Sous Vide: Recipes, Techniques & Equipment, 2011

[sahmd]

How long are you willing to let the water stay in your SV while heated? In theory, SV water should be hot enough that normal germs aren't going to grow in it (I think). Plus, you've got the bag as a barrier between your food and the water. That suggests to me that leaving the water under heat in the SV container for 2-5 days between rounds of cooking shouldn't be a problem. But maybe I'm missing something.

From a convenience standpoint, I like the idea of having it hot and ready. Emptying the container, washing it, refilling it, and reheating it is a pain. The cost of keeping it hot at a safe temp (say 150F) in the set up I use (which is well insulated) is minimal - about 10 cents a day.

I admit to being anal but since the water often smells after I have cooked something in it, despite the vacuum bags, I am not willing to let it sit for days at any temperature. If I empty it immediately and dry it out and refill with hot tap water next time I want to use it, I don't find it takes more than 15 minutes to reach temperature. Your mileage may vary but I think there are enough risky things with SV that this is not something I am willing to compromise on.

I never noticed any smell in the water bath, and I see no problem changing the water only every now and then. I use distilled water (i.e. the condensed water from the air dehumidifier in the cellar), thus avoiding limescale as well as growth of most bacteria. Every 48h/55°C cooking should theoretically reduce eventual pathogenic bacteria by something like 150D. For additional safety, the water could be heated to e.g. 80°C for an hour between rounds of cooking.

For those of you SVM/FMM users who DON'T dump the water in between each use, do you just leave the FMM heating element in the bath as well, or pull it out and let it dry in between? It's so convenient to just be able to flick a switch and have the water ready to use in a few minutes, but I don't want to damage the hardware. Thanks.

[PedroG]

My FMM is in the water 365d/y without any problem.

[jmolinari]

24hrs at 132 for a sirloin tip roast is too long. Meat turned out mushy.

Will try 12 next time.

[Paul Kierstead]

For those of you SVM/FMM users who DON'T dump the water in between each use, do you just leave the FMM heating element in the bath as well, or pull it out and let it dry in between? It's so convenient to just be able to flick a switch and have the water ready to use in a few minutes, but I don't want to damage the hardware. Thanks.

When I using an aluminum pot, it create problems to leave it in there (pitting in the aluminum). With my cooler, I left it in there all the time (until the valve in the cooler started to fail....). I also left it in stainless steel for a few months...

[paulpegg]

For those of you SVM/FMM users who DON'T dump the water in between each use, do you just leave the FMM heating element in the bath as well, or pull it out and let it dry in between? It's so convenient to just be able to flick a switch and have the water ready to use in a few minutes, but I don't want to damage the hardware. Thanks.

When I using an aluminum pot, it create problems to leave it in there (pitting in the aluminum). With my cooler, I left it in there all the time (until the valve in the cooler started to fail....). I also left it in stainless steel for a few months...

I glued the drain valve on my cooler with waterproof silicon glue and have had no problems. I change the water every few months. I change the water in the stainless steel stock pot about once a month but have never had it discolor or smell so I am just being cautious I guess.

[sahmd]

Excellent - thanks for the responses.

[Robert Jueneman]

I tend to dump tanks, using a gas siphon to drain into the sink, but that is primarily to heat up the tank with water from the hot water heater, rather than putting too much of an electrical load on the system. I've since run a 220 line (really, a double 110 in a so-called Edison circuit) to power two units simultaneously, but I still think it's a good idea to fill the baths with hot water.

If I had access to distilled water, like Pedro does, I might keep them up to temperature all of the time, at least 52C.

[mharpo]

I always dump my water, too, after each use into a large bucket to water plants later. I get 138F out of my tap from a gas water heater, so it is probably more efficient than letting the Sous Vide Pro heat it from room temp.

[Justin Uy]

Not exactly a haute cuisine question here, but a co-worker just posed an interesting question.

A different co-worker's child is selling those buckets of cookie dough as a fundraiser. The dough apparently contains raw eggs, so as much as the first coworker would like to just dig into a bucket of raw cookie dough, food poisoning is a concern for him.

He knows a little about sous vide, and that I've been dabbling lately, so he posed an interesting question to me just now. Would it be possible to seal the tub and drop it in the water bath to pasteurize? I know a raw egg can pasteurize at 57C in about 2 hours. Do you think it would be possible to do the same with dough without affecting the texture?

[rotuts]

i think that whatever fat is in that dough might melt. if its butter, an emulsion of fat and water, it would later separate when it solidifies.

the dough Im guessing would look and feel greasy.

if you like eating cookie dough 'raw' you would have to make your own: SV the eggs until paasturized then make the dough and then eat it.

Edited October 19, 2011 by rotuts (log)

[Mjx]

Not exactly a haute cuisine question here, but a co-worker just posed an interesting question.

A different co-worker's child is selling those buckets of cookie dough as a fundraiser. The dough apparently contains raw eggs, so as much as the first coworker would like to just dig into a bucket of raw cookie dough, food poisoning is a concern for him.

He knows a little about sous vide, and that I've been dabbling lately, so he posed an interesting question to me just now. Would it be possible to seal the tub and drop it in the water bath to pasteurize? I know a raw egg can pasteurize at 57C in about 2 hours. Do you think it would be possible to do the same with dough without affecting the texture?

Unless it's a question of rising to the technical challenge (in which case, I think rotuts has it right), using pasteurized eggs would give more predictable results.

[ScottyBoy]

24hrs at 132 for a sirloin tip roast is too long. Meat turned out mushy.

Will try 12 next time.

I always do 12, perfect.

Actually have 2 Snake River Farms kobe tips in the bath right now, timer goes off in 54 minutes

[jmolinari]

24hrs at 132 for a sirloin tip roast is too long. Meat turned out mushy.

Will try 12 next time.

I always do 12, perfect.

Actually have 2 Snake River Farms kobe tips in the bath right now, timer goes off in 54 minutes

Thanks good to know. It was a good lesson in seeing how a piece of meat wont technically overcook sous vide, it can still change by long cooking to the point where eating it isn't that pleasant. It had a strange texture and almost felt dry, even though it was nicely medium.... Odd, and instructive.

[rotuts]

for Tri-Tip Ive found 15 at 131 works. thats Supermarket Beef not Kobe

and TT are a little tougher than ST's

so 12 sounds right to me too.

[Robert Jueneman]

I do practically no baking, so I can't answer the texture question.

However, the mass of the cookie dough would certainly slow down the heating process. Imagine if you were trying to cook a rib roast of the same size as the tub of dough -- it might well take more than the six hour maximum recommended time (depending on the size and shape of the tub), and therefore wouldn't be safe.

I would offer to pasteurize a couple of dozen eggs for the second coworker, instead.

[Justin Uy]

I do practically no baking, so I can't answer the texture question.

However, the mass of the cookie dough would certainly slow down the heating process. Imagine if you were trying to cook a rib roast of the same size as the tub of dough -- it might well take more than the six hour maximum recommended time (depending on the size and shape of the tub), and therefore wouldn't be safe.

I would offer to pasteurize a couple of dozen eggs for the second coworker, instead.

Thanks for all the responses! That was quick.

It was more of a technical challenge/wondering type of question. I doubt he'll be asking me to pasteurize a bunch of eggs for him to make his own "safe for eating" cookie dough, but definitely good to know.

[jmolinari]

You can buy, at least here in Atlanta, pasteurized eggs. They look and act entirely identical to unpasteurized.

[Robert Jueneman]

You can buy, at least here in Atlanta, pasteurized eggs. They look and act entirely identical to unpasteurized.

Whole Foods generally carries them. I haven't seen them in more conventional grocery stores. But if I needed some, I would do it myself.

[jmolinari]

My publix carries them. I've made them at home following Douglas' formula, but i found that following his there is a small amount of albumin that ends up cooked...whereas the purchased ones are completely indistinguishable.

[Smokalicious]

I tried to research pasteurizing eggs on the web to no avail. The methods used by large processors are closely held & patented trade secrets. That being said, eggs pasteurized using Douglas' method have been perfectly acceptable for every purpose so far, including delicious edible cookie dough.

[jmolinari]

I tried to research pasteurizing eggs on the web to no avail. The methods used by large processors are closely held & patented trade secrets. That being said, eggs pasteurized using Douglas' method have been perfectly acceptable for every purpose so far, including delicious edible cookie dough.

Somethign is either a trade secret or patented...it would be hard to be both since for it to become a patent everything has to be disclosed.

anyhow...the paseurization of shell eggs is readable in patents..i just read one yesterday.

Take a look here:

http://www.google.com/search?q=shell+egg+pasteurization&btnG=Search+Patents&tbm=pts&tbo=1&hl=en

[ScottyBoy]

for Tri-Tip Ive found 15 at 131 works. thats Supermarket Beef not Kobe

This is my tri tip @ 135 for 18 hours. It was for a group that wanted closer to medium. It was cut with a fork tender.

[Smokalicious]

I tried to research pasteurizing eggs on the web to no avail. The methods used by large processors are closely held & patented trade secrets. That being said, eggs pasteurized using Douglas' method have been perfectly acceptable for every purpose so far, including delicious edible cookie dough.

Somethign is either a trade secret or patented...it would be hard to be both since for it to become a patent everything has to be disclosed.

anyhow...the paseurization of shell eggs is readable in patents..i just read one yesterday.

Take a look here:

http://www.google.com/search?q=shell+egg+pasteurization&btnG=Search+Patents&tbm=pts&tbo=1&hl=en

This was over a year ago & I don't recall any Google patent results. At the time, patent results universally required payment to view. In any case, my main point was to emphasize the suitability of eggs pasteurized using Douglas Baldwin's method.

[Todd in Chicago]

ScottyBoy....

That shore looks good! Is that chimichurri? How did you crust it?

I've had SRF at a restaurant here in Chicago before (Bandera) and it was fabulous.

Jealous... ;-)

Todd in Chicago

[ScottyBoy]

Yup good eye chimichurri.

I charred it on a huge bed of smoldering hickory wood chips when it came out of the bath. I find it gets extra smoke flavor without getting too much of the over cooked ring around the outside.