Is local-sustainable-organic the new baseline

[Fat Guy]

I had an interesting chat the other day with Grant Achatz and Nick Kokonas of Chicago's Alinea restaurant. They are on the road promoting their new book, Life, on the Line, which by the way is well worth reading. On Monday at a talk Kokonas made the argument that "local, sustainable and organic is now the baseline at any great restaurant in the world." I followed up with them on Wednesday and they were sticking to that position. Alinea, a modernist restaurant with a reputation for technical wizardry, doesn't put the names of farms on its menu -- you don't even get a menu until you leave -- yet they work with 138 purveyors and care deeply about the provenance of their ingredients.

Is there a great restaurant that isn't focusing on local, sustainable and organic to at least some extent? If so, name it. If not, what does it all mean?

[mkayahara]

Is there a great restaurant that isn't focusing on local, sustainable and organic to at least some extent? If so, name it.

I would argue that any number of high-end sushi restaurants don't subscribe to this philosophy, inasmuch as they serve unsustainable fish, often brought in from Japan or other remote locations. In particular, Toronto's Hashimoto reportedly extends this philosophy so far as to import all its ingredients from Japan. Of course, having never eaten there, I can't say whether or not it constitutes a "great" restaurant. But at that price point, I assume so.

[lancastermike]

I have never been to the place mentioned. Do they serve fish? unless it is comimng from Lake Michigan seems hard to believe it is local. What of herbs? Unless they have their own indoor harb facility I can't imagine much grows in Chicago this time of year. Berries? Mangoes?

I live in one of the most fertile farming areas in the country. But just now, there is not really anything in the way of local produce, except some root things. it is a wonderful thing that places source food as locally as they can. But to adopt that as the only way to go will certainly limit what foods they can use for a good portion of the year.

[gfweb]

I think that local/sustainable/fresh is a worthy goal that will be missed a great deal of the time. Unless the resto is in San Diego or some other balmy spot, the menu would be severely limited for a good part of the year.

Philosophically L/S/F is great. Practically, it is costly and oxymoronic in some seasons. In Alaska or Michigan you can have local or fresh in the winter, not both. At least not without exorbitant expense.

[emannths]

I'm sort of curious what a restaurant like Alinea thinks of the citrus, saltwater fish, or European wine on their menus (the wine one is my favorite--the number of restaurants in the northeast that preach sustainability and have a winelist that contains nothing within 2 timezones must be sky-high). At what point are they willing to alter the menu to include a local ingredient and when is something so irreplaceable that it's location of origin doesn't matter? I don't fault them for keeping these things, but it makes it seem like they're already patting themselves on the back when the job is only half-complete.

[JadeShing]

Hi, Yes, I think that sushi restaurants do not follow this philosophy and also to the greater extent Chinese restaurants which serve sharks fins soup (extra popular at wedding banquets where they server over 500 people at once - think about how many sharks needed for that one night!! )

Definitely not sustainable.. but is it tasty? I would say so....

[xxchef]

Why does it seem that when "local, sustainable and organic" is discussed it has to be all-or-nothing? Why isn't the commitment to sourcing quality ingredients that follow these tenets when possible good enough?

I think it's ridiculous to limit ones resources based on some arbitrary distance-traveled, carbon footprint or the type of feed given to an ingredient during its life. That said, I think it's admirable for anyone to at least look at these attributes and give them some weight when given a choice between items of comparable quality. I personally go well out of my way to eat local, sustainable or organic products when possible and appropriate and understand why they can cost a bit more.

On the other hand, we live in a day and age when we have the incredible means to eat the highest quality Japanese fish in Toronto that is fresher than what we might catch ourselves and bring home from a weekend camping trip. To dismiss such amazing culinary opportunities out-of-hand based on ill-defined or unsubstantiated objections seems like a conceit.

[weinoo]

Why does it seem that when "local, sustainable and organic" is discussed it has to be all-or-nothing? Why isn't the commitment to sourcing quality ingredients that follow these tenets when possible good enough?

Exactly. Are we looking at local + sustainable + organic or are we looking at local or sustainable or organic? The second choice makes a lot more sense.

[Burnin' It]

If by "great" you mean expensive, yeah, I guess so.

Not that I'm against organic or locally sourced. Sadly, how these movements often work is that people with the money want something, and then it eventually gets down to where the general populace can actually afford it. I would be happier if Grant Achatz would not only put that stuff on his menu, but would concern himself with finding ways for his suppliers to reach the masses. And his suppliers should be thinking the same thing.

Another way to look at the question would be, can you make great food without it being locally sourced and organic? Absolutely.

I don't think trying to eat responsibly is conceit. I think that calling only what a small minority can afford, "great" to be conceit.

[AaronM]

A dinner at Alinea costs $200 minimum. It better be "local, organic, sustainable" and all that. But I find the idea that everything has to be local and organic disingenuous. A can of crushed tomatoes provenance does not matter, and only some vegetables gain an actual taste benefit from organic growing conditions. This worship of buzzwords upsets me.