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Pickling Spices

Suvir Saran

By Suvir Saran
in India: Cooking & Baking

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Suvir Saran

Suvir Saran

Posted
Posted

Not all spices come from India.

In fact.. there are some spices that today, seem like they must have always been Indian that do not come from India.

The temprate zone also gave spices.  Caraway is one.  Bay laurel another.

So would you guess as to what spices are Indian and what are non Indian spices?

Anyone?

Would be fun to see what we come up with.

Fat Guy

Fat Guy

Posted
Posted

I'm going to have to guess cumin comes from India, and if it doesn't I'm going to be very upset.

I'll also propose that anything based on dried hot peppers (would such a substance technically be a spice? We probably need a definition) comes from the Americas, and therefore is not native to India.

Steven A. Shaw aka "Fat Guy"
Co-founder, Society for Culinary Arts & Letters, sshaw@egstaff.org
Proud signatory to the eG Ethics code
Director, New Media Studies, International Culinary Center (take my food-blogging course)

Suvir Saran

Suvir Saran

Posted
  • Topic Starter
Posted

Chili Peppers come from the Americas as also Potatoes and Tomatoes.  All three are critical to Indian cooking today.  But were not used till very recently in Indias history.

Steven I would ask you to be ready to feel upset.

I await more responses before writing more about the spices... I want to see what the others have to say.. we have a great set of people here.. it is thrilling to be a part of this.

jhlurie

jhlurie

Posted
Posted

For the purposes of this discussion am I right in assuming that spices from Ceylon are being counted as Indian in origin?  Cinnamon, for example?

Vanilla is a "New World" spice, is it not, although also now grown in Asia, right?

Anise is Spanish.

Most varieties of Mint still are exclusive to North America.

Jon Lurie, aka "jhlurie"

  • 5 months later...
Brad S

Brad S

Posted
Posted

omg,spices

There is no doubt that cetian aromatic plants were used for cooking,while the use of others can be assumed from thier presence in ancient medicinal recipes,juniper,aniseed,coriander (loved by my ideal Apicius)cumin(Pliny writes of the difference between ethiipioan and theban)

The site of ma'adi unearthed fennel and fenugreek,and poppy seeds as well.

Pepper on the other hand was imported fron India from the first 2 centuries AD

Turnip Greens are Better than Nothing. Ask the people who have tried both.

Suvir Saran

Suvir Saran

Posted
  • Topic Starter
Posted
omg,spices

There is no doubt that cetian aromatic plants were used for cooking,while the use of others can be assumed from thier presence in ancient medicinal recipes,juniper,aniseed,coriander (loved by my ideal Apicius)cumin(Pliny writes of the difference between ethiipioan and theban)

The site of ma'adi unearthed fennel and fenugreek,and poppy seeds as well.

Pepper on the other hand was imported fron India from the first 2 centuries AD

Tell is more...

What else did Apicius say or do with and about spices???

Do you pickle stuff?

What are your favorite pickling spices? Do you use all the traditional ones? Or do you use your own blend?

Brad S

Brad S

Posted
Posted

crush together some pepper,lovage,oregano,bay leaf,coriander,and onions,moisten with honey,wine,garum and a little oil,heat and thicken with wheat starch.

This is one of over 400 recipes using 10 basic ingredients written by Apicius.

The order of importance is as follows

pepper,garum,olive oil,honey,lovage,vinegar,wine,cumin,rue and coriander.

Turnip Greens are Better than Nothing. Ask the people who have tried both.

Brad S

Brad S

Posted
Posted

Suvir,

sorry to not be specific.

garum which was first prepared in corinth and delos is a fermented fish condiment

Turnip Greens are Better than Nothing. Ask the people who have tried both.

Suvir Saran

Suvir Saran

Posted
  • Topic Starter
Posted

Now I am being educated as a classic chef would have been I presume.

Do all chefs that go to culinary school learn about these secrets and ancient ingredients and condiments???

Or was this one of your interests and is unique to you.

Suvir Saran

Suvir Saran

Posted
  • Topic Starter
Posted
garum which was first prepared in corinth and delos is a fermented fish condiment

Do people use Garum today?

How does one make it?

Or is it sold as a prepared ingredient?

Brad S

Brad S

Posted
Posted
Now I am being educated as a classic chef would have been I presume.

Do all chefs that go to culinary school learn about these secrets and ancient ingredients and condiments???

Or was this one of your interests and is unique to you.

Unique to me?

I doubt it,

I am just awe struck by the history of food and such. We learned a bit about this in culinary school J&W 1978/1980 :biggrin: long time ago.

I just enjoy trying to understand the evolution of the ingredients i'm blessed to use

Turnip Greens are Better than Nothing. Ask the people who have tried both.

Suvir Saran

Suvir Saran

Posted
  • Topic Starter
Posted
Unique to me?

I doubt it,

I am just awe struck by the history of food and such. We learned a bit about this in culinary school J&W 1978/1980  :biggrin: long time ago.

I just enjoy trying to understand the evolution of the ingredients i'm blessed to use

What other spice tales do you have?

Brad S

Brad S

Posted
Posted

LOL......trying them all is the SPICE of life.

Following the spice trail (or route) is a life time of discoveries.

I will share sooner then later

Turnip Greens are Better than Nothing. Ask the people who have tried both.

polly

polly

Posted
Posted
Do people use Garum today?

As far as I know, people don't make or use garum today.

When ancient recipes are translated for today, Thai fish sauce is often suggested as a substitute for garum.

From what I've read about it though, I imagine it to be even more pungent.

How sad; a house full of condiments and no food.

wingding

wingding

Posted
Posted

Last year,I visited a family, in Naples,Italy.The hostess was a well known cook in the city,and I asked her about garum.She showed me a crock of small fish,layered in a crock with salt,with a spigot to eventually draw out the macerated liquid-a modern form of garum.I also visited the town of Cetara,on the Amalfi coast,where colatura,a refined form of garum is still made commercially-it is used in local fish and pasta dishes,and I liked it.It is quite similar to Thai fish sauce.

polly

polly

Posted
Posted

Well there you go; learn a new thing every day..

Is it actually called garum in Italy?

How sad; a house full of condiments and no food.

wingding

wingding

Posted
Posted

The fish sauce product that's made commercially is called colatura.There is a restaurant in Pompei called Il Principe,where they are attempting to revive ancient Roman dishes,and are using garum...I'm wandering afar from India,aren't I....

Suvir Saran

Suvir Saran

Posted
  • Topic Starter
Posted
The fish sauce product that's made commercially is called colatura.There is a restaurant in Pompei called Il Principe,where they are attempting to revive ancient Roman dishes,and are using garum...I'm wandering afar from India,aren't I....

Wingding,

You are wandering into a territory that is all about spice and food. You are doing just fine. This thread was meant to bring out the many different pickling spices and their history and unique tales.

Please... this has been exciting. As Polly said above, we learn every day. :smile:

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