Piedmont Restaurants: Reviews & Recommendations

[Bill Klapp]

Thanks for your thoughts, Jonathan. I think that there is a real issue here only about Flipot, because, while I think that I have explained my personal philosophy well enough, I am also convinced that Flipot is outstanding when measured by ANY yardstick one would care to apply to it, including mine. I defend the right of Robert and Vedat to disagree with me (and vice versa, obviously), but at the same time, I feel that it is fair comment to note that they are rather dramatically out of step with the consistently rising critical opinions of Flipot over the past several years. Certainly, the restaurant critics are (and have been) all of one mind: two Michelin stars, making it no worse than one of the 27 best restaurants in Italy in Michelin's view (and perhaps as high as 5th-best, given that all 22 Michelin two stars rank equally only behind the 4 three-stars); effectively 102 out of 100 from Veronelli; 16.5/20 in the 2006 Espresso guide, placing it within Italy's top 50 and one of the top 6 in the Piemonte; 10/10 from Piccinardi; 3+ out of 3 from Massobrio; and 88 from Gambero Rosso, which ranks it no. 2 in the Piemonte behind Villa Crespi (proving (to me) that everybody makes mistakes!) and among the top 31 in Italy. In the old days, Robert, Vedat and I used to ruffle Craig Camp's feathers because we all loved the high-end experiences so, while Craig had always been a champion of the undiscovered osterie and trattorie. I have learned to appreciate both worlds, but if this discussion and my aggressive comment re: Flipot are properly viewed in context, I mean to say only that, while we have agreed upon our high-end restaurant assessments many times in the past, yes, I think that Robert, Vedat and their wives risk doing Flipot a disservice based upon their palates and experiences, when the overwhelming weight of critical opinion and my numerous experiences there over several years run counter to their view. I think that Flipot is ultimately for each diner to judge as he or she will, but I want to make the case that I find Flipot to be such an unique and extraordinary dining experience and value that everyone who can should try it. I don't mean to pick a fight! As a peace offering, I will concede that my opinion of Da Renzo is running counter to current critical opinion!

[robert brown]

The Sultan of Dining is the Sultan of Dining. He is, after all, Turkey's greatest gastronome, of that I have no doubt. After our meeting up in Bergamo to visit the new premises of our favorite restaurant in Italy, da Vittorio, the Sultan, myself and our wives (the Sultan has just one) will return for the second straight fall to Antica Corona Reale da Renzo because we think that it and Cesare (where we go the day before) are two of the very best restaurants in Piemonte. (It’s with some trepidation that we return to the latter as we understand he has broken off from his son, moved his kitchen and dining room and is preparing fewer dishes). More out of convenience for the other couple we are traveling with who need to be near Malpensa for their flight back to Seattle, we are spending a night on the Lago di Orta and having dinner at the Villa Crespi. I’ll be glad to share my thoughts about it and Renzo

I'm perfectly willing to leave myself open to a change of opinion on a second visit. The problem with Flipot is that if I do go back, it will have to be by myself since we found the town, the hotel-restaurant and the dining vibes desultory and, as I said, the meal uneven. As for all this quantitative guide book evocations, we all know that Italian guide book ratings are at best hit and miss. I reported here a worse than mediocre dinner this summer at Gambero Rosso, whose major guidebook ratings probably add up to the third or fourth highest in Italy and are certainly more than Flipot’s. I also haven't been completely enamored of any of the three-star restaurant meals I have had in Italy either. Invoking stars, shrimps, forks, x/20 and so forth to justify a personal opinion of a restaurant in Italy is hardly indicative of anything or of much consequence. Guidebooks are useful for their names and addresses and helping in forming a choice of where to dine. Ultimately in the long run and after enough experiences, each person becomes his own little guidebook.

[Bill Klapp]

Ah, well, it appears that Robert was unimpressed with Jonathan's thoughtful post. Leaving aside the question of using guide ratings to justify a personal opinion (except to say that it could be a notch above no justification at all), I must beg to differ on the subject of importance of ratings. While I believe that any of us can take issue with the evaluation of one particular ristorante by one particular source, and certainly, can find a given experience to be the best of its kind but still not to our liking (especially on a single visit), I have maintained and updated annually for many years a database of all highly rated dining establishments in Italy from the osteria level on up, and the bottom line is that the numbers don't lie. When the stars all align for a particular place, generally speaking, it takes a change in ownership or chef or some other calamity to call the concensus into doubt. For those readers who cannot claim "greatest gastronome" status, I heartily endorse the use of guides, Michelin, Gambero Rosso and Osterie d' Italia topping the list for reliability, in my view...

[robert brown]

My not commenting on Jonathan's post shouldn't imply any disagreement or disdain. I thought he put it well, especially in his second most recent.

I buy and consult nearly all the Italian guide books. The only one I find to be reliable is the Osteri d'Italia, which nonetheless has led me to the occasional sub-standard establishment. However beyond dividing up certain geographic units into larger restaurants from smaller ones (cafes, wine bars, etc.) it makes no effort to rate or rank-order restaurants. This is why I use it with the high level of confidence that I don't have in the "quant" guide books. You don't have to be an ambitious restaurant-goer either to have your own little guide book in your head. It's the kind of tool you can develop by learning the restaurants in your neighborhood. Even on such a level, every diner should ultimately think of himself as his own best critic.

[vinobiondo]

Having also just returned from Piemonte, let me add to the discussion my agreement that both Antine and Belvedere and indeed better than ever. I would also highly commend the apparently undiscovered (or maybe just undiscussed) and hard-as-hell-to-find La Pergola in Vezza d'Alba. I went there purely due to the 85 points it has in my 2004 Gambero Rosso, and it earned every one of them. It might have been the best meal we had in Piemonte, even if it is casual to the point that there is exactly one person working the front of the house and he is wearing jeans (his mom is doing the cooking in the back).

For me, Trattoria della Posta was a little bit disappointing -- nowhere near as good as previous visits. Their truffles were of noticeably poor quality. La Ciau del Tornavento gets an incomplete since my girlfriend and I were having a fight spectacular enough to both ruin the meal and make us leave early (I can at least confirm the beauty of the room). Thankfully, that blew over.

I've never made it to Flipot, so I have nothing to add there.

A side trip to Verona and Il Desco confirmed (to me at least) that all the haters are just somehow missing it. It was tremendous. My only critique of this place is how somber, serious and downright German (I mean that in good fun...) all the other diners seemed to be and how much more expensive it has gotten over the last five years. The annualized inflation rate at Il Desco must be 25% over that period (obviously, some of this is due to the weak dollar).

By and large, it looks like most of 2005 Barbaresco was picked before the rain and most of 2005 Barolo was not (this is judging from talking to winemakers and from just looking out the window of the car).

[Bill Klapp]

vinobiondo, good to hear about everything (except, of course, the fight with the girlfriend!). I did not make it to Della Posta, and your report is a little troubling. It is early in the truffle season, but all that I ate were much better than usual for first of the season, and also plentiful, so there should be little excuse for poor quality truffles (and as I recall, Della Posta doesn't exactly give them away pricewise, either). Also glad to hear the good report on La Pergola. I haven't been there in several years and my experiences were always good, but I often wondered if Michelin didn't demote them for the odd location and dark dining room!

[Marco_Polo]

By and large, it looks like most of 2005 Barbaresco was picked before the rain and most of 2005 Barolo was not (this is judging from talking to winemakers and from just looking out the window of the car).

←

Sorry, vinobiondo, but this is snapshot generalisation is not necessarily what happened throughout Barolo. My guess is that you were talking to Barbaresco winemakers! I was in Barolo at the end of September and many were picking Nebbiolo already, which is actually quite early (last year the harvest went on until the first week of November). Certainly in both zones there will be those who left it too late, but the Barolo vintage is by no means going to be a wash out. On the other hand, no one is saying that it will be an exceptional year, either. Too much rain in the summer, after a very promising start.

As for dining, we enjoyed a truly exceptional and memorable meal at Cesare's L'Angolo del Paradiso - as we entered through the kitchen that is really no bigger than a domestic kitchen, the kid was roasting on the spit over a wood fire. We had the most relaxed and slendid meal and it is a wonderful place, void of all the trappings that high end establishments inevitably feel they must provide. Here, the food is everything and it really is as if Cesare is simply cooking for you personally (well, in fact he was, as we virtually took over the whole place - it is very intimate!).

Marc

[robert brown]

Marc, please fill us in on the supposedly new Cesare in tersms of location, size, menu, service,etc. What did you end up having with your group?

[albiston]

Host note:

The follow-up discussion on L'Angolo del Paradiso has been moved here.

[vmilor]

Trattoria del Peso in Castagnito (open for lunch only, closed Mondays).  Terrific, old-style Piemontese trattoria, set menu with choice of pasta and secondo.  The fresh ricotta with mirtilli (like blueberries, but with flavor!) preserves will make you weep openly, as will the hot focaccia.  Also hit Flipot (I encourage all of you to be totally dismissive of anyone on this board that cannot recognize this as one of Italy's, and maybe Europe's, finest dining experiences), Belvedere, Antine (both better than ever), Villa Crespi and Da Renzo.  The latter two were excellent, but I couldn't get that excited about either.  I think my palate is becoming jaded...

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Bill, it is great to hear from you. I was missing your posts personally. I even thought that you may be sick (knock the wood). I learned last year at Antine that you were in fine shape and was relieved.

I have a question: Do you still like Combal Zero as much? It looks like given my limited days there this year (only 3 days) I will have to choose between Combal and Antine.

I went to Renzo upon the recommendation of a father and son team who are locals and whom I met at Cesare, and before they got the star, and I wrote here that the restaurant deserved a star. We went a second time with Robert and his wife. I liked very much their famous veal dish, superb finanziera (is this correct spelling?), Cinta Senese pork, their squab, as well as leek-lumache and the quality of carne crudi and truffles that came with it. The ingredients were first rate. The location did not bother me as it is only 20 mn. drive from Alba and the dining room is comfortable. I also thought that the pasta (gobbi?) was very good but I will not put my reputation on line to say that it is the best ravioli plin I have had. I would actually like to hear from you about your favorite hangouts for classical pasta dishes of the region, esp. plin and tajarin.

It has been some time (maybe 3 years) we have been at Flipot. An Italian waiter who was at the French Laundry had recommended it. We went there in the midst of the truffle season, mid November. The town is uninteresting, to put it mildly, but this can not be construed against the restaurant. I don't have my notes with me as I am in Istanbul now and my wife is so busy that she can not even find time to call for doctor appointments let alone find the notes! But I recall that our room in their hotel was very Spartan and, a bit expensive for what it was. I was also dismayed to find out that they did not have Alba truffles. It is strange that a leading restaurant of the region does not serve which is, inarguably, the most famous ingredient of the region, at the height of the season. Fortunately I had purchased one from Alba and they prepared it with eggs and with the classical tajarin. The eggs were good but not as striking as the ones in Cesare or Antine and the tajarin was definitely not on par with Boccondivino or Antine or Giardino di Felicin (the owner there is quite unpleasant though). Then we had another appetizer which was basically a rustic salad with pig ear and pig feet and the dish was sublime. As for the entreees, I can not recall the second one. I remember, however, a duck dish. It was nowhere near the confit of duck or wild duck at Cesare. I remember complaining to my wife that it was a tad overcooked and it was neither as tender as a true Challan duckling and nor as gamey as a Colvert. But I remember liking the vegetables served with it which were probably from the garden. I wish I could remember the second dish and the desserts. It is also clear that the duck you had is much better. 3 years is a long time. Personally your passionate description of Flipot has convinced me to give a second try to it--not during the truffle season though. Oh, yes, I remember that the lady (chef's wife) told me that the locals there are not wealthy like in Alba and this is why they did not have truffles. Perhaps the situation is different now.

Hope, we will continue to hear from you....

[francesco]

It has been some time (maybe 3 years) we have been at Flipot. .....I was also dismayed to find out that they did not have Alba truffles. It is strange that a leading restaurant of the region does not serve which is, inarguably, the most famous ingredient of the region, at the height of the season. Fortunately I had purchased one from Alba and they prepared it with eggs and with the classical tajarin. The eggs were good but not as striking as the ones in Cesare or Antine and the tajarin was definitely not on par with Boccondivino or Antine or Giardino di Felicin (the owner there is quite unpleasant though).

Vedat,

to me this is, in a sense, good news. Flipot takes its inspiration from valdese cuisine which is much more a mountain cuisine than the langhe cuisine. As I understand it, they are actually quite unwilling to go very far from that tradition. The langhe cuisine, while certainly the most celebrated in Piedmont, is not Piedmontese cuisine, which doesn't exist. For example, if you go in the part of middle Piedmont that borders Lombardy then you get rice dishes that you won't find in the langhe.

So, truffles are not part of the valdese cuisine and neither are tajarin. I find it extremely reassuring that a two michelin star restaurant in Piedmont chooses to stick to its roots so much that it doesn't want to serve dishes which don't belong to its tradition, no matter how popular they might be. I wasn't aware of it, and I too would have expected to see truffles on the menu but this tells me that they have a lot of integrity about what they are doing. (I don't quite believe a two-michelin star restaurant has problems selling truffles)

Best,

Francesco

[akwa]

vmilor

have you been to combal

combal zero for me is the most interesting restaurant in the world

but dont take my word for it

ciao

[Pontormo]

I am writing to bump this thread back to Page 1 since it addresses the region that we have turned to for the month.

Do note complaints about the superiority of appetizers to the main course. This is virtually a literary topos in restaurant reviews, however, in this case it is what Italians might call "typical" or "characteristic" of the cooking of Piemonte.

Matt Kramer says that the Piedmontese have a virtual cult devoted to appetizers; diners tend to order many when visiting restaurants where it is acceptable to skip the secondo, or main course.

[arni psito]

I will be staying near Alba for several days later this month. There are many wonderful threads on this area's restaurants on this forum. What I'd like to know is, should I expect to see a lot of truffles this time of year. And if not, should this influence my restaurant or even menu choices. For example, is tajarin still worth it if it's not tartufata, or should I go for the plin?

When the two new Alciati restaurants, heirs to da Guido, opened several years ago, there was a lot of fairly negative coverage here. I haven't noticed any newer opinions since. Has anyone been back? And have they improved, or remained a disappointment?

(merged by Host)

Edited May 8, 2006 by arni psito (log)

[SWISS_CHEF]

I will be staying near Alba for several days later this month.  There are many wonderful threads on this area's restaurants on this forum.  What I'd like to know is, should I expect to see a lot of truffles this time of year.  And if not, should this influence my restaurant or even menu choices.  For example, is tajarin still worth it if it's not tartufata, or should I go for the plin?

When the two new Alciati restaurants, heirs to da Guido, opened several years ago, there was a lot of fairly negative coverage here. I haven't noticed any newer opinions since. Has anyone been back? And have they improved, or remained a disappointment?

(merged by Host)

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You will not see white truffles anywhere. You may see some black truffles in the shops in Alba but don't bother. Eat the agnolotti plin and the tajarin because they are always good, with or without truffles. In Alba I really like: La Piola. Piazza Duomo, 4 12051 Alba (CN) Tel. +39 0173 442800 Fax +39 0173 296003. Although it has a limited menu the food was well executed and the staff was caring. In Bra go to Osteria del Boccondivino and in Sinio you will find La Luna one of our all time favorites

[arni psito]

Thanks, SwissChef. We're also planning to go to the pizzeria in Sessant on your recommendation.

Edited May 12, 2006 by arni psito (log)

[SWISS_CHEF]

Thanks, SwissChef.  We're also planning to go to the pizzeria in Sessant on your recommendation.

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Glad to hear you will go to Sessant! Please tell Alicia and Mario I sent you, it should be good for a free grappa at least! By the way they only make pizza in the evenings and don't go too early 8-9 pm is about right.

Ed

[arni psito]

(Swiss Chef wrote:

Glad to hear you will go to Sessant! Please tell Alicia and Mario I sent you, it should be good for a free grappa at least! By the way they only make pizza in the evenings and don't go too early 8-9 pm is about right.)

I'm sorry to report that when we found the pizzeria, it was closed "for work." I'm not sure what the problem was, but we felt really sad. However, we managed to get back to Alba at about 9:30, in time to get dinner at Osteria del Teatro (it was a Monday night, and this was one of the few places open.) Under the circumstances, it was very welcome, but it doesn't seem like a great place. However, we had really fantastic food and wine experiences at Osteria del Vignaiolo and Belvedere in La Morra, and at La Gibigianna in Barbaresco.

[SWISS_CHEF]

(Swiss Chef wrote:

Glad to hear you will go to Sessant! Please tell Alicia and Mario I sent you, it should be good for a free grappa at least! By the way they only make pizza in the evenings and don't go too early 8-9 pm is about right.)

I'm sorry to report that when we found the pizzeria, it was closed "for work."  I'm not sure what the problem was, but we felt really sad.  However, we managed to get back to Alba at about 9:30, in time to get dinner at Osteria del Teatro (it was a Monday night, and this was one of the few places open.)  Under the circumstances, it was very welcome, but it doesn't seem like a great place.  However, we had really fantastic food and wine experiences at Osteria del Vignaiolo and Belvedere in La Morra, and at La Gibigianna in Barbaresco.

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NOOOO! What a drag! I am so sorry to read this!

Next time in Alba try Piola Piazza Duomo

Gibigianna is good, but even better is Roma in

Costigliole d'Asti.

There is always next time.

[Matthew Grant]

Help! I'm travelling to Piedmont in November. Now I know that there are a 101 threads on the area but I'm struggling to get a grip on the major towns/villages that I should be visiting or staying in. Currently I'm in Alba for two nights and thats it. I've another 5 nights to fill. My main problem is staying close enough to the restaurants I want to eat at so that we don't have to drive (We both like to have a drink and Rachel is never going to drive onthe "wrong" side of the road). For instance, I want to go to Da Renzo, what is my best option for nearby accomodation? Same applies for Da Cesare, is it easy to get a taxi there from Alba or is it going to be some ridiculous price.

If I stay in Barolo for a night or two, what are my dining option there keeping in mind my driving dilemma (incidentally try typing Barolo in the EG search engine, you'll see why I'm having so many problems tracking this down myself).

Has anybody got a suggestion for somewhere more luxurious for one night, the rest of the tie we're happy to stay in B&B's or simple hotels.

[Andrew Fenton]

Matthew, I don't have a lot of personal knowledge of the Piedmont, and I'm sure you'll get some good recommendations. But in the meantime, here are a few possibly useful threads:

ecco qui, and another, another, one more, and a fifth.

Search tip: I found these using the search box on the Italy forum with the searches

+barolo +piemonte and

+barolo +piedmont

There are others that may be relevant as well. Good luck and buon viaggio!

[Matthew Grant]

Thanks Andrew, I have seen most of those threads, most of my issues are with being able to stay close to the restaurants. Most of those mentioned appear to me as if you have to drive.

[wkl]

i'm in the midst of planning 10 days in piemonte at the end of october. i know what you are going through!

try www.langhe.net, click on the bed icon on top of page. the site is a little slow, but there is a whole page of accomodations, some of which have maps.that may help you with more specific locations.

i actually have quite a bit of info if you want to pm me i could send to you what i have.

you are probably aware by now that reservations at hotels are getting tight. especially for weekends.

[fortedei]

Help! I'm travelling to Piedmont in November. Now I know that there are a 101 threads on the area but I'm struggling to get a grip on the  major towns/villages that I should be visiting or staying in. Currently I'm in Alba for two nights and thats it. I've another 5 nights to fill. My main problem is staying close enough to the restaurants I want to eat at so that we don't have to drive (We both like to have a drink and Rachel is never going to drive onthe "wrong" side of the road). For instance, I want to go to Da Renzo, what is my best option for nearby accomodation? Same applies for Da Cesare, is it easy to get a taxi there from Alba or is it going to be some ridiculous price.

If I stay in Barolo for a night or two, what are my dining option there keeping in mind my driving dilemma (incidentally try typing Barolo in the EG search engine, you'll see why I'm having so many problems tracking this down myself).

Has anybody got a suggestion for somewhere more luxurious for one night, the rest of the tie we're happy to stay in B&B's or simple hotels.

←

You can always get to Da Renzo or Cesare or any other place by taxi from Alba, and it is probably possible to get the taxi to come back(or have the restaurant call you one), but it will cost you very dearly. Your car is by far the best way to get around. If I were you, I would use Alba as the base and take day trips by car to visit e.g. Barolo or La Morra (with the great Sol LeWitt capella in the Ceretto vineyard; a must see). Alba is a wonderful walking town and it happens to be centered nicely to the areas around it where you might like to go

[Matthew Grant]

Do you know how much is a Taxi likely to cost me from Cesare?