Couverture: Sources, Favorites, Storage, Troubleshooting

[RichardJones]

Good point, Kerry. I was referring to their 'all-purpose' (3 drop) chocolate which is thicker than an equivalent from Valrhona.

As it happens, Callebaut do not advise using the 5 drop for moulding. I imagine it makes very fragile shells (which I suppose you might just be after for certain purposes...)

Danny, you may find the videos on the Callebaut website interesting. Here is one which discusses viscosity and you can link to others from there: http://www.callebaut.com/ocen/4842

R

[QbanCrackr]

I've never been a fan of Callebaut for tempering. Always seems to thick. I've used it for baking and such, and it's fine.

Valrhona is always a great choice, but price wise, I tend to stay away. I use El Rey, and it's very easy to get directly from the company. Their service has always been great. Prices tend to fluctuate with them though.

My block of Milk that i bought was a 2/5 on the "drops" scale that they have on the wrapper...was nice for mousses and ganaches but when i tempered it it got real thick...i made a peanut butter square center that i dipped in it and because of the viscocity it actually gave me the thickness i was looking for (i think a thinner shell wouldn't have contrasted as good)

I'd go for the Belcolade with those choices. Make sure it's the Belgian, not the US made stuff. Good everyday chocolate - excellent viscosity for molding.

When we spoke with the rep, he told us they came out with a brand called Chocolante i think it is, and its made in the US.

Do you feel you are ready to be setting up as a professional?

I wouldn't say ready, but i feel alot more confident than when i first started getting into confections and desserts and whatnot. We definitely won't be offering our products at the price of established confectioners in Miami (i can only think of 3-4 that are notable down here) but eventually with enough practice maybe we can be considered in the same sentence =P

Once we're able to hire another helping hand for the evenings, I'll be able to devote more time into honing my newly found craft

I've got maybe 6-8 flavors for truffle centers that are solid (well solid flavor-wise, hehe) and everyone that has tried them has given real good reviews. I wouldn't want to venture into selling the molded chocolates yet until I'm able to consistently temper a batch of chocolate without having to stop and retemper the whole thing.

What I do know, and I welcome it with open arms, is that I'll probably never stop learning about it

Not all callebaut formulations are thick when tempered - they makes hundreds of different formulations - with various amounts of cocoa butter. Finding one of their formulations with 5 drops will give you a chocolate that is suitable for molding and relatively thin when in temper. The letter in front of the 811 indicates viscosity.

Thats what I read recently (well I bought the chocolate before knowing, and it had 2/5 drops on the wrapper

[Darienne]

Kerry, where does one find Belcolade in Ontario?

Peterborough. A local bulk food store, The Main Ingredient, carries Belcolade which Barbara and I use. He gets it from his rep obviously and I could probably ask him how you could find it where you are. You could PM me with your information. Etc.

I know that Kerry Beal uses Belcolade and thinks highly of it. I agree.

Also, when in Moab, I used Guittard chocolate which I had sent in from SLC. But then, you have to have everything sent in to Moab. I could not even buy lollipop sticks there.

[RichardJones]

That will be why it was especially thick, Danny!

This link should send you to Callebaut's rating page with accompanied uses: http://www.callebaut.com/application_table.dhtml?language=ocen,inConfectionery=1,inPastry=0,inHoreca=0

R

[Edward J]

How exactly are you melting your couverture, and how hot/humid is your kitchen? (Dishwaser running, steam kettles or stuff on the stove?)

You should be able to temper any decent couverture. Callebaut and Belcolada are fine, but methinks the Belgians have a monopoly on chocolate in N.America.

------DON'T GET ME WRONG!!! They make good stuff, but it's kind like saying that: "only _______ (insert name of a wine making country) makes the BEST wine"...You'd have every other wine making country after you begging to differ!!!

Me, I'm a Lindt user. The Swiss know a thing or two about chocolate as well. Lindt has corporate offices in Ontario and should have a distributer. I'm paying around CDN $14 a kg for the 70% single origin Ecuador here in Vancouver which is a very fine couverture and lower prices for 55%, 65%, milk and white.

Tempering machines are great for getting your hands into the game, but they only come in mini or maxi sizes. The mini size is fine for fooling around, and the maxi size is very expensive compared to what you could get for a real good melting/warming unit and wheel.

Hope this helps....

[Kerry Beal]

Kerry, where does one find Belcolade in Ontario?

Phone Puratos and they will tell you suppliers in your area.

[Kerry Beal]

How exactly are you melting your couverture, and how hot/humid is your kitchen? (Dishwaser running, steam kettles or stuff on the stove?)

You should be able to temper any decent couverture. Callebaut and Belcolada are fine, but methinks the Belgians have a monopoly on chocolate in N.America.

------DON'T GET ME WRONG!!! They make good stuff, but it's kind like saying that: "only _______ (insert name of a wine making country) makes the BEST wine"...You'd have every other wine making country after you begging to differ!!!

Me, I'm a Lindt user. The Swiss know a thing or two about chocolate as well. Lindt has corporate offices in Ontario and should have a distributer. I'm paying around CDN $14 a kg for the 70% single origin Ecuador here in Vancouver which is a very fine couverture and lower prices for 55%, 65%, milk and white.

Tempering machines are great for getting your hands into the game, but they only come in mini or maxi sizes. The mini size is fine for fooling around, and the maxi size is very expensive compared to what you could get for a real good melting/warming unit and wheel.

Hope this helps....

Lindt makes some lovely chocolate. Not sure where to get it in Miami.

[Edward J]

Qzina. www.qzina.com

They've got a location in Miami, as well as Vancouver, Toronto and Edmonton

[QbanCrackr]

When i temper my chocolate I seed it--but I've had some confusion about how to do it properly.

Once you seed it and it drops below a certain point, the chocolate won't melt anymore rigt?. Some people say to use chunks so you can take them out easily (and then remove the chocolate and refrigerate it i guess to stop the melting). I had my 1/3 of seed set aside and ran my knife through it real good i thought it'd all melt but i was left with abunch of little chunks that didn't melt (although they added good texture haha). But in any case, i think that the chocolate having the 2 drops on the wrapper meant it had less cocoa butter thus making it less fluid? *shrug*

In regards to the machines...I've seen a revolation 2 at about $500 that tempers 1-1/2# of chocolate and a mol d'art melter/warmer i think it was a 3kg rectantular for just over $700

The melter obviously has to be tempered by hand, whereas the temperer....well tempers (even though when you have temperature fluxuations or different chocolates that behave differently you have to play with the curves?)

I know in the future we'll have the budget to purchase 1 of the 2 machines. I'm hoping that when that time comes I'll be confident enough with my skills to just go up to the melter/warmer so that i can dump the molds and make less of a mess

[Edward J]

In regards to the melter go whole hog and get the large melter--the kind that takes a full hotel pan size, not the 2/3 size or half size. The logic for this is as follows:

When molding, you have enough "elbow room" to pour, tip and scrape the molds properly.

When dipping, you can put in two 1/2 size pans, either of say, a 70% dark and a 55% dark or an organic or malitol, or you can put in one half pan of milk and one half pan of white, usually you can get away with the same common temp for these two types.

In other words, you have felexibility.

When money and circumstances allow, buy another full size melter. I have waterbath-type melters and have an optional wheel that fits on this melter, but I started off with just 1 melter with two pans

Be sure to order a full l pan and lid AND two optional half-size pans and lids when you buy such a melter. DO NOT buy any N. American or asian-made hotel pans, or lids. DO NOT let anyone tell you differently, and here's why:

The melter you buy is made in Europe, (HOLLAND OR ITALY) and Europe uses the "Euro-norm" system of hotel pans (called gastro-norm) This system has the same overall dimensions as the N. American, BUT has much more rounder, radiused corners in the pans. Thus, no N. American or asian hotel pans will fit properly into the melter. They might seem to fit, but they will not fit properly and will crack the plastic housing of the melter when wighted down.

Waay back in the late 1990's I bought the "Revolution 1" temperer. It is a good machine, and I've had it and use it on an almost daily basis for about 10 years now. It is a small machine and the capacity is small. It will not work properly when the RH% (relative humidity) is over 75%, but then again, no method of tempering will work when the humidity is this high. Consider making/setting up a separate room for your chocoalte work, an el-cheapo airconditioner will give you the right tempeature and lower your humidity.

Hope this helps

[Amy D.]

I had my first go at ordering a load (for me at least) of couverture a few weeks ago (had a few presents to make) & not really having much experience I thought i'd try products from several different companies (although my choice was limited as I was only ordering a kilo of each so no Valrhona for me this time):

Firstly after having tried & liked chocolates from a shop that claimed to use Elray I thought I'd try their Apamate, Caoba and Icoa but was really disapointed with the flavours of all three which were over powering and basically not particularly nice (to me at least), I also found the Apamate tempermental to work with. Not something i'd return to.

Callebaut W2-553 white callets tasty enough with creamy notes just what you expect from a white chocolate with no tempering problems.

Cocao Barry 70% Santo Domingo extra bitter has a nice flavour but I haven't got around to using this one yet.

43% Venezuelan Belcolade milk: this was my big suprise as I wasn't expecting much from it as it's not a company i'd heard of before & it was the cheapest, however it has a great flavour and tempers & enrobes really well. my next order will definately explore more of Belcolade's products!

[paulraphael]

[quote name='Edward J' date='12 January 2010 - 08:25 PM' timestamp='1263345942' post='1723415' Callebaut and Belcolada are fine, but methinks the Belgians have a monopoly on chocolate in N.America.

------DON'T GET ME WRONG!!! They make good stuff, but it's kind like saying that: "only _______ (insert name of a wine making country) makes the BEST wine"...You'd have every other wine making country after you begging to differ!!!

[merlicky]

I use E. Guittard 61% for many of my dark chocolates. It is a very fluid, slightly sweet chocolate that seems to mix well with most flavors. They have distributors all over North America. I’m not sure where you’re located, but if you call their customer service number, (800) 468-2462, and ask about distributors in your area they will be happy to help.

Scharffenberger now belongs to Hershey so they have distributors everywhere. Their customer service number is (866) 608-6944. The only problem with Scharffenberger is that they don’t offer true bulk packaging. They also don’t offer much of their product line (like their 41% milk) in anything other than retail sizes.

Also, if you really want to try Valrhona there are deals out there on some of their couvertures. See page 4 of this link for one example from European Imports Ltd in Chicago: Valhrona Deal. It's an old offer, but I think they still have special pricing on this product.

[Edward J]

[quote name='Edward J' date='12 January 2010 - 08:25 PM' timestamp='1263345942' post='1723415' Callebaut and Belcolada are fine, but methinks the Belgians have a monopoly on chocolate in N.America.

------DON'T GET ME WRONG!!! They make good stuff, but it's kind like saying that: "only _______ (insert name of a wine making country) makes the BEST wine"...You'd have every other wine making country after you begging to differ!!!

I've never heard anyone list the Belgian companies as among the best; I think they're popular because of their value. I like Valrhona better than Callebaut, and I like Michel Cluizel better than Valrhona. But I use a lot of Callebaut, especially in recipes where there are a lot of ingredients that can mute the chocolate flavors. I like Callebaut because it's good enough, it's consistent, I can buy it in bulk easily, and it's economical. Valrhona costs on average twice as much; Cluizel almost four times as much. Callebaut is priced well to be my commodity chocolate.

I'm sure there are other chocolates that would fit the bill just as well, but I don't have such reliable access to them.

[rebgold]

The shop I work in uses Mercken couveture. It doesn't taste good, lol. Looking for opinions on the best tasting couveture at the low end of the price scale. We're a small, old school candy shop not a cutting edge chocolate boutique so super fancy expensive chocolate isn't in our range.

What do you guys think?

Thanks,

Rebecca

[Rick Mogstad]

I find the Callebaut thin 60% callets to be pretty good quality, and fairly inexpensive. The formula is: Belgian 60-40-38NV, and it is a "3 drop" thickness. It runs about $6/lb in bulk locally. I think depending on how thin of a shell you wanted, you may have to add some cocoa butter, but I think for the price that it is pretty decent tasting chocolate.

Is that more than you were looking to spend? Also, you are looking for actual chocolate, and not "coating", correct?

Edited December 8, 2010 by Rick Mogstad (log)

[rebgold]

Right, real chocolate. I don't know what we can spend exactly, but I know the Merckens is cheap. The people I work for just bought the shop and none of us are chocolate experts. I'm a pastry chef so I've done simple truffles, and lots of sugar based candies but chosing couvertures, tempering machines that I don't think are working correctly, is a bit over my head. I've always used the regular Callebaut our supplier carried, 2 or 3 drop semi sweet, and really never tempered for the simple chocolate work I've done in the past. I guess I'll be learning as quickly as possible, lol.

[annachan]

I've used Grand Marque (from Marque Foods) and it's good for the price. I believe it's from Belgium. http://marquefoods.com/categories/grand-marque-couvertures

Noel (France) is another reasonably priced option. I haven't used E Guittard for a while but remember it to be reasonably priced as well.

[Edward J]

Don't know where you are, or what purveyors are around.

Qzina (www.qzina.com) carries quite a few lines, "Chocoa" is moderately priced and quite good, belcolade is another brand, both are Belgian.

Lindt has some excellent couertures and has ones in the 54% range (surfin), in the 60% range, and in the 70% range. Surfin's not bad at all for the price, and pretty good for molding.

In the end, when dealing with suppliers, volume is the magic word. I've seen Callebaut 70/30 go for as low as $5/kg if the volume is high enough. Dark chocolate keeps for years, it's just a question of how much your new bosses want to tie up their cash in inventory, and how much they want to pay for weekly delivieres.

[lebowits]

You might also want to contact Albert Uster Imports. They have several "lines" of couverture. I've used their "gem" and "orchid" lines which are about $6/lb and $3.50/lb respectively. They will also deliver relatively small quantities.

[rebgold]

New question, same topic; This Merckens chocolate we use, found a website for it and it's called coating, but the boxes come with tempering directions. It doesn't say couverture anywhere. Can you actually temper non couverture chocolate? Maybe that's why it's never shiny? It tastes like cocoa powder but everyone thinks it's delicious. I don't know how I can be the only one who thinks it's awful.

[Darienne]

I phoned a store in Colorado looking for couverture which said it carried Merkens chocolate, both coating and couverture. I questioned them very closely on the subject, never having heard of Merkens couverture before and was assured that yes, Merkens now did carry an inexpensive variety of couverture.

Didn't order it and made all my Moab chocolate using the Ghirardelli chocolate chips which are basically couverture...I think.

Alas! It was too hot when we left for Utah to bring any chocolate with us and we weren't going to be there long enough to use 11 pounds of anything. Plus mostly what I used chocolate for was coating toffee and such-like. No one complained.

[Edward J]

New question, same topic; This Merckens chocolate we use, found a website for it and it's called coating, but the boxes come with tempering directions. It doesn't say couverture anywhere. Can you actually temper non couverture chocolate? Maybe that's why it's never shiny? It tastes like cocoa powder but everyone thinks it's delicious. I don't know how I can be the only one who thinks it's awful.

What does the ingredient list state? If there's no cocoa butter and only weird vegetable fats then it is, indeed, a coating. Even coating shouldn't get hotter than 40-45 C, but you don't need to cool it down and warm it up to a very specific temp like with real couverture.

[Chocolot]

Does Couverture need to be defined here? I would never use Merckens and couverture in the same sentence. Merckens makes an acceptable dipping chocolate, but not couverture. Maybe it is just me and my definition of couverture.

[pringle007]

Noel (France) is another reasonably priced option. I haven't used E Guittard for a while but remember it to be reasonably priced as well.

Ive used Noel as well and find their stuff to be great products for the price. One of my preferred.