Improving my cooking skills (2003)

[Chad]

A question: is the leftover rendered duck fat very useful, since it was cooked with rosemary, shallots, garlic and parsnips? Won't these flavors stick around? I have probably two cups of the stuff left over.

Dear God, yes! Par cook some chunked new potatoes (put them in salted water, bring it to a boil, remove the potatoes & shock them in ice water to stop the cooking) dry them and saute (shallow fry) them in the flavored duck fat, aka Liquid Love. It's the best thing that ever happened to a potato.

Chad

[Dave the Cook]

Thanks for the reports, guys.

I wondered about the skin, but decided 1) Jacques wouldn't steer us wrong; 2) leaving the pieces skin side down would keep them from getting soggy, since they would always be in fat, and the steam wouldn't get to the skin. Would it make sense to put the pieces on a sheet pan and run them under the broiler for a couple of minutes while I deglaze the plan?

Regarding the lack of deglazing material: would a bigger pan have helped? I'm thinking that contact with the pan bottom is essential. What size pans did you guys use, and did the shallots and parsnips sit on the bottom, or on top of the meat? Non-stick or conventional interior? The recipe notes a preference for non-stick, but it's an aluminum or steel pan in the photo. Hmm.

I would hang onto the fat, but you're right, it has limited usefulness. It's not just the flavoring (which I wouldn't necessarily mind, but does compromise the purity of the fat and shorten its life), but the fact that it spent an hour at something around 350 degrees or more. That's going to lower its smoke point quite a bit. Still, it would work for skillet-browned potatoes, where you parboil them and then toss for just ten minutes or so over medium heat.

Good 'snip tip, Chad. Done like a true parsnipianian.

I can't imagine that you're getting bad ducks, G. Sorry, it must be you.

Edit: cross-posted with Chad on the 'tater thing. Great minds, etc. . .

Edited November 16, 2003 by Dave the Cook (log)

[hjshorter]

Aside from the skin (which was something of a letdown), I thought the dish was really very good. It felt like a crime to cook duck breasts this way, though. I wanted to take them out and eat them about ten minutes into the recipe. Not that they weren't good Jacques' way-- they were well flavored. I just like them medium rare.

Am I the only person on egullet who likes fully cooked poultry? I just cannot stomach bloody fowl, and I've tried many times. I am looking forward to cooking this dish precisely because it is fully cooked.

I hope you will still let me cook with you, even though I'm a duck philistine.

[SethG]

Regarding the lack of deglazing material: would a bigger pan have helped? I'm thinking that contact with the pan bottom is essential. What size pans did you guys use, and did the shallots and parsnips sit on the bottom, or on top of the meat? Non-stick or conventional interior? The recipe notes a preference for non-stick, but it's an aluminum or steel pan in the photo. Hmm.

Dave, I think you've hit upon the reason for the sogginess/lack of deglazing material. I used a 12 inch skillet, as Jacques instructs us to do, and my pan became very crowded. I don't think this is a "problem;" I think this is as Jacques wants it to be. He wants the veggies steamed, not browned. I used a cast-iron skillet, by the way. How can you cook a duck and not do it in cast-iron? It's so good for the pan!

And Heather, you get credit for admitting your shortcomings! Maybe someday you'll see the light. I don't think I'd go for medium-rare chicken or turkey. (I understand that in Japan, where salmonella is unheard of, they serve chicken carpaccio. This sounds pretty weird to me.) Duck just seems so much more gamey; it seems right to me at medium-rare.

Edited November 16, 2003 by SethG (log)

[guajolote]

the duck hash was amazing. I might make this again, not eat it, and make hash the next day. I added some of the parsnips to the hash, I liked them much better nice and brown.

My duck was frozen and from Indiana.

I used a 14" fry pan, stainless steel. The part about the skin being submerged in fat and staying crisp doesn't work because the water from the vegetables is heavier than the fat, and sinks to the bottom of the panl. Dave, I would definately try to broil the pices 2 to 3 minutes to get the crispiness back.

I don't have the cookbook so no salad for me.

[col klink]

Am I the only person on egullet who likes fully cooked poultry? I just cannot stomach bloody fowl, and I've tried many times. I am looking forward to cooking this dish precisely because it is fully cooked.

I hope you will still let me cook with you, even though I'm a duck philistine.

You just might be the only one. Try not to think of duck breasts as poultry but as red meat, especially if your duck is wild.

Everytime I get the notion to roast a duck, I remind myself that the breast is always better if cooked to medium rare and I loose the notion. I like to quarter my ducks, reserving all of the excess skin to render it. I throw the legs on first and ten minutes before they're done, I throw the breasts (skin scored in a cross-hatch pattern) in the skillet and let the fat render. Flipping only for the last couple of minutes.

This way the skin on the legs are crisp as is the breast skin and I have assloads of sweet, sweet duck fat.

Not that this helps any of you to roast your whole duck.

[SethG]

the duck hash was amazing. I might make this again, not eat it, and make hash the next day...

I don't have the cookbook so no salad for me.

Guajolote, I couldv'e PMed you some salad instructions. Sorry. The salad involved roasting extra strips of skin and fat until crisp (about half an hour or forty minutes), chopping up the giblets and sauteeing them in a couple Tbsps of duck fat for about two minutes, and putting all of this on top of greens with a simple mustard vinaigrette. That's about all you needed to know.

Maybe you could post your duck hash recipe/method?

And by the way, the wife and I liked the parsnips just fine. I might make some again.

Edited November 16, 2003 by SethG (log)

[guajolote]

I guess Dave's not going to report on his duck

Seth, are you going to do anything this weekend? I'm up for it again.

[SethG]

I guess Dave's not going to report on his duck

Seth, are you going to do anything this weekend? I'm up for it again.

Not that I wouldn't love to, but

You're teasing me, aren't you? Or trying to tempt me into misbehaving?

If I propose another project for this weekend, I think Heather will have my head. I promised to wait until after turkey day.

(Although a little bird told me Heather is making risotto tonight...)

Oh yeah, what happened to Dave? And Erin, are you out there?

Edited November 18, 2003 by SethG (log)

[guajolote]

You're teasing me, aren't you? Or trying to tempt me into misbehaving?

If I propose another project for this weekend, I think Heather will have my head. I promised to wait until after turkey day.

i'm not teasing, i'm really having a good time doing this.

pick a recipe, even if it's the 2 of us it will be fun. the slackers can catch up later.

I'd be up for some shellfish.

[hjshorter]

Slackers, huh?

Sorry, now that our house is on the market I have to spend every waking moment picking up after the kids.

How about the fish soup in J & J? I will confess to having made it several times, but it's delicious and would gladly make it again. Besides, it's a one pot meal and I need those right now. Maybe we could all bake a loaf of bread of some sort to go with.

[SethG]

How about the fish soup in J & J? I will confess to having made it several times, but it's delicious and would gladly make it again. Besides, it's a one pot meal and I need those right now. Maybe we could all bake a loaf of bread of some sort to go with.

Heather, do you refer to Jacques' Mediterranean Seafood Soup or to Jacques' Billi-bi (mussels and cream soup)? I'd be up for either one.

I'm up for bread too, but I may need to be directed to a recipe.

[guajolote]

I vote for the mussels and cream. Mussels are cheap and easy to get.

[adoxograph]

I may be slacking, but that's only because I had an eclipse and 280 cub scouts to deal with. Can I vote mussels, anyway? I can snag some of them with my preholiday grocery shopping trip and my budget will be none the wiser...

[Dave the Cook]

Mussels -- but as I recall, Billi-bi requires leftover mussels, doesn't it?

I'll post on the duck when I have a little more time.

[edemuth]

Oh yeah, what happened to Dave?  And Erin, are you out there?

I am soooooo behind. . .

(Yes, Seth, I'm still here; been incredibly busy these past few weeks, and I just got back from IHMRS and the Chocolate Show in NYC. Thanks for asking... and belated congrats on your new addition!)

This weekend, I'm looking forward to cooking for myself and would love to participate. I'm up for anything as long as it'll keep for a few days or freeze. . . I have an eGullet dinner on Saturday and our family T'giving on Sunday (I will be soliciting ideas for my dessert contribution in another thread shortly), so whatever I make will end up as next week's lunches.

Mussel soup and bread sound great. I have plenty of Julia's bread recipes if we need them.

[Chad]

[Fat Albert] Hey, hey, hey -- I got J and J! [/Fat Albert]

Just arrived on my doorstep. Menus are already in place for this week, but I'll get a running start by reading through the book and joining in the fun next week.

Chad

[hjshorter]

The Mediterranean was the one I was talking about, but Billi-bi looks good and I've never made it.

Nice to have you along for the ride, Chad.

[guajolote]

this one looks quick too.

is this recipe close?

[SethG]

this one looks quick too.

is this recipe close?

It is fairly close-- there are minor differences. Jacques does not ask you to add the mussels back to the soup, either pureed or as a garnish. He tells you to "save for another dish." There are also some small differences in the proportions. But otherwise not that different.

Note to everyone: Jacques says this soup is traditionally served cold (although he gives permission to serve it warm). He also says it is very rich, and that servings should be no more than half a cup per person. Doesn't really sound like a meal in a pot. Maybe we should do the other one?

Edited November 18, 2003 by SethG (log)

[Dave the Cook]

I favor the other dish, but will follow the crowd.

[hjshorter]

Let's do the Mediterranean fish stew, and save the Billi-bi for when we're all having a dinner party. Seth, I use Jamie Oliver's basic bread recipe. If you're too embarrassed to check his book out at the library I will PM it to you.

[SethG]

I'll take a look at my own books to see if there's a bread I want to make. (Maybe there's something in New Making of a Cook?) I'll let you know if I need another recipe.

[guajolote]

could someone summarize this for me.

is it like this kind of?

[edemuth]

Heather, is the basic bread recipe you're referring to the one in The Naked Chef Takes Off? If so, then I'm all set!