Imagine the ultimate burger joint

[Kent Wang]

From what I have read, a burger made from freshly ground meat is much better. Why then are there no restaurants -- that I know of -- that grind their beef in house? Surely a grinder isn't very expensive.

A charcoal or wood grilled burger also tastes much better than the flat griddle I've seen everywhere. Why aren't there joints that employ a grill?

Sure these features drive up the price a bit, maybe $2 more per burger at the most, but I think there is a market for it. Everyone loves burgers. Nearly every city has multiple restaurants claiming to serve the best burger in town. Surely in at least the biggest cities, there exists a market for the super-premium burger?

[Theo_Bromine]

Try McDonalds (Formerly McDavid's) in Israel. They are some of the best burgers I have had. The McRoyal is about 5" diameter and at least 3/4' thick. Everything is fresh (most shops are Kosher so no shake with the burger).

If you grind top grade meat fresh, where will all the cow ears, butts and faces go?

[Fat Guy]

I'm not sure I agree with either proposition, Kent.

Beef ground in-house is fairly common at good burger places. Once you subtract out the places that totally don't care about quality (the majority, of course) and use frozen preformed patties, even at the chain level, you can go into any Fuddruckers and there will be a glass wall looking on to the room where they grind their beef. However, I'm not sure in-house grinding is specifically the point that differentiates a great burger. The bigger issue is, I think, the time lag between grinding and cooking. If a restaurant grinds its beef at 8am and cooks a burger with that beef at 8pm, that's no better than ordering the beef from a distributor that grinds beef in the morning and delivers it to restaurants throughout the day. It's no better than buying it at a supermarket that grinds once a day, and indeed many supermarkets grind several times a day (even the Food Lion where I was just staying at the beach in North Carolina had that grinder going all day). What really makes a difference, as I learned when performing this experiment a few years ago with a friend, is grinding the meat within a few minutes of cooking. That's what no restaurant seems to do, but I can see the difficulty of pulling that off from a labor perspective. Also, most burger places -- even the best ones -- use pre-formed patties, again in part because of labor but also probably in part because they don't want to be working with raw ground beef at the same time hot food preparation is occurring. That's not likely to survive a health inspection, unless you really build your facility with totally separate spaces for those functions the way Fuddruckers does (Fuddruckers burgers, while not world class, are probably the best chain burgers -- though they do use pre-formed patties). Also, all this matters mostly for thick, rare or medium-rare burgers. Thinner burgers that are cooked through aren't going to differ as much when using beef that's a few hours older.

In terms of cooking, charcoal grills are overrated for hamburger cookery. Or, rather, they only help with certain kinds of hamburgers. If you're making a big, thick, 10-ounce steakhouse-style burger, then I think a burger like that comes out better when cooked on a grill than on a griddle, although I don't think charcoal is any better than gas for this purpose and, indeed, a professional upright broiler may be the best tool. But smaller, thinner burgers come out better, I think, on a flat griddle.

Ultimately, though, the answer to your underlying question is probably that not enough customers give a crap. Using your US$2 estimate as a hypothetical example, the point would be that more customers want to pay $2 less for a burger than care about having a burger that's $2 better. So what's the incentive for a place to do everything right? It would have to be personal motivation and vision, or a burger place would have to be smack in the middle of an educated foodie community.

[annecros]

In terms of cooking, charcoal grills are overrated for hamburger cookery. Or, rather, they only help with certain kinds of hamburgers. If you're making a big, thick, 10-ounce steakhouse-style burger, then I think a burger like that comes out better when cooked on a grill than on a griddle, although I don't think charcoal is any better than gas for this purpose and, indeed, a professional upright broiler may be the best tool. But smaller, thinner burgers come out better, I think, on a flat griddle.

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Absolute heresy. I'm going to pretend you didn't say that. A great burger needs smoke from the gristly, greasy, slimy goodness dropping and dripping on the hot coals and vaporizing.

Gas? What is this gas that you speak of? Propane is great post hurricane, but not my choice for grilling purposes. In fact, we lay in charcoal every June as part of our hurricane preps.

Of course, I don't do smaller, flatter burgers. Not sure they are worth the trouble.

I also have a penchant for steamed burgers with a ton of sharp cheddar, but that is an entirely different thing.

[FlourPower]

From what I have read, a burger made from freshly ground meat is much better. Why then are there no restaurants -- that I know of -- that grind their beef in house? Surely a grinder isn't very expensive.

There's a new book devoted to this very subject: Hamburger America. The author went across the country to burger joints and one of the "rules" was that they had to use fresh, not frozen, meat. It's an interesting book and it's also got his documentary DVD of the same name with it. There are plenty of places that do just what you describe.

[Toliver]

If you're ever in Ann Arbor, Magus grinds his own:

Burger helper, First Class Burger

[Reignking]

That's why Five Guys is so good -- fresh ground beef.

[Holly Moore]

I'd rather work with a trusted, quality meat purveyor than grind my own. Better likelihood of consistency. Can still get great flavor if the mix is right. Probably less sanitation issues.

Wells, a local and highly regarded Philadelphia meat purveyor, maintains that they can form a looser, more consistent patty than those formed by hand. I still favor the old Steak and Shake approach - scoop of beef hurled at grill and artfully flattened with a spatula. Showmanship and a skilled grillman can keep the patties consistent and loose.

Nothing wrong with a grill for burgers. If for some reason I was forced to serve an 8 ounce or larger burger I'd probably opt for a salamander. Good flavor from the fat spattering up to the gas fired heating elements and back to the burger. For a four to siz ounce burger I'd consider grilling it in a cast iron skillet with butter. Just like busy breakfast restaurants can turn out eggs from frying pans, so can a burger place use individual skillets if properly set up.

Bread has to be a consideration for the ultimate burger joint. I'm netting out on a Thomas' English Muffin as the ideal bread for a great burger. Nice crunch to contrast the burger texture, nooks and crannies for the juices, not overwhelmingly bready, and up to the task of delivering a juicy burger to the mouth without falling apart. Toasted or caramelized, buttered, basic hamburger buns work fine. I wouldn't use any bread product where it was more about the bread than the burger.

Condiments would be scarce. I'd try not to offer ketchup, bottled or home made. Tomatoes only in season. Bermuda or Vadalia onions sliced just right - thick enough to hold shape, not so thick as they would overwhelm the burger. A mustard that compliments rather than overpowers the burger. And, red relish. Red relish really works with a medium rare hamburger.

And the sides. The ultimate burger joint needs fresh cut, twice fried french fries and breaded or battered onion rings. Fried mushrooms too. All fresh, not frozen.

And a real, real-good vanilla milkshake. And a slice of home made pie for dessert.

Edited April 24, 2008 by Holly Moore (log)

[Daniel Rogov]

Try McDonalds (Formerly McDavid's) in Israel.  They are some of the best burgers I have had.  The McRoyal is about 5" diameter and at least 3/4' thick.  Everything is fresh (most shops are Kosher so no shake with the burger).

Theo, Hello....

I'm going to have to disagree with several of your points. First of all, McDavid's was never associated with nor did it ever become McDonalds. McDavid's was its own chain (about 15 outlets) and actually did quite well for more than a decade until local competition - "Burger Ranch" came along. And "Burger Ranch" did okay until McDonald's and Burger King came around.

As to the quality of the McDonalds burgers in Israel - all pre-formed, portion controlled and frozen when they arrive at the branches, I would have to suggest that without an adequate amount of whatever is in that abysmal sauce, the burgers themselves have no taste whatever.

Oh yes - most of the McDonalds in Israel are not kosher. All depends on where they are located.

[TarteTatin]

I still don't understand why I can't get a burger cooked the way I want ANYWHERE.

I love the burgers at Standard Tap in Philly. However, they just won't cook them Medium Rare to Rare. It comes out medium well. If I insist on telling them in advance that I'll send it back if its overcooked, I get it just about raw. Raw is not rare, nor medium rare.

Why can't anyone, anywhere, cook a burger medium rare to rare? What is so difficult?

I can do it at home!

Places serve steaks medium rare. Why not burgers?

[sherrid]

I live in Melbourne, Australia and we have such a "super-premium burger". Everyone who has tasted it all agree, it's absolutely delicious and thoroughly a taste experience. It's made with Blackmore Wagu Beef and just melts in the mouth and has the most wonderful flavour. In fact, it's so good, you don't even need fries. It has the right combination of texture too, slight crunch to the bun while maintaining a soft inside, juicy medium rare burger patty, crispy bacon, fresh salad, velvety cheese...oh my! This burger from Neil Perry's Rockpool Bar and Grill looks like this:

http://www.rockpoolbarandgrill.com.au/rpm_menu.aspx?menu=bar

If you are ever in Melbourne or if you live in Melbourne and are yet to try this masterpiece, you better run!!!

Here is a little about the beef:

http://www.blackmorewagyu.com.au/wagyu/?id...Chewing-The-Fat

Edited April 28, 2008 by sherrid (log)

[WiscoNole]

Imagine the ultimate burger joint? Easy - it's in Madison Square Park in NYC.

[Timh]

I think the self grinding is a sanitation and health department issue. With HACCP guidelines, the grinding needs to be done in a temperature controlled room, quite the expense. Maybe not in every state or municipality, but at least the many I 've lived in.

[rhrad]

I don't know if they grind their own meat, but Weber Grill Restaurants have a bunch of these monsters lined up in their open kitchen. On their site they mention going through 1 ton of charcoal each day to fuel their kitchens' grills.

I haven't had their burgers (meatloaf & brisket called out to me both times I've been there), but friends who've ordered them seemed pretty happy with them.

[Tiny]

Imagine the ultimate burger joint?  Easy - it's in Madison Square Park in NYC.

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While Shake Shack is very good, I personally prefer Burger Joint in the Parker Meridian....