Good kosher places

[bloviatrix]

Blovie picked up a copy of the menu at Solo today. Right now they're only serving dinner. They plan on adding lunch service in a couple of weeks.

In addition to their ala carte menu, you can also order an 8 course tasting menu (the whole table has to order this) for $118. If you do the tasting menu with the wine pairings, the price is $178.

[Gifted Gourmet]

you can also order an 8 course tasting menu (the whole table has to order this) for $118.  If you do the tasting menu with the wine pairings, the price is $178.

Which, when one thinks about it, is not all that unreasonable actually.

Kosher meals, for a variety of reasons, are not inexpensive, and, with the wine pairings, rather cost appropriate. Look forward to your full , and highly detailed review, Bloviatrix de Bruni!

[bloviatrix]

you can also order an 8 course tasting menu (the whole table has to order this) for $118.  If you do the tasting menu with the wine pairings, the price is $178.

Which, when one thinks about it, is not all that unreasonable actually.

Kosher meals, for a variety of reasons, are not inexpensive, and, with the wine pairings, rather cost appropriate. Look forward to your full , and highly detailed review, Bloviatrix de Bruni!

GG, are you the fly on my living room wall? I was just saying the same exact thing about the price of the tasting menu to Blovie.

It seems Solo has their publicity machine working. There's a item about them in the new issue of New York (scroll down to Singular Sensation).

[Gifted Gourmet]

GG, are you the fly on my living room wall?   I was just saying the same exact thing about the price of the tasting menu to Blovie.

It seems Solo has their publicity machine working.  There's a item about them in the new issue of New York (scroll down to Singular Sensation).

Looks like kosher dining has come a very long way from schmaltz-and-brisket-potato kugel fusion to:

kosher Mediterranean with a dash of Asian, an unusual fusion concocted by chef Hok Chin and evident in dishes like tamari-miso-glazed Chilean sea bass with truffle essence and Dover sole with litchis and champagne beurre noisette.

---The Gifted Fly on the Wall Gourmet

[bloviatrix]

Here's what I'm trying to figure out -- how can you serve beurre noisette in a meat restaurant?

Inquiring minds want to know.

[Gifted Gourmet]

Here's what I'm trying to figure out -- how can you serve beurre noisette in a meat restaurant?

Inquiring minds want to know.

faux beurre? pareve margarine noisette? ewwww ...

but you know it must be a fairly good substitute or no one will bother to eat there ....

[bloviatrix]

Looks like another new place is opening on the UWS.

Mike's Bisto

This location has been the Bermuda Triangle of kosher restaurants on the last 10 years. I'm curious to see how this place will do.

[wesza]

Maybe I'm dumb, not with it or whatever.

But what that place or any of these "Glatt Kosher" operations have to do with being a "Bistro" or "Pan Asian" or anything traditional doesn't seem to come together in my mind or stomach.

It seems that many Chef's and Operators are going for business success without taking into consideration that the reality of being Kosher is that a fairly high percentage of your patrons will be expecting some traditional Jewish Type dishes be incorporated into your menus. Especially since many people aren't preparing many of these items at home.

The large majority of Customers who frequent these establishments may not be keeping kosher at home, on not necessarily even Jewish but very likely be entertaining friends or business associates who observe Kasherus.

I'm not sure if it's a good investment or not two risky to start any business with out considering your customers taste, customs or expectations in the NYC Kosher Marketplace.

I remember the risk taken when daring to open "Schmulka Bersteins" with a Chinese Menu [but still keeping the deli/restaurant menus] and how long it took to be anything more then a novelty.

The next place will be a "Mock Traif Treats" or what ?

Being away from NYC I'm curious about how many of these type places are succeeding and where they are located to build up a regular customer base ?

Irwin

[bloviatrix]

Irwin, I know you've been in the business along time, but as someone who is part of the orthodox jewish community, let me tell you -- traditional food doesn't cut it. It's old. Diners aren't interested. The traditional foods are something you eat at home on shabbos or on the holidays, not when you're out to eat in a restaurant.

Many people who eat at kosher restaurants have become significantly more sophisticated over the years. There are large numbers of Ba'al Teshuvahs who once ate treyf and don't want to give up the various cuisines. Plus, there are others, like me, who want to expand their horizons.

The demographic for a restaurant like Mike's Bisto is going to be the typical orthodox jewish Upper West Sider or someone who drives in from the 'burbs looking for something other than your typical deli or middle-eastern style joint. The few people who eat there that don't keep kosher will be there because one of their group won't "eat out."

A place like Mike's is designed to be a neighborhood place. Most of their business will be on weeknights and week-ends. They'll get a lot of couples out on dates, people going to Lincoln Center, etc. I could see going there for dinner on sunday night when I'm not in the mood to cook. There have been 3 other kosher restaurants in this location over the 8 years (plus one treyf one) but part of the reason they failed was that the food sucked and the service was lousy. If the food is good, people will come and the place will do well. The market hasn't reached saturation point.

On the other hand, a place like Solo is more upscale. It will be a place for business entertaining if Prime Grill, their other restaurant, is an accurate indicator. Plus, people will go there for a special occasion. The possible drawback for Solo is location - it's in the Sony building which is Madison and 56th which is mid-town. It won't encourage the same type of spontaneity that a Mike's would have.

[Pan]

There have been 3 other kosher restaurants in this location over the 8 years (plus one treyf one) but part of the reason they failed was that the food sucked and the service was lousy.

What was the other part of the reason? Were they expensive, too?

[bloviatrix]

There have been 3 other kosher restaurants in this location over the 8 years (plus one treyf one) but part of the reason they failed was that the food sucked and the service was lousy.

What was the other part of the reason? Were they expensive, too?

No, the final reason is that the portions were tiny (sorry I couldn't resist).

(seriously, I have no recall of prices)

[alacarte]

There's a brief write-up of Solo in this week's NY Magazine. (scroll down to the third blurb). It includes this note:

The culinary crossover continues outside in the atrium, where the Kosher Kiosk dispenses approved Danish and cinnamon buns baked by Swedish pastry chef Morgan Larsson.

I'm confused. I'm learning to bake puff pastry now, and I can attest that it's all about the butter. How do you make a proper Danish without butter? Or is this outsourced from another (non-meat) kitchen?

And more importantly -- is the pastry any good? I miss being in midtown, I would pop over on my next coffee break and test it out.

EDITED to add: On second thought, I have seen pareve puff pastry in the freezer section of the kosher markets. But I always assumed they were meant for savory dishes like a salmon en croute, not sweet, as they had to be fairly tasteless.

Edited June 17, 2004 by alacarte (log)

[bloviatrix]

There's an interesting article about the owner of Prime Grill and Solo in The Jewish Week.

Click here.

[alacarte]

very interesting indeed....

Even Brussels sprouts. Rabbi Jacob Cohen, the mashgiach, told the chef not to use them because their tightly furled tops would be hard to inspect for worms and insects. Ditto for the tips of green asparagus.

I'm not sure which reaction is stronger -- I'm skeeved out by the thought of little critters in my veggies (one aspect of kashrut I'm more than happy to support), but I'm also disappointed that two of my favorite vegetables would be simply written off.

[bloviatrix]

Last weekend we actually left the borough of Manhattan and tried a dairy restaurant in Riverdale called The Corner Cafe. It's on Johnson Avenue. The place is a hole-in-wall, but it was quite good. I had one of the pasta specials which a fettucini with an eggplant and tomato cream sauce that was very flavorful (and a large portion). It came with a salad and the house dressing which was a tangy creamy cucumber (on the side). Prices were very reasonable. Dinner for 4 (no drinks or dessert) came to about $70.

Blovie and I also got to Mike's Bistro over 4th of July weekend. We started with the gnocchi which were excellent. They came with with shredded braised duck and mushrooms. Although it was somewhat of a wintry dish, I enjoyed it. For the main course I went with the filet of beef which left me slightly underwhelmed -- I didn't find the meat flavorful enough. Plus it was served with braised cabbage, which again I found to be seasonally wrong. Blovie had the lamb shank, which he praised. I'm sure we'll go back.

[bloviatrix]

Blovie and I had dinner at Solo on thursday night. I came away underwhelmed.

I loved the room when the space was Shallots. It was lush and quiet with carpeting and tables spread far apart. It was calming. Solo is loud and brash. The floor is some sort of tile. Tables are packed in tightly -- everywhere you turn you see people. And the room is loud (Jews are loud to begin with, but the tile floors accentuates the noise level).

If you take a look at their web site you'll see a design element that carries in to the bread plates and the waiter's attire. It was just too much. Plus, the knives had thick, clunky handles that didn't feel good in the hand.

Now, that I got the exteriors out of the way....

Both Blovie and I decided to order the 5 course chef's tasting menu. I ordered the wine pairing that accompanied it.

While waiting for the first course we were presented with a choice of bread: olive rolls, raisin-walnut rolls, or rosemary focaccia. They also put on the table a dish with margerine. Blovie and I joked that we were deducting .5 from the score (we've been watching Olympic gymnastics). My gut is that the bread is brought in from Tribeca Oven. I asked my bread guy if they have the account, he's getting back to me.

The first course was a single potato dumpling with shaved black truffle, truffle oil and chives. It was served with the Bartenura Prosecco. We enjoyed this. The outside of the dumpling was a bit chewy but the potato was silky with an earthy flavor from the truffle. The wine was drier than I expected from a prosecco, but went nicely.

Mache with shaved endive and apple with a light vinagrette. I can't remember the wine that was served. This course was boring. No discernable flavor. Completely unmemorable.

Wild Pacific Salmon with grapefruit, tuna wrapped in seaweed and then batter fried with a hot guacamole and mango sauce. Terras de Belmonte, Beiro Interior, Portugal, 2003. This was the most confusing dish of the night. Each component was good, but there was just too much going on the plate. I'm not quite sure what the chef was trying to do. The wine on the other was fantastic. It's made from a blend of 5 grapes usually used in Sherry. It was a really nice light fruity red.

Chicken roasted with rosemary and preserved lemon with edamane and dried cherries. Kinneret Ella Valley Merlot (Year?). I tend to stay away from chicken in restaurants. This was ok, but my favorite part was the edamame. Blovie really enjoyed this dish. I liked this wine as well. It was made in the Bordeaux style.

Braised lamb shank with fennel and other vegetables. Teal Lake Shiraz 2002 (Australia, can't remember the region). After we ordered we were told that instead of lamb shank we would be served baby lamb chops, but they went with the original dish. I like lamb, but it's not my favorite. However, this was sublime. The lamb was beautifully cooked - melt in your mouth tender. And the vegetables were in a nicely flavored broth. As for the wine, I loved the 1999 Shiraz and horded several cases. Subsequent vintages weren't as good, but it seems like the winemaker has gotten back on track.

At this point we decided to sit back and take a break. I asked to meet with the sommeliere as I was curious to get an idea of why he made the choices he did with the pairings. (I should note that some of their mark-ups are obscene. The Baron Herzog Clarksburg Chenin Blanc which retails for no more than $6.50 had a price of $36 Because the mevushal kosher wine universe is fairly limited, if you buy and drink a kosher wine you'll be able to identify the mark-ups which can be turn-off) I was quite interested in the Terras del Belmonte and wanted to learn more about it -- I plan on tracking it down for home consumption.

For dessert we each selected something off their dessert menu. I ordered the blueberry springroll which came with vanilla "ice cream" and roasted pineapple and Blovie ordered the Mango sundae with coconut "ice cream," mango sorbet and some sort of praline. Both were enjoyable. The "ice cream" was some of the best pareve stuff I've eaten. We were also brought the Solo signature digestif - a chocolate liquor with passion fruit puree and I can't remember what else. It was a little sweet for my tastes.

I then asked if it were possible if we could see the kitchen and meet with the chef. I have a feeling I am the first to ask about seeing the kitchen because our waiter looked suprised and said he didn't know if it was possible. Turns out, it was ok and we were brought back to the kitchen. The hour was about 10 pm and things were winding down. The kitchen is the usual stainless steel and white tile and still had all of its retained heat. The staff is about 25 including line cooks and dishwashers. The chef is a gentleman named Hok Chin. He's originally from Hong Kong. He's worked at Daniel and spent a number of years under Delouvrier at Lespinasse. He said that Delouvrier was a tough taskmaster but he learned a lot from him. We talked about the challenges of cooking kosher -- not being able to use shellfish or butter to mount sauces as well as his plans for the fall menu. They're doing about 160 dinner covers a night. And they started serving lunch last month. I saw a container of fish stock sitting on the pass through -- they make their stocks every 2 days from all the bones, etc.

It seems our visit to the kitchen got around because on our way out, we were asked how our meeting with the chef went. I will say the service was quite attentive.

I really want to like this place. But, there was just something missing. It could be that the restaurant meal we had prior to this one was at Per Se and everything else will pale in comparison. But I just wasn't wowed. Maybe it's that Mediteranean/Aisan fusion doesn't work so well. I can't put my finger on it. I have no doubt we'll go back sometime in the future. But since the final check (with tip ) is about $280 it won't be for awhile.

[richw]

Another nice place is Levana. I like this place a lot. I had a venison dish there some years ago that I still dream about. It was slices of venison on a bed of arugala with dried fruits and some sort of reduction. At another memorable dish I had was 3 morels, eached stuffed with different mousse. I will say that I've been disappointed with the way they prepare duck. Levana frequently does special meals with wine pairings.

I am really curious about how one obtains kosher venison. I am pretty sure an animal can be trapped as long as it is not injured during the process and then slaughtered according to Jewish law. Are there domestic, farm-raised deer? Tell me, please.

TIA,

Rich

[Suzanne F]

There are most definitely farm-raised deer. I think just about all the venison coming in from New Zealand is farmed. So I'm pretty sure there must be domestic ones as well. In fact, I know I've seen them in Vermont.

[bloviatrix]

Musicon Farm is the source for kosher venison. They're located in Goshen, NY.

[Pan]

Any notable new kosher places? Have any of you tried the new kosher Chinese vegetarian restaurant on Mott St.?

[bloviatrix]

No new places that I know about. What's the name of the place on Mott? And where is it exactly?

We did eat at the cafe at Makor (67th btw CPW and Columbus) several weeks ago. Blovie ordered fish and chips were pretty good. I had the onion soup. I was expecting a traditional onion soup with the cheese and crouton, but this was different. Very rich flavor, but I think some of the onions were scorched because I sometimes got a burnt aftertaste. I can't remember what our friends orders. It's a very casual dairy place. Prices a pretty reasonable. The problem was there was only one person working both the bar and the serving so things moved slowly (and we were in a rush to catch a movie).

We ate our way through South Florida at the end of January and are still recovering. I know this is the wrong place, but there are some excellent kosher dining options down there. I can't wait to go back next winter as I didn't get to Juliette or Cine Citta which are both branches of Parisian restuarants.

[Pan]

No new places that I know about.  What's the name of the place on Mott?  And where is it exactly?[...]

←

Between Mosco and Chatham Square, if I remember correctly. I'll try to make note of the place's name next time I'm down there.

[bloviatrix]

New place just opened last week on B'way btw 97th and 98th (east side of street) called La Creperie. I got a peak inside right before Passover. It will be dairy and casual. As you can tell from the name, they'll be focusing on all sorts of crepes. We'll try to check it out sometime soon.

[Pan]

Right near my folks. I'll look forward to your report.

[jaynesb]

I think the new vegetarian Chinese restaurant might be Buddha Boda.

There's an ad/expired coupon on the last page of the recent New York Jewish Week newspaper.

5 Mott Street 212-566-8388

(Supervised by Rabbi Israel Meyer Steinberg)