegal but not uncommon with reports of arrests for it in the news occasionally.  Twice dead in this case means the sale of carcasses that died of unexplained causes prior to butchery.  A recent fish kill due to microbe bloom caused a huge influx of tainted fish into the fish markets.  People quit buying because they knew just what was being offered.  When it comes to pork, I don't have the same confidence I would in North American product.  In fact, some carcasses here are from the States, arriving frozen. When I can, I get those.  But they are not always available.  

Since I am cooking on a griddle, the holes or spaces in grates is not a problem.  Their crumbling is due to the lack of cohesion in the ground meat itself.  I think that a finer grind, addition of salt, and the use of egg and fine crumbs may help with this.  I am hoping the crumbs will also help retain some of the juice's flavor too.  

I do need a longer handle turner and tongs as well.  Singeing my arm hair is not an uncommon occurrence when running a hot grill on my Weber kettle.  

[c oliver]

c. oliver, good points - but I'm not in the USA.  I am in SE Asia where the food supply is not nearly as strict in terms of regulation or even consideration of the end user.  Charcoal made of treated 2x4's (or their metric equivalent) are not all that uncommon.  Selling of "twice dead" carcasses is illegal but not uncommon with reports of arrests for it in the news occasionally.  Twice dead in this case means the sale of carcasses that died of unexplained causes prior to butchery.  A recent fish kill due to microbe bloom caused a huge influx of tainted fish into the fish markets.  People quit buying because they knew just what was being offered.  When it comes to pork, I don't have the same confidence I would in North American product.  In fact, some carcasses here are from the States, arriving frozen. When I can, I get those.  But they are not always available.  

Since I am cooking on a griddle, the holes or spaces in grates is not a problem.  Their crumbling is due to the lack of cohesion in the ground meat itself.  I think that a finer grind, addition of salt, and the use of egg and fine crumbs may help with this.  I am hoping the crumbs will also help retain some of the juice's flavor too.  

I do need a longer handle turner and tongs as well.  Singeing my arm hair is not an uncommon occurrence when running a hot grill on my Weber kettle.  

Yikes!  Have you considered becoming a vegetarian?!?!?    I would definitely be cooking meat til it was three times dead!  I'm far from a germophobe but that's beyond my level of acceptability.

 

Regarding "cohesion," do you think your meat is too lean/not enough fat?  I have a couple of times asked the butcher to give me some extra fat to grind into the meat.

 

Actually the turner part itself is longer.  Best of luck and good for you for trying!

[CatPoet]

Tatoosh: One of the villagers and I had talk , he said he used smoked  pork fat for his "bacon" burger and then lean  pork and it gives a lovely bacon flavour and much easier to grill. I think he is on to something, he runs  one of the local restaurants.

[nickrey]

Are you making sure that the meat is well chilled when mincing it? Combined with salt as outlined with Shalmanese above will give a good bond. If the meat is too warm when mincing, you can get the same effect as sausages made too hot: the fat doesn't integrate and runs out when cooked, leaving a dry and chewy product.

[lordratner]

I recommend salting. I don't have the exact amount handy, but I'll look it up at home. Grind, salt, lightly mix to incorporate, then form the patties. After 60 to 90 minutes, cook. I was amazed at how well it works the first time I tried.

[Tatoosh]

c. oliver - Living in SE Asia takes some of the germophobe out of you. to be sure.  But we purchase carefully and I have two brothers-in-law that are meat cutters for retail chains.  I get a bit better info on the good stuff and that has made a difference for us.

CatPoet - that sounds very interesting.  We do have extra fat from cured pork chops occasionally.  But since I make 10 kilos or better of bacon each month, bacon is kind of the resource I have the most of.  I will definitely keep the cured and smoked pork fat for use in the future. 

 

nickrey - We do try to chill our meat before grinding.  I think I need to improve that aspect, to be sure.  But I definitely stay away from grinding warm meat and particularly warm fat.  Currently I only have a Kitchen Aid mixer and its grinding attachment - but that has actually been working quite well for me until my larger grinder is finished.  I do have the Kitchen Aid Pro 600 version that seems to have better power than the smaller units.  

And we do keep a good fat to lean ratio.  I am certain we are at or over the 25/75 ratio and probably closer to 30/70 fat to lean.  

lordratner -  I am going to use some salt to add cohesion today.  I will be fairly light with it due to a number of people do not want a salty product.  My bacon is a bit salty, the way we prefer it but not enough when used in this mix of bacon and beef.  I look forward to hearing your salt ratio per pound.or kilo.  

Thank you all for your input.  I've reground the mixture for a second grind now.  We don't have the opportunity to sous vide this time but I want to do that next time we make this.  We are pairing the burger with Heston style french fries and are hoping for a worthwhile burger and fries combo!  

[Tatoosh]

Just a quick update on our second go.  Wife does not like the breadcrumbs and she thinks it has diminished the bacon flavor substantially.  I'm not sure why this would happen and I dialed the amounts back by at least half, figuring I would edge up on the recommended amounts to see how the burgers taste and consistency developed.  I used dry, freshly made bread crumbs with whole eggs and beer.  Amounts: 200 grams of bread crumbs, 4 eggs, 200 ml of beer in 4 kilos of ground meat.  

 

We did the second grind which made a substantial improvement in consistency.  I added a small amount of salt: 2 tablespoons spread out over the 4 kilos of meat.  Cohesion was substantially improved, the burger was moist and cooked through - 5 ounce burgers about 1/2 to 3/4 inch thick.  

 

Bottom line for me - I need to recapture the big burst of bacon flavor I had before - it was almost like a BBQ going off in your mouth. There is still some bacon flavor but much more subdued.  Get that back and it is a keeper.  The burger was not falling apart in the bun so we are doing something right!

 

French Fries:  Tried to do a Heston style fry - cut, boil to parcook, two trips to the fryer (aka Belgian Fries) and they came out good but not Heston good.  Kind of more like McDonalds good when McDonalds does it right.  Cooked through, crunchy, over all satisfactory but not great.  Room for improvement, as they say. 

Edited August 24, 2014 by Tatoosh (log)

[CatPoet]

Tatoosh maybe the key is the smoked fat?

[Mjx]

Have you tried pre-cooking the bacon before mixing it into the ground beef?

 

Mixing cooked bacon into raw beef may sound daft, but it would remove the moisture (and any pathogens you mighte be worried about) from the equation, giving you intensified flavour, and better control over the outcome, since the bacon would not be undergoing significant further changes as the burger cooks (e.g. giving off water, which may loosen the texture); you could focus entirely on the way the beef cooks, since the bacon would be taken care of.