Jump to content
  • Welcome to the eG Forums, a service of the eGullet Society for Culinary Arts & Letters. The Society is a 501(c)3 not-for-profit organization dedicated to the advancement of the culinary arts. These advertising-free forums are provided free of charge through donations from Society members. Anyone may read the forums, but to post you must create a free account.

seawakim

Tempering Chocolate

Recommended Posts

Thanks for the feedback.

 

It's Orelys I'm playing around with. Sorry for not being clear. The viscosity is extremely low, so it's not that it set too fast. Maybe it's not over tempered? Maybe I'm confusing the terms here.

 

But if the problem is that it's super fluid, maybe Kerrys advice is the one to follow?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, keychris said:

time to lose your thermometer and do it by feel ;)

 

 Only partly kidding - when I was taught how to temper, they banned all thermometers from the kitchen so we had to know what the chocolate behaved like at each stage. You can feel it thickening up, you know that's when you need to get it back in the bowl to head back to working temperature :)

 

Hehe. I should at least try the "bowl" method, or whatever we should call it. It's basically taking 2/3 and pour that on my countertop, bring it down in temperature and pour it back to the bowl and it should be tempered?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Rajala said:

 

Hehe. I should at least try the "bowl" method, or whatever we should call it. It's basically taking 2/3 and pour that on my countertop, bring it down in temperature and pour it back to the bowl and it should be tempered?

 

 

That's the traditional method of tabling I referred to.....that would be my choice if you're going to table (as opposed to cooling it all and then using a microwave). 


Budding, UK based chocolatier .....or at least..that's the plan 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, martin0642 said:

 

 

That's the traditional method of tabling I referred to.....that would be my choice if you're going to table (as opposed to cooling it all and then using a microwave). 

 

Yeah, the only reason I'm doing it the way I'm doing it is because someone showed it to me and it's been working perfectly until just now.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Okay. I tried it again, thinking about what Kerry said; 25°. However, it started to get a little bit thicker at around 26° so I thought that was enough, brought it back up to 28°. By the time I had filled the mould. I could hold it upside down without any chocolate dropping down. Like it was a meringue.

 

Seriously, this product is my archenemy. Any suggestions? :D

 

While waiting for your feedback, I'm going to mould with something else, just to make sure that I haven't lost all my skills here.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Rajala said:

Okay. I tried it again, thinking about what Kerry said; 25°. However, it started to get a little bit thicker at around 26° so I thought that was enough, brought it back up to 28°. By the time I had filled the mould. I could hold it upside down without any chocolate dropping down. Like it was a meringue.

 

Seriously, this product is my archenemy. Any suggestions? :D

 

While waiting for your feedback, I'm going to mould with something else, just to make sure that I haven't lost all my skills here.

The chocolate is always the boss! 

 

How sure are you of the accuracy of your thermometer?

 

 


Edited by Kerry Beal (log)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
47 minutes ago, Kerry Beal said:

The chocolate is always the boss! 

 

How sure are you of the accuracy of your thermometer?

 

 

 

 

Never had any issues until now. So it should be fairly accurate. I’m thinking that it’s still a little too warm in my apartment. 24 degrees.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Rajala said:

 

Never had any issues until now. So it should be fairly accurate. I’m thinking that it’s still a little too warm in my apartment. 24 degrees.

Have you any way of testing the accuracy of your thermometer?

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I could put it up my arm pit and see if it’s around 37 degrees? 🤣

 

In all seriousness, no. Just tried with milk chocolate and that didn’t temper correctly either. I’m blaming the temp in the kitchen. Will try dark chocolate tomorrow, just because.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Can you try it with boiling water? You can correct for atmospheric pressure.


MelissaH

Oswego, NY

Chemist, writer, hired gun

Say this five times fast: "A big blue bucket of blue blueberries."

foodblog1 | kitchen reno | foodblog2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That would probably be the easiest way.

 

I tempered some dark chocolate yesterday, close to perfection. So not sure what the issue is with white and milk for me. I'm probably out of shape due to not doing any chocolate work since May? :D 


Just need to practice more I guess.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Okay, got a question; if the chocolate doesn't come out easily from the mould - what should I do next time I temper with the same kind of chocolate? Let it get a little bit lower in temperature, before brought up to working temperature? (I know I need to learn to do it without a thermometer, but that's in the future) :) 

 

The milk chocolate I'm working with at the moment seems to take forever to set - but it's snappy and shiny when it do. I'm not sure why I have so many issues with this. Dark chocolate works every time. 🤔

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, but it feels like it takes way too long. I'm going slightly lower next time then. 25 as you suggest. :) 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

When tempered chocolate starts thickening as it is used, the first remedy usually suggested is to raise the temperature a bit (but not too high so as to melt the Type V crystals). The next remedy I try is to raise the temp above the melting point of Type V for a while to melt some of those excess crystals, then lower it back to working temp. My question is why the first remedy works.  It is not melting crystals, so what is it actually doing that thins out the chocolate?  Thanks for any insights.


Edited by Jim D. (log)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Perfect, this was on top when I got here. Had a question, only to realize that Kerry already answered it earlier, when I asked for another chocolate. I'm working with Cacao Barry's "Ghana", and it's like sour milk when melted. :D  Will go down all the way to 25 to see how that will work for me.

 

Good question Jim, can't help you though. :( 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Jim D. said:

When tempered chocolate starts thickening as it is used, the first remedy usually suggested is to raise the temperature a bit (but not too high so as to melt the Type V crystals). The next remedy I try is to raise the temp above the melting point of Type V for a while to melt some of those excess crystals, then lower it back to working temp. My question is why the first remedy works.  It is not melting crystals, so what is it actually doing that thins out the chocolate?  Thanks for any insights.

 

Once over tempered - raising the temperature to 32.5 for milk chocolate or 34.5 for dark will thin it out - I suspect it is happening because some crystals melt out and also that it is just less viscous at the higher temperature. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It also depends how you're applying the heat - if you're using a heat gun, you're generating a very high localised heat which melts the crystals in that area, but not the rest of them, then you stir and melt more, etc.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
35 minutes ago, keychris said:

It also depends how you're applying the heat - if you're using a heat gun, you're generating a very high localised heat which melts the crystals in that area, but not the rest of them, then you stir and melt more, etc.

I'm using a Chocovision Delta tempering machine. I raise the temp, then stir as it increases, so insofar as I can judge, the temp is more or less uniform in the bowl. There is a noticeable difference in viscosity of the chocolate after a short time at the higher temperature. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think there's more than one thing going on here - as Keychris said, if you use a heat gun then you are melting out all the crystals in a very localised area - so that thins the chocolate out, stirring melts more but the majority of the chocolate is still in temper/contains the desired crystals so overall it's in temper (as long as you stir well of course).

 

But alongside that (and this probably explains the tempering machine better) - as I understand the science, even well tempered chocolate contains some of the other crystal forms. Remember, we can temper chocolate with just 1% by weight of seeding cocoa butter (ie Mycryo, Kerry's splendid cocoa butter machine ). Not every single crystal in the finished product will be the Type V crystals. Whilst the other forms won't leave it setting with a sharp snap - they will contribute to it thickening. They also melt out easily at the higher temperatures.

 

I may be entirely wrong here....but that's my understanding of it! :)

  • Like 1

Budding, UK based chocolatier .....or at least..that's the plan 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, martin0642 said:

But alongside that (and this probably explains the tempering machine better) - as I understand the science, even well tempered chocolate contains some of the other crystal forms. Remember, we can temper chocolate with just 1% by weight of seeding cocoa butter (ie Mycryo, Kerry's splendid cocoa butter machine ). Not every single crystal in the finished product will be the Type V crystals. Whilst the other forms won't leave it setting with a sharp snap - they will contribute to it thickening. They also melt out easily at the higher temperatures.

 

An interesting theory. In support of the fact that we can't know what crystals are actually present, I had another puzzling experience recently:  Again I was using the Delta machine but wasn't paying attention to the level of chocolate remaining in the bowl. After it sank below the level of the thermometer that controls the heat, I noticed that the shells were taking longer to crystallize. I checked the temp of the chocolate in the bowl, and it was well over 100F/38C. I was certain that the finished product would be a disaster. But such was not the case--the finished chocolates released without incident and there was no sign of untempered chocolate. If I were just beginning to work with chocolate, I might foolishly ask, "How can this be?" -- but by now I know better than to expect definitive answers.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, martin0642 said:

I think there's more than one thing going on here - as Keychris said, if you use a heat gun then you are melting out all the crystals in a very localised area - so that thins the chocolate out, stirring melts more but the majority of the chocolate is still in temper/contains the desired crystals so overall it's in temper (as long as you stir well of course).

 

But alongside that (and this probably explains the tempering machine better) - as I understand the science, even well tempered chocolate contains some of the other crystal forms. Remember, we can temper chocolate with just 1% by weight of seeding cocoa butter (ie Mycryo, Kerry's splendid cocoa butter machine ). Not every single crystal in the finished product will be the Type V crystals. Whilst the other forms won't leave it setting with a sharp snap - they will contribute to it thickening. They also melt out easily at the higher temperatures.

 

I may be entirely wrong here....but that's my understanding of it! :)

That seems to make very good sense. And might explain part of why when very thick overtempered chocolate is left in a bowl it often looks like crap the next day in the middle. That and the latent heat of crystallization at work.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've been digging around a it more (mostly to avoid doing actual work...) and it seems that.....

 

When we temper chocolate properly; we should only have Type V crystals in there. However - as chocolate cools in various machines/bowls etc....it will likely cool/heat unevenly. This is what can lead to the formation of other crystal types. So basically...as we already know...stir stir stir stir....no really...stir it. 

 

I'm guessing even the best home tempering machine will be prone to uneven temperatures, at least under some conditions (ie: Jim D's situation above). 

 

Also - as we also know.........chocolate has yet to read any of the chemistry books and will behave exactly as it chooses, no matter what the "science" says :)

  • Like 2

Budding, UK based chocolatier .....or at least..that's the plan 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, martin0642 said:

 

 

Also - as we also know.........chocolate has yet to read any of the chemistry books and will behave exactly as it chooses, no matter what the "science" says :)

Ain't that the truth!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I will be in a situation where temperatures reach around 30 degrees celsius, and need to temper in that temperature. At least try to. Anyone got any ideas or suggestions how to handle that? It feels like tempering white chocolate would be the hardest. :S 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Similar Content

    • By eglies
      Hi there, I’m looking for some interesting flavours for truffles. Any combination of filling and coating ideas? For lemon, dark ganache, orange and caramel example. 
      I also realised that when deciding to use ready made truffle shells filling needs to have a creamy texture. Any advice on this? 
    • By CharTruff
      Hello! 
       
      I am doing some spring cleaning and am selling some of my used polycarbonate molds. I've attached pictures and dimensions below.  The mold prices do not include shipping fee. I will ship these via USPS priority mail. 
       
      For estimation purposes only, 4 - 5 molds can fit in a medium box and it costs $15.05 to ship. Please let me know if you have any questions.  
       
      Thank you. 
      Charlotte W. 





    • By eglies
      Hello everyone!
       
      I was wondering if anyone could help me out with these design attached?
       
      I manage to make it on the table somehow and then when trying it into the mould it just doesnt work  
       
      Any tips on this ?
       
      Thank you!!

    • By ptw1953
      I am wishing to purchase some black cocao butter, but it is scarcer than hobby-horse sh*te here in the UK. I do have some cocao butter, and some black fat-soluble powder. Tips and tricks for the making of black cocao butter at home would be most welcome...
       
      ptw1953
    • By La Vie Chocolat
      Beautiful day chocolate friends.
       
      I'm brand new here on the forum. Almost two years ago, I started making pralines in the Czech Republic. There are not many manufacturers and not at all those who work by hand. I have a big problem with cleaning the molds. I like to work cleanly, so I absolutely clean and polish alcohol before each batch of molds. I use my little helper for this - an accumulation screwdriver with an extension, which I made from a wine cork - it works perfectly. I apply clean make-up tampons and possibly alcohol to it.

      But now I have a lot of molds and manual cleaning is crazy. I bought an older dishwasher in a restaurant and I can't find a product (soap, detergent) that would well remove the remnants of chocolate from the sides of the molds and at the same time, of course, would not destroy the molds? Does anyone have any type or advice for any other cleaning machine, please?
       
      I bought a special product "Brillform", which is intended for rinsing already washed molds - it should ensure shine without polishing each tube, but first I have to get the chocolate away.
       
       Here is a link to my website and instagram, you can look at my work and I will be very happy and grateful for any advice and warnings on what I could improve, because there is no professional in the Czech Republic focused on pralines, so there is no one to learn from I teach myself by rehearsing and from great books, videos and watching the world's chocolatiers.
       
      Thank you again
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...