• Welcome to the eG Forums, a service of the eGullet Society for Culinary Arts & Letters. The Society is a 501(c)3 not-for-profit organization dedicated to the advancement of the culinary arts. These advertising-free forums are provided free of charge through donations from Society members. Anyone may read the forums, but to post you must create an account.

Mjx

Advice, Please: Equipment for Modernist Cooking/Primitive Resources

32 posts in this topic

I've been sitting on USD250 of amazon gift certificates for while, debating what to use them for. I was given Modernist Cuisine as a gift for my birthday this year, and despite the fact that USD250 is a tiny amount in the face of the recommended equipment list, I do want some of my purchases to go towards making some of the recipes a possibility.

I have no special equipment, unless you count a scale (a good one) and the Adria spherification kit (also a gift, accompanying Modernist Cuisine).

I've been considering one or two iSi whippers, a couple of Silpats, some silicone moulds, a jeweller's scale, for really small masses of ingredients, Migoya's The Elements of Dessert, and a Thermapen.

I'm most interested in smaller, non-mechanical items, or less-expensive mechanical ones (more expensive items with the potential to conk out, e.g. pressure cookers, I'd rather purchase here, where things come with a two-year money-back guarantee).

At this time, my interests in modernist cooking are focused on appetizers, garnishes, and desserts/sweets; I also have a weakness for gels, and I'd like to experiment a with transglutaminase.

Given my interests and restricted budget, what would those of you who've been working quite a bit with modernist cooking/Modernist Cuisine advise, in terms of crucial pieces of equipment?

Your thoughts/input tremendously appreciated!

Thanks in advance,

M.


Michaela, aka "Mjx"
Manager, eG Forums
mscioscia@egstaff.org

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

From memory you don't have a sv rig, do you? At the very least you want a temperature controller to hook up to a rice cooker or crock pot. Can you buy those locally or, like me, are you pretty much obligated to order online unless you want a restaurant-sized, restaurant-priced piece of kit? Either way, temperature controllers aren't hugely expensive.


Chris Taylor

Host, eG Forums - ctaylor@egstaff.org

 

I've never met an animal I didn't enjoy with salt and pepper.

Melbourne
Harare, Victoria Falls and some places in between

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've got both an iSi soda and cream whipper, and honestly only ever use the creamer. It's got a much wider mouth, which lets me do things like carbonate fruits, easier to clean out with a brush, etc. If I had it to do over again, I'd just get the creamer (they use exactly the same style chargers, btw, so you can just get boxes of both and be fine).

Silpats are great - get at least two. I use them all the time (and even keep them hanging by the oven by a binder clip so they are always handy).

A jewelers scale is a must have, particularly if you are just going to try some of these recipes for 1 or 2 servings. Amazon has several for around $30 that are just fine, and come with some amusing "you may also be interested in" recommendations.

Modernist Pantry has pretty much all the specialty ingredients you will be playing with, and in quantities that are reasonable for experimentation. I mention them because you mentioned being interested in trying transglutaminase. Many enzymes are oxygen labile, and once you open the package, their lifespan quickly winds down, and TG is definitely one of those. They've got it in 50g packages, which is good for about 10-12 lbs of meat. I've found that the 50g packages last about 2 months without noticeable decrease in activity after opening, when kept in the refrigerator with a little oxygen scavenger packet (available at Amazon).

Edit: A minor note - a lot of things are being sold as "modernist" or whatever, and it's just bogus. Even the good guys aren't immune to doing something like selling a $3 julep strainer as a $15 "spherification spoon" or some such nonsense. And there are a lot of circumstances where the low-tech, cheap route is vastly superior to the high-tech, expensive alternatives, like with measuring pH. You can spend hundreds of dollars on a lab-grade pH meter that will still foul up with proteins in relatively short order and fall out of calibration quickly, or you can spend $10 and get a box of test strips that never go bad!


Edited by Dexter (log)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'll second the scale. Being able to measure with 0.1 g or better 0.01 g accuracy is a must. I'd also get the Thermapen - one of the most useful gadgets in my kitchen. As for the ISI whips, one is enough for starting out (I've got two, but I hardly ever use both).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'll second the scale. Being able to measure with 0.1 g or better 0.01 g accuracy is a must.

I'd say the 0.01 accuracy isn't better, it's a must for the majority of the hydrolloids, sequestrants, buffers and stabilizers used in "modernist" cooking.


It's kinda like wrestling a gorilla... you don't stop when you're tired, you stop when the gorilla is tired.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'll second the scale. Being able to measure with 0.1 g or better 0.01 g accuracy is a must.

I'd say the 0.01 accuracy isn't better, it's a must for the majority of the hydrolloids, sequestrants, buffers and stabilizers used in "modernist" cooking.

That depends on the batch size you are making ;-)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

From memory you don't have a sv rig, do you? At the very least you want a temperature controller to hook up to a rice cooker or crock pot. Can you buy those locally or, like me, are you pretty much obligated to order online unless you want a restaurant-sized, restaurant-priced piece of kit? Either way, temperature controllers aren't hugely expensive.

Nope, no sv rig, and no crock pot or rice cooker, either, although I'm lucky in that I travel quite a bit, so if I can't get something reasonable locally, I can usually get it from Germany at a decent price, or pick it up when I'm in the US.

What I didn't mention is that I'm currently using someone else's kitchen, so I'm holding off on larger items for now, since there's no place to store them, and I can't really leave them in the kitchen. I figure that this is a good time to focus on getting my hands on smaller items.

I've got both an iSi soda and cream whipper, and honestly only ever use the creamer. It's got a much wider mouth, which lets me do things like carbonate fruits, easier to clean out with a brush, etc. If I had it to do over again, I'd just get the creamer (they use exactly the same style chargers, btw, so you can just get boxes of both and be fine).

Silpats are great - get at least two. I use them all the time (and even keep them hanging by the oven by a binder clip so they are always handy).

A jewelers scale is a must have, particularly if you are just going to try some of these recipes for 1 or 2 servings. Amazon has several for around $30 that are just fine, and come with some amusing "you may also be interested in" recommendations.

Modernist Pantry has pretty much all the specialty ingredients you will be playing with, and in quantities that are reasonable for experimentation. I mention them because you mentioned being interested in trying transglutaminase. Many enzymes are oxygen labile, and once you open the package, their lifespan quickly winds down, and TG is definitely one of those. They've got it in 50g packages, which is good for about 10-12 lbs of meat. I've found that the 50g packages last about 2 months without noticeable decrease in activity after opening, when kept in the refrigerator with a little oxygen scavenger packet (available at Amazon).

Edit: A minor note - a lot of things are being sold as "modernist" or whatever, and it's just bogus. Even the good guys aren't immune to doing something like selling a $3 julep strainer as a $15 "spherification spoon" or some such nonsense. And there are a lot of circumstances where the low-tech, cheap route is vastly superior to the high-tech, expensive alternatives, like with measuring pH. You can spend hundreds of dollars on a lab-grade pH meter that will still foul up with proteins in relatively short order and fall out of calibration quickly, or you can spend $10 and get a box of test strips that never go bad!

Thanks for the heads up on the pH meter (which I was sort of considering) and the whipper v. creamer!

I have a Jennings CJ 4000 that I'm very happy with it, so I was thinking of getting one of their jeweller's scales, would you happen to know anything about them? I know companies are not necessarily consistent across all their product lines.

Any other measuring devices worth considering?


Michaela, aka "Mjx"
Manager, eG Forums
mscioscia@egstaff.org

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That depends on the batch size you are making ;-)

True.


It's kinda like wrestling a gorilla... you don't stop when you're tired, you stop when the gorilla is tired.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

By far without a doubt in my mind you need a Sous Vide setup if you want to cook out of the Modernist Cuisine. If you skim through the book, you'll realize that most of the recipes use sous vide. As such, I would imagine it would be disappointing to lack that ability. I also strongly feel that of all the new techniques introduced in the book, sous vide has the most dramatic and practical improvements over standard cooking. Since getting into MC and SV, I've mostly been cooking meats in the sous vide for almost any recipe from any source.

The ISI whip is a lot of fun, but definitely secondary to the Sous Vide equipment. Personally, I would go for a pressure cooker before a whipping siphon.

If you're interested in gels then you'll probably need to buy some ingredients. It can be hard to make sense of all the ingredients - a lot of them only work in certain situations, etc. Many are non-substitutable. I've found that I've collected quite the library of these ingredients, but a few important ones that come to my mind with regard to MC are Agar, Xanthan gum, Carageenans, Gellans, Guar Gum, and Locust Bean Gum. There are many many more obviously, but I always seem to be coming back to those ones...


Edited by Baselerd (log)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

By far without a doubt in my mind you need a Sous Vide setup if you want to cook out of the Modernist Cuisine. If you skim through the book, you'll realize that most of the recipes use sous vide. As such, I would imagine it would be disappointing to lack that ability. I also strongly feel that of all the new techniques introduced in the book, sous vide has the most dramatic and practical improvements over standard cooking. Since getting into MC and SV, I've mostly been cooking meats in the sous vide for almost any recipe from any source.

The ISI whip is a lot of fun, but definitely secondary to the Sous Vide equipment. Personally, I would go for a pressure cooker before a whipping siphon.

If you're interested in gels then you'll probably need to buy some ingredients. It can be hard to make sense of all the ingredients - a lot of them only work in certain situations, etc. Many are non-substitutable. I've found that I've collected quite the library of these ingredients, but a few important ones that come to my mind with regard to MC are Agar, Xanthan gum, Carageenans, Gellans, Guar Gum, and Locust Bean Gum. There are many many more obviously, but I always seem to be coming back to those ones...

Not questioning the value of the sv setup (although reading through the books, I'm fairly certain that in a number of instances, other methods would yield at least very similar results), but as I noted in the OP, it's just out of the question, at this time: I've no room to set it up, which is the reason I'm focusing on the smaller items (e.g. measuring devices, tools that produce interesting shapes/textures).

I have some gelling agents (xanthan gum, agar), and I definitely appreciate your short list.


Michaela, aka "Mjx"
Manager, eG Forums
mscioscia@egstaff.org

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The use of moulds appears all over the place in Modernist Cuisine, but their capacity and shape are often unspecified. I'concluded that this means that the volume and shape don't have a significant effect on the result, but are there any shapes/sizes that you've found particularly useful?


Michaela, aka "Mjx"
Manager, eG Forums
mscioscia@egstaff.org

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

1" and 1/2" cube flex molds are very useful for a lot of their recipes, such as the fried custards, puddings, and sauces. Most of the set gels and foams can be done in whichever mold you want, it's really just for aesthetic value. I would note that a lot of the recipes are fragile and I've damaged more than my share of set foams trying to remove them from non-flexible molds.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've been thinking about this all day, I started with an empty kitchen 4 years ago and have been slowly picking up bits and pieces- and I know what it's like to live with a tiny kitchen.

Of all the bits I've accumulated and been given, the thing I use most are scales (which you have sorted). I have gram-accurate kitchen scales up to 5kg, and a $10 digital "jewellers scale" for the modernist stuff. Which my friend - a criminal lawyer - calls "cocaine scales" because apparently the ones I bought off eBay are the same ones popular with dealers...

Apart from scales, I use digital thermometers religiously - they would be my number 2 item. I use them to check everything - not just meat but custards, chocolate tempering etc etc. And they don't take up much room.

I agree that silpats are great, but I hardly use my whipper siphon thing and I see that as more of a novelty.

I picked up a heavily discounted mandoline and surprised myself with how much I enjoy using it, even for banal stuff like mirepoix - perfect little cubes! Not modernist but much better than I expected- I always thought of them as useless things that were sold on late night infomercials but I'm wrong...

In a similar vein, a cheap ricer has transformed my mash and gnocchi. Not modernist, but I eat mashed potatoes and gnocchi a lot more than anything I have spherised.

I already had a rice cooker and so my SV rig consisted of a budget temperature controller from eBay and a $44 vacuum sealer. The vacuum sealer is something I am using more and more - I hate throwing out food and now I bag it up and freeze portions. The vacuum sealer would probably be my number 3 item but it does take up a little room. My freezer is stocked with bags of stock, pouches of mirepoix ready to use, as well as meals that are ready to cook. This is all seperate to sous vide - you can get great milage out of a vacuum sealer - even a cheap $44 model - without using it for sous vide.

My most recent acquisition is a pressure cooker and although it is still new, everything I have made in it so far has been amazing. But it's pretty big...

Then there are the specialty ingredients that last a long time. I love my truffle oils, liquid smoke, dried porcini mushrooms and the bulk bags of chocolate that are within hands reach. In hindsight, I would've been happier spending the money that went on the siphon on porcini mushrooms instead!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

An SV that clips on and stores in a drawer wouldn't take up much space...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

. . . .

I agree that silpats are great, but I hardly use my whipper siphon thing and I see that as more of a novelty.

I picked up a heavily discounted mandoline and surprised myself with how much I enjoy using it, even for banal stuff like mirepoix - perfect little cubes! Not modernist but much better than I expected- I always thought of them as useless things that were sold on late night infomercials but I'm wrong...

In a similar vein, a cheap ricer has transformed my mash and gnocchi. Not modernist, but I eat mashed potatoes and gnocchi a lot more than anything I have spherised.

. . . .

I was thinking about a mandoline, and what you've said makes it sound like it's worth adding to the list. I had a ricer, and it was quite useful, but since I've got a food mill, I'd have to say that I like that even better, although it is signficantly heavier.

The whipper may be a little silly, but I really do like the idea of carbonating things. Sort a of a cheer-myself-up kind of thing.

An SV that clips on and stores in a drawer wouldn't take up much space...

The thing is, the size of the kitchen I'm using isn't an issue; it's actually an ordinary size, but it's someone else's kitchen, and the storage space in it already crammed full of stuff. Not to mention, there's the risk of anything I leave in the kitchen being damaged. Anything too big to fit on the shelf next to my books and the booze collection just has to wait a bit... it gives me time to dream :smile:


Michaela, aka "Mjx"
Manager, eG Forums
mscioscia@egstaff.org

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ah.

Well a mandolin then. I use mine many times a week. It has one blade with adjustable thickness. A kevlar glove is a nice accessory for large scale slicing sessions because its easy to drift off and loose a bit of palm.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There are 100g pocket scales with a resolution of 0.01 on Amazon for around $10. Bought one this summer. The Thermapen has gone up in price but there always is a sale at some point. This was one of my better buys. Hanna makes inexpensive digital pH readers ($20-30) but you need calibration solutions and a way to store the darn thing. I think the strips are the way to go.

As you are in someone else's kitchen maybe you should buy a few key small items to satisfy your "purchasing need" and save the rest of the balance for when you are in a different situation. Get a small box to hold your "treasures" and place somewhere it'll fit unobtrusively- perhaps on the booze-shelf. This way they are clearly yours and wont be contested if and when you decide to change the situation.

In the meantime you can plan for the day you have control of your own kitchen.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

BTW I think there may be a sale at Thermoworks right now.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My first suggestion would be a basal (ovulation) thermometer, such as the KD-1432 from CVS (US). Costs maybe $15 USD. Both the analog (liquid, non-mercury) and digital ones seem to be accurate to 0.01F at 100F, and they are small. Use it to calibrate whatever other thermometer you buy -- almost essential if you get into sous vide. Then get the Component Design Northwest Q2-450 thermometer with lanyard and a calibration option.

Forget all of the fancy chemicals and ingredients, at least for now -- a sous vide rig is far more important, long term. The PolyScience Sous Vide Professional Creative Series clamps onto the side of almost any reasonable size pot or tank, and the Travel and Storage case could protect it while not in use. You could store the unit in the trunk of your car, or under the bed, if necessary. If you already had a Crock Pot or rice cooker, or even an electric griddle or hot plate, and a pot, I would recommend the Sous Vide Magic PID controller from Fresh Meals Solutions, instead. Don't bother with a vacuum sealer, at least at first -- ZipLoc bags and the Archimedes principle will do just fine for starters.

One or two round ice-ball trays are fun to use for making things like mango juice coated with white or dark chocolate. You freeze the juice in the tray, then dip the balls in chocolate and refrigerate them. The juice then melts, but the chocolate doesn't, so when you pop it in your mouth, it almost explodes. Poor man's spherification, and more reliable.

Maybe some dry ice, as an occasional substitute for liquid nitrogen or an Anti-Griddle. And once it vaporizes, it won't take up any storage!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My first suggestion would be a basal (ovulation) thermometer, such as the KD-1432 from CVS (US). Costs maybe $15 USD. Both the analog (liquid, non-mercury) and digital ones seem to be accurate to 0.01F at 100F, and they are small. Use it to calibrate whatever other thermometer you buy -- almost essential if you get into sous vide. Then get the Component Design Northwest Q2-450 thermometer with lanyard and a calibration option.

. . . .

Thanks, Robert! Is an ovulation thermometer more accurate for calibration purposes than boiling water (I live at sea level)?

Since a sous vide rig of any sort isn't a possibility at this time, my principal use for this thermometer would be testing sugar temperature; I've relied on the cold water test so far, and have had few failures, but I really appreciate accurate, controlled methods of doing things, and it will be nice to not have my heart in my mouth every time I make fondant.

I've actually put in my amazon order, and went with a Thermapen, a couple of Silpats, an iSi Gourmet Whip Plus, and several books, including Migoya's The Elements of Dessert.


Michaela, aka "Mjx"
Manager, eG Forums
mscioscia@egstaff.org

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The ovulation thermometer would not be accurate for sugar work temperatures (> 100 °C), even if it's not destroyed outright at these temperatures.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Is calibration within .01 F really necessary?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The ovulation thermometer would not be accurate for sugar work temperatures (> 100 °C), even if it's not destroyed outright at these temperatures.

The ovulation thermometer would only be for calibration purposes (for the Thermapen that's suposed to show up one of these days), since It's apprently precise enough to use for this purpose. But I do wonder whether that is actually more accurate than boling water at sea level.

Is calibration within .01 F really necessary?

Heck, why not?! I love precise and accurate instruments :wink:


Michaela, aka "Mjx"
Manager, eG Forums
mscioscia@egstaff.org

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The ovulation thermometer would only be for calibration purposes (for the Thermapen that's suposed to show up one of these days), since It's apprently precise enough to use for this purpose. But I do wonder whether that is actually more accurate than boling water at sea level.

Heck, why not?! I love precise and accurate instruments :wink:

Yes, but you have to calibrate near your intended usage temperature(s) as temperature deviations are usually not (or at least: don't need to be) linear. Calibrating at 37 °C is pretty useless for accuracy at 120 °C.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Similar Content

    • Sodium Citrate in a cheese soubise?
      By Morkai
      I am planning on making Michael Ruhlman's macaroni and cheese this weekend for a party. In the recipe, you make a soubise sauce with flour, butter, milk, and carmelized onions. You hand blend these all together (with some spices), and then add the grated cheese to the hot liquid to melt. Then you can mix in with the cooked pasta and keep overnight in the fridge.
       
      Then I remembered I have sodium citrate in the pantry. 
       
      We like this recipe, but find that it's not as "cheesy" or "creamy" as we'd like it to be sometimes, especially after cooking. Would adding a dash of sodium citrate to the cheese/soubise mixture help keep it that classic cheesy texture? Even if it sat overnight in the fridge and was then baked? As I am making this along with smoking a couple pork butts for my girlfriend's co-workers, I really don't want to have a food disaster! 
       
      Thanks all,
       
      Mork
    • Making Pistachio Ice Cream and Gelato
      By Tennessee Cowboy
      I'd like help from anyone on making the best Pistachio Ice cream.  This forum is a continuation of a conversation I started in my "introduction" post, which you can see at 
      I recently made Pistachio ice cream using the Jeni's Ice Cream Cookbook.  I love Pistachio ice cream, so I've launched an experiment to find the best recipe.  I am going to try two basic approaches:  The Modernist Cookbook gelato, which uses no cream at all, and ice cream; I'm also experimenting with two brands of pistachio paste and starting with pistachios and no paste.  Lisa Shock and other People who commented on the earlier thread said that the key is to start with the best Pistachio Paste.    
      Any advice is appreciated.  Here is where I am now:  I purchased a brand of pistachio paste through nuts.com named "Love 'n Bake."  When it arrived, it was 1/2 pistachios and 1/2 sugar and olive oil.   I purchased a second batch through Amazon from FiddleyFarms; it is 100% pistachios.  I bought raw pistachios through nuts.com.  The only raw ones were from California.  If anyone has advice on using the MC recipe or on best approaches to ice cream with this ingredient I'd appreciate them.  I will report progress on my experiment in this forum.
    • Seeking Recommended egullet threads for a Souv Vide neophite
      By Porthos
      I have purchased an Anova circulator. My interest in sous vide is based upon needing to prepare chicken and pork dishes that remain more moist than other cooking methods I have used. This is based upon needing more moistness for my wife. After her bariactric surgery she became sensitive to meat that is not still very moist.
       
      I would like recommendations for some threads to read through to help get me started.
    • Anova Sous Vide Circulator (Part 3)
      By DanM
      [Host's note: this topic forms part of an extended discussion that grew too big for our servers to handle efficiently.  The discussion continues from here.]
       
       
      I am thinking about an Anova for a slightly different purpose. Can I use this in a home brewing environment to manage the grain mash temperature? 
       
      Maybe I can use this for a HERMS brewing setup? I would use the Anova to maintain the temperature of a hot water tank. I would then use my pump to circulate the wort from the mash tun through a heat exchanger (copper coil) that is immersed in the hot water tank.
       
      Thanks. 
       
      Dan
    • Rotary evaporator
      By Kent Wang
      This article from the French Culinary Institute goes into detail about the rotary evaporator that they have.
      Highlights:
      An initial question I have is that for doing something fairly simple like reducing pomegranate juice to make grenadine, could I just put the juice in a pan and put it in a food dehydrator, which is much cheaper? How about stock?
      Sure, you would lose some of the aromatics, while the rotary evaporator, based on my cursory understanding, would capture all of it. But that's a compromise I'm willing to make. I could see something like making brandy and syrup from wine (as detailed towards of the bottom of the above article) to absolutely require a rotovap.
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.