10 must-visit NYC restaurants - advice sought

[sickchangeup]

As another alternative to Peter Luger's, Keen's.

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I agree with Keen's, although mostly for the mutton chop and the "NY'ness" of it, not as much for the steak.

I'd also recommend getting a group together to hit some Chinese place...

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This is also great advice. Chinese really does work best in groups, but even with 2 I like going to both Chinatown Brasserie for Sunday brunch and also Szechuan Gourmet for spicy.

[raji]

I think raji is on the money with his approach to answering the OP's question.  If someone is coming from the UK only to NYC, the question is more what can be had here that's better than the UK.

Yeah that's the position I'm writing from. So, while it's easy to deride Mexican in NY compared to Cali, Texas, or really the American Southwest at large, it has plenty of exciting neuvo Mexican, which I often find at places Sue Torres has worked or is now (How is Suenos?)

[raji]

Do they eat fried chicken & waffles in the UK?  I'm partial to Amy Ruth's.

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Amy Ruth's - that's another great call. Sooooooo good. Get the Sharpton!

[NatashaH]

Also, although I know what you mean, I don't know that I'd use "French-based" to describe Degustation (Spanish), Blue Hill (American), and WD-50 (Martian/American).

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[weinoo]

I think for NY style pizza, you're best off by going to Patsy's or Arturo's or Grimaldi's for the New York feel and the NY style pie. Motorino/Keste just wont do that.

City Burger is open till around 6 PM, but I don't think it's as fine of a choice as DBGB (for all the other sceney stuff while having that burger) or a place like JG Melon's, Shake Shack, et. al.

Who can argue with Katz's?

From the more recent "reviews" of Babbo, that's a role of the dice, no? Unless it's the "chef" you're after - you might be better off with a nicely put together meal at Otto - and then there's that fine gelato for dessert.

[oakapple]

Who can argue with Katz's?

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Unless the OP loves pastrami, it might not be the best choice.

[Sneakeater]

The OP may not yet know whether she loves pastrami.

[Sneakeater]

Martian/American? Sounds interesting... Tell me more...

Twenty-three pages more -- with a link to an archive of even more, earlier posts.

And WD-50 (about which I had fairly serious reservations when it opened) keeps getting better and better (meaning more sensually appealing). I had the tasting menu there a couple weeks ago, and I'm still thinking about how great it was.

Edited July 10, 2009 by Sneakeater (log)

[weinoo]

Who can argue with Katz's?

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Unless the OP loves pastrami, it might not be the best choice.

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I was thinking more about the ambience .

[Eatmywords]

I kinda disagree on the Mexican. We don’t have good high end (if there is such a thing). ((Rosa Mexicano sucks btw)). But we have some competent bare bones authentic. Tulcingo Del Valle (46th/10th Ave) I feel is the best in Manhattan. Their mole has some nice deep flavors and the soft tacos with green sc are really good. Go for the tripe, goat, tongue and pork (El Pastor). As good as what I sampled in California and Texas.

[Sneakeater]

I love Tulcingo, but the problem I have with it is that the protiens are pretty low quality. (The moles they're in are obviously beyond praise.)

You can't complain at that price, of course, but if I were travelling I think I'd have a problem with eating like that.

[Steve R.]

That's why I recommended Centrico. Aaron's style is classy enough to merit a visit and the cocktails (the jala-pina especially) are fine. Otherwise, East Harlem, Roosevelt Ave or, I hear, Sunset Park for low end (or the Red Hook ballfields on the weekend).

[weinoo]

Actually, you could do the lines tour - DiFara's, Ssam Bar, Red Hook Ballfields, Grimaldi's, Shake Shack, Grom...too bad you've already missed the Big Apple BBQ.

I don't know about anyone else, but when I travel, I'm not looking for "non-indigenous" food unless it's the best of its kind - so Japanese here is OK, Mexican is not.

[Sneakeater]

That's the way I feel exactly.

[daisy17]

Actually, you could do the lines tour - DiFara's, Ssam Bar, Red Hook Ballfields, Grimaldi's, Shake Shack, Grom...too bad you've already missed the Big Apple BBQ.

I don't know about anyone else, but when I travel, I'm not looking for "non-indigenous" food unless it's the best of its kind - so Japanese here is OK, Mexican is not.

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Completely agree. Don't come to NY in search of Mexican food. Red Hook Ballfields is probably the most authentic Latin food you'll find. (I have had some very good food at Toloache but I would not go out of my way if I were you, with the abundance of other amazing food there is in this city.)

[raji]

I don't know about anyone else, but when I travel, I'm not looking for "non-indigenous" food unless it's the best of its kind - so Japanese here is OK, Mexican is not.

Yeah but that statement is fundamentally flawed - NY is a melting pot and EVERYTHING here is non-indigenous.

Japanese is so strong here because you have a relatively (relative to other cities worldwide) humongous population of NATIVE-born Japanese - unlike the huge populations in California or Brazil - so the local flavors keep getting cycled and rotated in. It tends to be office-workers on their company rotation so there is a lot on the high-end to fit that demand, and that breeds competition.

Mexican is so much stronger in the Southwest because hell, that used to BE Mexico, but you have first, second, third-generation Mexicans filling the demand for the low to high end.

NY's Mexican population, the vast majority are migrant workers so at the low end you will find places like Del Valle, and if you go out to the outer boroughs there are tons of places like that and they are even cheaper. But at the high end I believe there's a lot of BS but also a handful of places that are executing great nouvelle Mexican. Left-coasters just get pissed cuz good Mexican is everywhere out there and furthermore they have to pay a lot more at the higher end for what they had out west.

Would a NY Mexican restaurant make it into my top 10? Maybe not, but if she's in the mood for those flavors I think you could do a lot worse than what's at the high end here.

By Weinoo's statement, I would never eat Japanese outside of NYC. But sometimes you or your guests are in the mood for a certain type of cuisine. When I go to SF or LA I'll eat Japanese food; I know NY is "the best" so I gotta try a lot harder and ask around a lot more about where the really good places are.

[Pan]

Who can argue with Katz's?

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Unless the OP loves pastrami, it might not be the best choice.

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Their brisket is also excellent, if you get it juicy, but really, the pastrami is the thing to get if you're getting one thing.

[NatashaH]

Thanks all for your advice. I'm really looking forward to visiting some of the restaurants on your list.

[weinoo]

I don't know about anyone else, but when I travel, I'm not looking for "non-indigenous" food unless it's the best of its kind - so Japanese here is OK, Mexican is not.

Yeah but that statement is fundamentally flawed - NY is a melting pot and EVERYTHING here is non-indigenous.

Japanese is so strong here because you have a relatively (relative to other cities worldwide) humongous population of NATIVE-born Japanese - unlike the huge populations in California or Brazil - so the local flavors keep getting cycled and rotated in. It tends to be office-workers on their company rotation so there is a lot on the high-end to fit that demand, and that breeds competition.

Mexican is so much stronger in the Southwest because hell, that used to BE Mexico, but you have first, second, third-generation Mexicans filling the demand for the low to high end.

NY's Mexican population, the vast majority are migrant workers so at the low end you will find places like Del Valle, and if you go out to the outer boroughs there are tons of places like that and they are even cheaper. But at the high end I believe there's a lot of BS but also a handful of places that are executing great nouvelle Mexican. Left-coasters just get pissed cuz good Mexican is everywhere out there and furthermore they have to pay a lot more at the higher end for what they had out west.

Would a NY Mexican restaurant make it into my top 10? Maybe not, but if she's in the mood for those flavors I think you could do a lot worse than what's at the high end here.

By Weinoo's statement, I would never eat Japanese outside of NYC. But sometimes you or your guests are in the mood for a certain type of cuisine. When I go to SF or LA I'll eat Japanese food; I know NY is "the best" so I gotta try a lot harder and ask around a lot more about where the really good places are.

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Actually, I believe your statement is fundamentally flawed. Notice that "non-indigenous" is parenthetically noted - so yes, I know everything is "non-indidgenous."

However, the difference between high-end Japanese food here and that in either San Fran or LA is such that only an expert such as yourself might be able to discern it.

The difference between good Mexican food in California or the southwest vs. good Mexican food here is such that even a nabe such as me might be able to tell. As a matter of fact, I recently cooked 2 of the 7 moles of Oxaca here at home - they were both fundamentally better than any I could have gotten in a restaurant here in NY - as were my homemade tortillas.

[LPShanet]

Point taken about the Mexican restaurants - it's just I have an American friend based here in the UK who's constantly telling anyone who'll listen that the Mexican food scene in the US is way ahead of anything we have over here, so I thought it might be worth asking.

Burgers and pizzas sound good - any specific recommendations?

And I'll check out the bars.

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I totally agree with all of the recommendations made by Sneakeater. So please put in one more vote for all the places he has mentioned/endorsed, especially WD-50, Jean Georges, Kyo-Ya, Momofuku Ko (or Ssam Bar) and Corton.

One area of disagreement, though, with him and a few other the other posters: While there are other parts of the US that are way ahead of NYC in terms of authentic down and dirty Mexican food, the top "haute/modern Mex" places here are now as good as anything in the country. The idea that there is nothing Mexican-inspired here that's any good is totally outdated. However, Rosa Mexicana is not among those top places (it's barely better than a high end chain, IMO), and Centrico is a distant third at best. If you do want to have that sort of modern Mexican experience, I'd recommend trying Crema or Pampano. I've had four or five of the classic moles at Crema (poblano, verde, pipian, blanco and more), and all were totally spot on. Either Crema or Pampano on a good day would be creditable even in DF.

Also, to your original post, Soto is very good, but Megu is just expensive. Megu is a cool looking venue, and worth seeing just for how it looks, but the food isn't among very the top in the city, though it is decent (and pricey). On all matters of Japanese food, I'd trust Raji with my life.

In terms of pizza, I'm a bit shocked that no one has mentioned Una Pizza Napoletana. A pain to deal with their hours and wait times, but it's certainly up there with the top Italian style pies in the city (Motorino, Keste, Co., etc.). Maybe above them. For NY style, DiFara is arguably still the best, but a hike to get to.

One more caveat: I've taken a number of non-Americans to various barbecue places in NYC, and they tend to see them very differently than we do. Hill Country in particular has just confused most of my European friends, and they've all considered it a meal wasted, just because they didn't "get it". So be warned that it's not the kind of saucy barbecue you may have seen...it's essentially plain meat. Lovingly cooked and dry rubbed, but plain. While I don't agree that there are no worthwhile Mexican experiences in NYC, I could make a case for skipping the barbecue. If you don't skip it, make sure you ask a few questions that help you decide which style of BBQ you're likely to enjoy, as the different styles are quite different.

Edited July 19, 2009 by LPShanet (log)

[LPShanet]

Martian/American? Sounds interesting... Tell me more...

More evidence that we're still looking for a better term than "molecular gastronomy" WD-50 is best described as modern or experimental, and Wylie Dufresne, the chef there, is one of the most prominent proponents of it. I suppose the closest UK equivalent would be Fat Duck, but they are quite different beyond their modernity. WD-50 features deconstructed and modern American food that is often inspired by foods that the chef enjoyed as a kid, in some cases low brow American classics that have been interpreted and updated to the point of being tough to recognize except as inspiration. There's a tongue in cheek (and even some actual tongue) aspect to the menu, and the place is fun as well as delicious. So the use of "Martian-American" is actually very apt.

Edited July 19, 2009 by LPShanet (log)

[weinoo]

I totally agree with all of the recommendations made by Sneakeater.  So please put in one more vote for all the places he has mentioned/endorsed, especially WD-50, Jean Georges, Kyo-Ya, Momofuku Ko (or Ssam Bar) and Corton.

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Yeah, Sneakeater rocks.

[raji]

OK I think it's finally time I burst my Kyo-Ya cherry (ducks), but would love to with some of you folks.... I'm sorry I haven't tried it yet, guys.... I was about to, then I booked my tix to Japan, and been crazed since...

EMW set it up!!!

[raji]

Actually, I believe your statement is fundamentally flawed.  Notice that "non-indigenous" is parenthetically noted - so yes, I know everything is "non-indidgenous."

However, the difference between high-end Japanese food here and that in either San Fran or LA is such that only an expert such as yourself might be able to discern it.

The difference between good Mexican food in California or the southwest vs. good Mexican food here is such that even a nabe such as me might be able to tell.  As a matter of fact, I recently cooked 2 of the 7 moles of Oxaca here at home - they were both fundamentally better than any I could have gotten in a restaurant here in NY - as were my homemade tortillas.

I think you'd be able to tell the difference between high-end Japanese in NY and the west coast - maybe not on execution, but certainly on variety - The right route through Midtown east or the east village will reveal as much as a town worth of a train stop back on the home island... the fact is that you ask 99 out of 100 Americans if they eat Japanese and they will respond "no because I don't eat raw fish!" which is the equivalent of asking someone if they like French cuisine and them responding "no because I don't eat snails!"

Mitch, I'd love to try your molé, but LPS chimes in with my original contention, that you could do a lot worse than the high end in NYC for Mexican.... but I'll let you 2 fight it out!

[SobaAddict70]

From the more recent "reviews" of Babbo, that's a role of the dice, no? Unless it's the "chef" you're after - you might be better off with a nicely put together meal at Otto - and then there's that fine gelato for dessert.

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A "capsule" review of Babbo marketed towards out-of-towners [as I've mentioned on another food forum]:

1. The door guy is obnoxious.

2. There's really hardly any room to eat at the bar -- BUT if you're not able to procure a reservation, that's the place to be.

3. Downstairs is a scene.

4. Upstairs is relatively civilized.

5. Pasta tasting menu is wall-to-wall butter. Not that there's anything wrong with that.    It's just that for most nonfoodies, this will be orgasmic. The rest of us know better.

6. Antipasti/primi are strong. Secondi falls flat [in my opinion].

7. The music is atrocious. Mario sure likes his Pink Floyd though.

8. There's better Italian in New York.      Go for the experience and then tell us about it.