Roast Duck: Tips, Techniques & Tradition

[Tepee]

.. I think this made a difference in the texture as the duck skin was never rough.

No one makes a duck like Pops does.  <happy sigh> 

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Lucky you, Gastro!

On the duck skin not being rough....can that not be achieved by constant basting and turning the bird?

Edited October 5, 2005 by Tepee (log)

[muichoi]

I think basting is a no-no.I clean the Duck,scaldit with boiling water, put salt(about 1 tbsp) and five-spice powder on the inside,brush the dried skin with a maltose-vinegar-water solution, then hang the duck up until it's dry to the touch,which can take a while. Then I roast it-unfortunately my oven's not big enough to hang the duck in,and I think this is the problem.

[origamicrane]

Then I roast it-unfortunately my oven's not big enough to hang the duck in,and I think this is the problem.

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bingo!

you need a bigger oven

go on!! be tempted

[muichoi]

It was the charcoal-burning oven I was tempted by.

[Dejah]

The oven my uncle used in his restaurant was a big square unit that sat at eye level. He'd blanch the ducks with a hot water bath containing honey, star anise, salt, MSG.

The ducks were air-dried, then stuffed with a mixture of meen see, star anise, ginger, garlic cloves. Their butts were skewered and tied close so the marinate doesn't ooze out. The ducks were hung vertically on hooks on a rotating rack. They are turning all the while roasting. They always turned out well rounded in colour and flavour. The skin was not crispy, but it had a nice sheen.

I have tried to roast mine hanging, but, as with muichoi, my oven is big, but still not big enough to allow the heat to work its magic.

Haven't made it for years...oven gets messy, even tho I DO have self -cleaning!

[Tepee]

It was the charcoal-burning oven I was tempted by.

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This I have to see! Does anyone have a picture? It sounds like an outdoor oven to me.

Looks as if without a proper purpose-built oven, there is no way we can replicate the crispiness. Will our oven produce an acceptable duck? <insert hopeful look>

[Tepee]

Did some quick sleuthing....

I came across one site which says the duck is roasted in a big barrel-shaped charcoal burning oven, whereas another said, in Beijing, it was traditionally done in a peachwood and cherrywood-burning oven. Both of them would, I presume, give a special flavor to the duck.

Para 11 of this site describes how the duck is prepared.

Now I see why it can't be done in our home ovens.

[Gastro888]

Lucky you, Gastro!

On the duck skin not being rough....can that not be achieved by constant basting and turning the bird?

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No no no, no basting! You have to blanch the skin with boiling water and it must be in a vertical oven. It cannot be horizontal.

If I ever win the lottery, I'm rebuilding my parents' house and putting in a REAL Chinese kitchen, complete with a vertical restaurant oven so Pops can make ribs and duck. Oh yeah and an outdoor wood-burning wok stove, too.

Screw having a pool!

Edited October 5, 2005 by Gastro888 (log)

[mudbug]

Oh boy... have to remind myself not to visit eGullet before having eaten.

[origamicrane]

If I ever win the lottery, I'm rebuilding my parents' house and putting in a REAL Chinese kitchen, complete with a vertical restaurant oven so Pops can make ribs and duck.  Oh yeah and an outdoor wood-burning wok stove, too.

Screw having a pool! 

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don't forget the steam oven

[sheetz]

No no no, no basting!  You have to blanch the skin with boiling water and it must be in a vertical oven.  It cannot be horizontal.

What about those countertop rotisserie ovens?

I don't know if I want to try roasting a duck considering the size of my oven. I might want to try a steamed or braised duck, like the West Lake Duck that many cantonese restaurants serve. Anyone have a good recipe for that?

[Gastro888]

Nope. Won't work. The fat will pool at the bottom of the duck and you won't get the crisp skin which is what "faw op" is known for. I mean, you COULD do it, but it's not going to be the same, ya know?

[hzrt8w]

I might want to try a steamed or braised duck, like the West Lake Duck that many cantonese restaurants serve. Anyone have a good recipe for that?

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What is a "West Lake Duck"?

I don't think I have come across this term before. How does the duck look and taste and served with?

[hzrt8w]

What about those countertop rotisserie ovens?

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I had borrowed one of those countertop rotisserie ovens from my BIL to make BBQ pork once. It was a disaster. Maybe the brand he bought was no good.

Don't believe all the hype you see in Infomercials. These small ovens work very poorly or don't work at all.

The one that I used... the skewers kept falling off the rack when the wheel was turning! Imagine that! How was I supposed to roast something when the roaster kept falling apart?

Since they say you have to roast a duck vertically (which makes sense because the excess fat/oil would drain along the vertical rod away from the duck), I don't think those countertop rotisserie ovens (all with horizontal rotating wheels from what I've seen) would work.

[sheetz]

I might want to try a steamed or braised duck, like the West Lake Duck that many cantonese restaurants serve. Anyone have a good recipe for that?

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What is a "West Lake Duck"?

I don't think I have come across this term before. How does the duck look and taste and served with?

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This is called Sai Woh duck in Cantonese. It's a common banquet item. The duck is either steamed or braised until tender and then completely deboned. Usually has some other veggies like bamboo shoots, mushrooms, etc.

[hzrt8w]

This is called Sai Woh duck in Cantonese. It's a common banquet item. The duck is either steamed or braised until tender and then completely deboned. Usually has some other veggies like bamboo shoots, mushrooms, etc.

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Very interesting. I don't think I had this before. I wonder how they tie it in with West Lake (Sai Woo). Would this be a Hangzhou speciality originally?

[Dejah]

This is called Sai Woh duck in Cantonese. It's a common banquet item. The duck is either steamed or braised until tender and then completely deboned. Usually has some other veggies like bamboo shoots, mushrooms, etc.

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Very interesting. I don't think I had this before. I wonder how they tie it in with West Lake (Sai Woo). Would this be a Hangzhou speciality originally?

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That's what I was told about West Lake duck, West Lake tang, West lake etc, etc...tied to Sai Woo.

[wesza]

In Hong Kong there are different variations of "Roast Duck". The one step that is universally applied is to allow the duck to hang vertical after blanching with circulating [fan] air until it sets and dries before finishing.

Many places to provide crispy skin use the air pump method to loosen the skin on the carcass. With Peking Duck the Ducks are dressed differently with a minimal opening that is sewed closed so that the Duck is almost air tight. The blanching and air drying are also more extensive. They are only served as Whole Duck in most Restaurants in the classical traditional manner of three courses with only the Soup sometimes being different. The only place I have ever seen a 1/2 Peking Duck served is at some American Restaurants, but I have never ordered it that way myself.

The Regular Duck that is prepared only at Restaurants that specialize in Roasting and Barbecue Items is dressed regularly with a opening. They are lightly seasoned and placed on extended Steel Skewers for hanging in a vertical Roast Oven. A Water pan is placed at the bottom of the oven to catch the fat as it drips from the Ducks sending steam that keeps the Ducks moist and allow the Fats to drip from the Birds.

When the Ducks are about 3/4 Roasted they are then Brushed or Wiped with a Glaze that different at most Roasters but often contains Sorghum, Maltose, Sugar, Treacle, Dark or Superior Soy Sauce, Honey, Five Spice and especially some Apricot Jam or Puree. This gives the Ducks there Shiny , Glazed Exterior and lets the Skin tighten up and Crisps. These Ducks have always been my favorite, and keep their taste as long as they aren't refrigerated just hanging ready to be cut up and served.

The other most common method used is that done at Hawkers/Tai Pai Tungs or Restaurants that are not located near to a Roaster but wish to serve Duck dishes.

The Ducks are done the same as for the Roasters, including being placed on vertical type skewers. The cooking process is different as these Ducks are cooked individually in a large deep Wok by Baste Frying partially covered in Hot Oil.

Ducks are constantly held by the end of the vertical skewer placed over the hot oil so that they are always being rotated and basted by the oil that drips down the carcass from top draining to the bottom. The Cook is skilled and lets each Duck Cook according to its fat content and how moist the exterior feels during Basting.

When they are about 1/2 finished the Ducks are held hanging on a rack long enough to set the meat and juices. They are then Brushed and Wiped with a similar base used by the Roasters, returned to hang until the Glazed exteriors stop dripping.

The final step is to place the Ducks into another Wok with a higher temperature of oil, where they are continued to be Baste Fried only long enough until the skin tightens up and the exterior sets it's glaze. They are then hung up again and allowed to cool. In many smaller places this final step is only done when they receive a order from a customer. In many Chinese/European Style Restaurants that serve Roast Duck the carcass is split, backbone and ribs removed and the Duck is reheated and served with a complimentary sauce such as Roast Ducking with Cherry Sauce or whatever. It the main reason the Roast Duck tastes better at Hong Kong restaurants then even in Europe or France.

Goose may be prepared the same way but in Hong Kong and Taiwan "Chiu Chow Braised Goose", Rules served sliced over Clotted Goose Blood with a Garlic Vinegar Dipping Sauce.

Hope this explains about the variations of Duck being served in Hong Kong, and the Goose Dish I miss most.

Even though it's now almost midnight in Seattle I now need to drive down to the International District where I will order several orders of "Roast Duck Mai Fun" as a night supper treat.

Irwin

Edited October 8, 2005 by wesza (log)

[muichoi]

Wesza, thanks-but are the ducks really hung to dry without some kind of (thin)glaze applied during the drying process? I think that's what happens here in the roasting places in Chinatown, unless the blanching liquid contains other ingredients which come to think of it is a distinct possibility,and the duck skin is left until dry to the touch. I've seen the skin being finished with a blow torch, and the skin is glazed after cooking with golden syrup(!) applied with a paintbrush. I know that if you order peking duck here it's finished by the frying method that you describe. I think 'Chiuchow braised goose' is far easier to make at home!

[Dejah]

unless the blanching liquid contains other ingredients which come to think of it is a distinct possibility,and the duck skin is left until dry to the touch.

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I mentioned the addition of honey to the blanching water in a previous post.

[Prawncrackers]

In response to the Siu Yook thread and in order not to throw that thread off topic... Here is a brand new topic on cooking one of my favourite dishes ever, Cantonese Roast Duck. Been making this dish for many years but i think it's only recently that i've been able to get it as good as shop-bought! After the last time i posted some pics of this dish i some got very positive responses. Well, i suppose it would be churlish not to share the recipe with one and all

The most important ingredient is the duck, it just has to be a Pekin. I have tried with other breeds such as Gressingham or Barbary which are delicious but unsuitable for this preparation. The best ones that i've found are the Silver Hill (!click!) ones. I don't know if they are available globally but if you ever see them in your freezer section, snaffle a couple immediately! They are very special, the quality control is amazing, every duck i've bought so far has been perfect.

The recipe is as follows:

1. Defrost your duck thoroughly and pat dry - this may take a day. Rub the cavity with a heaped tablespoon of fresh five-spice powder and a teaspoon of salt. Insert three scallions, a knob of ginger, 4 or 5 cloves of garlic, couple bayleaf and star anise. Zip the cavity up with a skewer.

2. Prepare in a large wok the basting solution: in four or five ladlefuls of boiling water add two tablespoons of honey and a splash of white vinegar.

3. Now comes the fun part, hang your duck over the wok and ladle the boiling liquid all over the skin for around five minutes. Try to avoid getting the liquid inside the duck, (this is why head-on ducks are preferable). It is at this stage over the years that i've accrued many duck hanging implements but a butchers hook is quite adequate. Keep the liquid boiling and be very careful.

4. Transfer to a cool dry place, let hang and dry overnight. I actually like to dry the duck with an automatic fan for as long as possible i.e. before i go to sleep. The next day your duck skin should be very dry and like parchment paper.

5. Roast on a rack in a large roasting tray in a preheated oven at 200C for 20min then turn down to 180C and roast for a further 60min. During the roasting you will need to lacquer it...

6. Prepare the lacquer as soon as the duck enters the oven: warm two tbsp of honey, one tbsp Chinese black vinegar and some water in small pan. Reduce or let down to get a good coating consistency and glaze your duck with a brush three or four times during the roasting.

7. Let your duck rest for at least 30mins before you attempt to carve it Chinese style. During resting, unzip the skewer, remove the aromatics and drain away any liquid.

I used to hang my duck in the oven to roast, but it was incredibly fiddly and i found that the top always cooked faster than the bottom - especially in a domestic oven. The honey and black vinegar mixture is my own personal trick to give the skin the perfect mahogany colour. The resting is very important, the longer the better. All in all i'm very happy with the results, the flesh is flavoursome & succulent and the skin crispy & sweet. Though of course there is always room for improvement, any suggestions would be very welcome. Always wanted to try pumping the skin to see if it makes much difference (might be one for origamicranenthal to try!)

[nibor]

Beautiful!!! Thanks for posting. Now I need a new toy - a butcher's hook.

[origamicrane]

Prawncrackers that looks so good!!

The recipe and method is pretty much the same as the one we use in our shop.

Think might be really hard to find a way to improve/ simplify this one.

But will be fun trying

The only things I can see that could be varied are the initial blanching liquid of the skin and the cooking times.

I will do a control test and cook one using standard recipe then cook another 2 ducks with a different blanching liquid.

I'm comparing this to our siu yook preparation where we blanched the skin with hot water then applied a denaturing chemical.

I am thinking blanch the duck with just hot water then brush the skin with one of the denaturing chemcial ie: lemon, vinegar, vodka, bicarbonate of soda solution, etc.

I might seriously try the bicycle pump thing, lucky for me I have an electric air compressor at home so that will help in the preparation.

Edited March 9, 2008 by origamicrane (log)

[insomniac]

I pretty much use PC's method but I have been known to dry the duck with my hairdryer when I was in a hurry.....worked OK

[sheetz]

That looks so good! I have to try this because we can't get freshly roasted ducks here.