How to throw a dinner party w/chinese food

[Popcorn]

So this is I imagine a somewhat unique question. I am going to responsible for throwing a dinner party for my tai chi instructor's tai chi instructor's tai chi instructor in a couple of months. This person speaks no English and only rarely comes to the U.S. and *really* prefers Chinese food (or at least has always chosen to eat in Chinese restaurants when I've been around).

In the past I've seen him eat plenty of steamed fish w/matchsticked ginger and some kind of sauce on it, ma po tofu (with pork), and sea cucumber, so I know he's not a vegetarian, but he obviously values healthy eating...

So I'm trying to figure out a menu that will be both impressive and feasible, for somewhere between 8-12 people. With essentially one worthwhile burner with regard to wok cooking.

I have the Land of Plenty cookbook, a fair amount of experience cooking from it, and access to a decent asian grocery. What I don't know is how a dinner like this is structured/served, nor how to go about cooking it (timing wise). Nor how to choose complementary courses. Nor... just about anything else it would seem.

Any suggestions?

[Popcorn]

to follow up, one question I specifically have is on the number of dishes. If this were an american dinner party I might make a roast or what have you, and mammoth portions of a vegetable or two and a starch or two. Does this follow for chinese food? Should I shoot for a large quantity of two or three recipes or a smaller amount of, let's say, 7-10 recipes?

Thanks!

[Ben Hong]

Get thee to a caterer, or pick a nice restaurant that serves real Chinese food. Seriously.

I worked in the profession for a looong time, and even with that experience, your "dinner party" would intimidate the hell out of me, if I had to do it at home with equipment of questionable utility. Besides, paying for the honour would free you from worry and work, allowing you to enjoy the company of your guests. The vast majority of Chinese take their guests to restaurants (unless they're family) when entertaining them for the first time. There are cultural and style nuances that I won't get into here.

[Gastro888]

Oh wow...only one working range?

No, the rules for Western dinner parties do not apply to Chinese dinner parties. You have a bunch of entrees, each with a different aspect to it.

[trillium]

If this guy is Singaporean, it would be a surprise to me if he only eats southern Chinese food. Most Singaporeans I know also consider south Indian and Malay food to be "Singaporean" too. I can't help you with Sichuan arrangements but I would guess it unlikely that an ethnic Chinese from Singapore was from that region.

On the other hand, if you really want to do this, I suggest reading something like Wisdom of the Chinese Kitchen, which will educate you to how southern Chinese dinners get planned in the home (fancy dinners are a different story). Very briefly, for a dinner for two, you'd have 2 or 3 dishes, at least one being a vegetable. For each person, you add another dish. You try to balance the stir-fried foods with steamed foods, the oily foods with more cooling ones, and there is usually a soup. There is no way that everything would be stir-fried. If you live in a large city, and want to do a homestyle dinner, you can make use of a Chinese BBQ place, and supplement some of your homecooking with roast duck, soya sauce chicken or roast pork. If you're trying to do a formal honor dinner, I'd go with Ben's advice. I wouldn't do it at home either.

regards,

trillium

[sheetz]

Definitely agree with Ben's suggestion. If you live in a major city with a large Chinese population, you should be able to put together a fine Chinese meal as long as you as you are able to convince the restaurant managers that you want REAL Chinese food! I'm sure he'll be plenty impressed if you are able to pull that off.

OTOH, if you are adamant about fixing this yourself, there's an excellent book, The Chinese Kitchen, by Eileen Yin Fei Lo, which contains a lot of recipes for special occasion dishes, some of which are actually doable for a person without lots of Chinese cooking experience! Plenty of things can be done ahead of time and you do have a few months to practice. Cantonese formal dinners normally revolve around animal proteins: fish, chicken, duck, pork, and shellfish, with not a whole lot of vegetables. I don't know if this kind of menu would be appropriate for your guest.

[Gastro888]

I agree - go to a restaurant. It is a HUGE undertaking to cook a Chinese feast at home if you've never done it before. Timing's critical as you want to get the wok hay but it's hard to get the breath of a wok in a home kitchen.

[Dejah]

The vast majority of Chinese take their guests to restaurants (unless they're family) when entertaining them for the first time. There are cultural and style nuances that I won't get into here.

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So, Ben, I guess you are considered "family"?

BTW, your other Manitoba family is coming for the day on the 7th of May. I guess I'll try to work on the dan tart before they come. Also, I'll make my siu mai for lunch time along with jook, etc.

Edited April 28, 2005 by Dejah (log)

[Popcorn]

okay, catering/restaurant sounds like the way to go. Thanks all for the advice... I'm still not totally giving up the idea of trying something like this. But it's probably best to try it out a few times on willing friends before an undertaking like this.

[SuzySushi]

I agree with the Chinese restaurant advice. Sounds like you want a kind of banquet menu. Most restaurants provide them, with a balanced selection of dishes and fancier foods than their regular menu offers.

[sheetz]

I'm still not totally giving up the idea of trying something like this.  But it's probably best to try it out a few times on willing friends before an undertaking like this.

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Maybe we can have a cook-off featuring banquet style dishes. There are some dishes that can be prepared relatively easily at home.

[Ben Hong]

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[Gastro888]

I'm still not totally giving up the idea of trying something like this.  But it's probably best to try it out a few times on willing friends before an undertaking like this.

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Maybe we can have a cook-off featuring banquet style dishes. There are some dishes that can be prepared relatively easily at home.

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Like what? I can't picture jai gee gai being easily prepared at home...

[Jaymes]

Having entertained LOTS of foreign visitors, the first thing I'd do is to ask your guest if he really does prefer Chinese food when being entertained in foreign homes. It's possible that he's only eating in Chinese restaurants because that's all he knows and he's unsure what else to try. I wouldn't assume he only is interested in the food he grew up on.

I assumed that only once. Had a bunch of Iranian fighter pilots over. Made Iranian food. They were obviously disappointed. They'd been hoping for a "really good typical American home meal." Instead they got mediocre food from their own country.

Can't tell where you're from by your post, but for the sake of argument, let's say you're American, and if you were visiting China, wouldn't you hope for some good homestyle Chinese food, typical of what they'd normally serve, and knew how to fix? Or would you rather have poorly-prepared fried chicken, with lumpy mashed potatoes, bland baked beans, and watery cole slaw that they'd made in an attempt to recreate the stuff from your country?

The guy might really want you to make a stab at Chinese. Or he might really want you to get more restaurant Chinese food like he already has access to.

Or he might want you to go all out and treat him to something he probably rarely gets -- a glimpse of typical homestyle cuisine of the country he's visiting.

I'm just saying....I'd ask.

PS - We invited the Iranian fighter pilots back over. That time, we'd learned our lesson. We had a backyard BBQ. They loved it. Took lots of pictures, including taking turns wearing the "Kiss the Cook" apron, holding the BBQ tongs, standing over the grill and grinning like mischievous little boys.

Edited April 29, 2005 by Jaymes (log)

[canucklehead]

I agree with Jaymes.

When I first got to California - after working in HK for a number of years, my co-workers took me out to the fanciest Chinese restaurant they could thing of. It was terrible.

See what your Tai Chi instructor would prefer. If home cooking is okay - keep the flavors simple and light and don't do anything that would require a lot of last minute fussing. Grilled meats or vegetables would be good. Singaporeans call handle heat in their food - so something spicy to wake up the taste buds would be good. I find that for Southern Chinese people - Italian/Tuscan style food (in the Marcella Hazan vein) is something that is quite enjoyable.

If it must be Chinese - then go to a place that will cater, but pick food that travels well and does not need to be super piping hot (this may be a difficult thing as most Chinese food is best "right out of the wok"). Fried rice and a noodle dish as starches is good.

Either way - finish the meal with fruit. Most Chinese are not huge fans of sweet sweet desserts and really enjoy seasonal fresh fruit.

[hzrt8w]

Can't tell where you're from by your post, but for the sake of argument, let's say you're American, and if you were visiting China, wouldn't you hope for some good homestyle Chinese food, typical of what they'd normally serve, and knew how to fix?  Or would you rather have poorly-prepared fried chicken, with lumpy mashed potatoes, bland baked beans, and watery cole slaw that they'd made in an attempt to recreate the stuff from your country?

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Jaymes: I agree with you that Popcorn should test the water and see what meal the guest of honor prefers before deciding on the best dinner arrangement.

However, we Chinese have a different viewpoint about eating in a foreign country. While your example illustrates how some Americans travelling in China would prefer to have local Chinese food. Chinese who are touring in America may not think in a reciprocal way. Most Chinese prefer Chinese meals wherever they travel - even with the understanding that what the Chinese food they get in a foreign country may be inferior to what they can get at home. (Of course, Chinese food is the best! ) Seriously, most Chinese prefer to stick to what they are comfortable with and are less adventurous in food sampling.

You can see that most Hong Kong based tours traveling in European countries (or USA/Canada) would emphasize "dining in Chinese restaurants every night" throughout the whole trip as a marketing point (rather than "trying out the exotic local meals every night"). Since Chinese restaurants are pretty much everywhere, so it is not too difficult to arrange.

And... being that Chinese are more implicit, Popcorn you probably don't want to ask the guest directly. As if you do, he will say "it's up to you, I'll eat anything". (mostly for being polite). So the burden is back on your shoulder to figure this out. You probably want to check indirectly and ask those who knows him well, or ask the organizer of the trip what your guest prefers.

Popcorn: It is admirable that you think of cooking a full Chinese course at home. But to do it well, this is a major undertaking. Mostly because: (1) you need special equipment to cook Chinese food well (high-heat burners, wok, steamers, etc..) and (2) timing is very crucial. See, Chinese do not like eating food cold. Stir-fried dishes have to come right out of the kitchen and go quickly to the dinner table. With a typical of 8 courses in a banquet-style Chinese meal, and each entrie should be served within 5 minutes of each other, it challenges even the most experienced Chinese chef doing by him/herself, let along doing this in a home environment. Besides, if you spend most of your energies preparing and cooking the meal, who does the hosting?

Unless you just want to serve 2 to 3 entries and along with some BBQ/fried-rice/noodles take-out items as supplements, your best bet would probably either hire a caterer or treat in a Chinese restaurant. I would opt for the former choice if I have a nice home and I want to entertain with more than just a meal. (e.g. with live music or Tai-Chi demonstration or something)

Edited April 29, 2005 by hzrt8w (log)

[Tepee]

  Most Chinese prefer Chinese meals wherever they travel - even with the understanding that what the Chinese food they get in a foreign country may be inferior to what they can get at home.  (Of course, Chinese food is the best!      )    Seriously, most Chinese prefer to stick to what they are comfortable with and are less adventurous in food sampling. 

You can see that most Hong Kong based tours traveling in European countries (or USA/Canada) would emphasize "dining in Chinese restaurants every night" throughout the whole trip as a marketing point (rather than "trying out the exotic local meals every night"). 

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Right you are!! I know some folks who will just die without chinese food for more than a day! <---- Like my parents.

Popcorn, if you still want to follow the cooking route, use all the different resources for cooking in your kitchen. Here's a humble suggestion:

Night before

If it's summer by the time they arrive, a cold dessert like almond bean curd would be much appreciated.

In the morning

Do a good soup, one with a clear, good stock would be more elegant....use your crockpot.

Make a rich wholesome stew or braised select mushroom...if the crockpot is occupied, do you have a thermal pot?

In the afternoon

A herbful beggar's chicken can be done in the oven.

Lotus Leaf Rice can also be prepared before hand. You may want to have a trial run on this to get the texture right. Noodles are trickier.

With the above done before hand....that leaves you time to

Just before guests arrive

...steam a very fresh fish. Top with lots of blended and salted ginger. Drizzle lightly with sesame oil and light soy sauce. You want to able to taste the sweetness of the fish.

Simple quick-blanched greens topped with oyster sauce, shredded dried scallops (or even fresh scallops in which case you'd want to keep it whole) and fried shallots. Note: we like our greens to look a healthy vibrant green. Do not boil it to death. Loh Hon Chai is a good veg dish, more complex but can be prepared an hour before.

Fresh Cut Fruit.

I think it's do-able! Go for it!

Edited April 29, 2005 by Tepee (log)

[Jaymes]

This is turning into a mighty interesting thread. Not only for the food ideas, but also for cultural insights.

I sure hope you keep us apprised, Popcorn, as you work your way through this project.

[Jaymes]

Popcorn, if you still want to follow the cooking route, use all the different resources for cooking in your kitchen. Here's a humble suggestion:

Whether or not Popcorn gives this menu a try, I think I'M definitely going to.

[Susan G]

In Chinese banquets I've attended, soup was always served, and it was always the penultimate course - right before the fruit. Bitter melon in chicken broth was the summer soup of choice, but springtime might have another, better choice.

Edited April 29, 2005 by Susan G (log)

[hzrt8w]

In Chinese banquets I've attended, soup was always served, and it was always the penultimate course - right before the fruit.  Bitter melon in chicken broth was the summer soup of choice, but springtime might have another, better choice.

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That's rather interesting. It is totally different from the Chinese custom.

In formal Cantonese banquets in Hong Kong, the "soup" is usually shark-fin soup which is the 4th/5th (I forgot) course. The eighth course is usually fried chicken, right after steamed fish, followed by the "starch" like fried noodles/fried rice and such.

In Cantonese banquets in USA, things are altered a bit. They usually bring out "soup" (such as West Lake beef soup, crab-meat asparagus soup, etc.) as the first course. In casual dining in USA, they would bring out the "house soup" before the main course arrive.

I have not seen soup seved at the end, unless you are talking about the "dessert soup" such as red bean dessert soup, or cantaloupe soup with tapioca, etc..

[Tepee]

The typical order of a chinese banquet menu (although I won't say the menu I suggested above is 'banquet') in Msia:

Hors d'oeuvres

Soup

Chicken*

Prawns*

Fish*

Veg

Rice/Noodles

Dessert/Fruit

*The order of the proteins could be interchangeable.

Well, if you're serving this at home, and if you have a big enough table, I don't see why you can't bring on the whole lot!

Edited April 29, 2005 by Tepee (log)

[JasonTrue]

There are several cold dishes that might be nice also: braised tiny bamboo shoots with chilies and garlic might be very nice if you can get frozen or fresh young sprouts. It's about the right time of year for fresh ones, I think.

Thin strips of lightly salt-seasoned simmered kelp, with some garlic in heated oil (not burned) and drizzled on the kelp, then marinated overnight, is also very nice.

In Beijing I've had all sorts of cold dishes, mostly simple, sometimes not. Some wonderful, some not... In Taipei some restaurant I went to served blanched asparagus with squeeze bottle mayonnaise...

I think I had a cold dish of marinated wheat gluten from a Shanghai-style restaurant in Hong Kong, which was a little sweet for my taste but my Shanghai friend seemed to like it.

In the US it seems that cold Chinese dishes are often neglected. I don't know if this is because of US taste preferences or if it's some other reason. I find some of these dishes quite refreshing.

When I entertained Hong Kong business visitors, I usually tried to take them to restaurants where they could try many small dishes of good quality rather than risk ordering huge portions of potentially mediocre food. I went to an excellent Mexican restaurant in Ballard (Seattle) that does small plates of Oaxacan food, a good Northwesty place called Lark, and in the Bay Area, a Little Italy place.

At the one home-cooked dinner I did for them back in December, I played my strengths and went with seasonal foods that are just staples in my repertoire, one or two of which would have been at home on a Chinese table. I would recommend doing this.

I made a pizza with sage pesto, chanterelles, and thin slices of eggplant, a mixed green salad with yuzu vinaigrette, a little squash-potato soup, some grilled mushrooms with basil and garlic, and some green beans with lion’s mane mushrooms and ginger. We finished off the pear sorbet that I had also made previously. I served a quince liqueur and a lychee liqueur I had made. These were roundly successful: everyone in the group had at least two favorites, and nobody left hungry. For the next week or so that we were traveling together, they would ask me to find a restaurant serving something like one of the dishes that I had made.

Don't serve huge portions of one type of food that might not match your guests' tastes, but don't try to completely overreach your usual culinary range. Make a few small things that are simple and pleasant, one or two things that are a challenge for you and maybe a reference to your guests' food culture, and nothing that will hold you up in the kitchen (I often neglect this last point myself), and have something to nibble on while your guests are waiting for you to finish up in the kitchen.

For years I've been entertaining with dishes that are made with a consciousness of my non-American friends' taste preferences. But this doesn't necessarily mean making dishes that are exactly like home; it means knowing things like Japanese tend to like simple refreshing flavors, Chinese usually crave variety and like a balance of heavy, strong, and light dishes, etc. My Japanese guests usually like hearing about the ingredients or where the ingredients come from (it makes the food taste better); my Chinese guests tend to appreciate this, but they tend to eat with their mouths first.

Unless you've spent some time in Asia trying to pull off a completely Chinese dinner might be a risky endeavor. In my early days cooking Asian food I occasionally nailed something, but often enough got polite smiles for things that didn't seem quite right. (I still mess something up often enough, but usually I can tell, and usually I'm more critical than my guests). I think it's an excellent idea to recognize your guests' culinary frame of reference, but it would be a shame not to show off what you're already best at cooking.

My local Chinese friends cook fairly simply when entertaining, with some dishes that can be made ahead, and just invest in one or two special dishes. (Then again, the occasions are more casual).

Edited typo

Edited April 29, 2005 by JasonTrue (log)

[sheetz]

I'm still not totally giving up the idea of trying something like this.  But it's probably best to try it out a few times on willing friends before an undertaking like this.

←

Maybe we can have a cook-off featuring banquet style dishes. There are some dishes that can be prepared relatively easily at home.

←

Like what? I can't picture jai gee gai being easily prepared at home...

←

Actually, I've made jah gee gai at home, albeit only a half one. It wasn't bad.

Other banquet style dishes one could prepare at home include: roast or braised duck, gold coin jade tree chicken, beggars chicken, 5 spice beef. Eileen Lo's cookbook has lots of recipes for banquet dishes.

[sheetz]

Popcorn, everything hzrt8w said is right on.

The more I think about this, the more I think you should go for a more casual affair. If you are doing this in your home, then probably the best bet would be to arrange it buffet style, including some Chinese dishes along with some non-Chinese that you do well and which can be prepared well in advance. Good luck, and please keep us informed of your decision!

Edited April 29, 2005 by sheetz (log)