Two entrees - four people

[zoe b]

I like the move em out fast technique!

Then you have the table for a walk in party.

(Now I'm feeling guilty--on Fri night the hub gave me some of his Caesar salad on my bread plate--I hope no one spit on my entree!!!)

[FistFullaRoux]

I like the move em out fast technique!

Then you have the table for a walk in party.

(Now I'm feeling guilty--on Fri night the hub gave me some of his Caesar salad on my bread plate--I hope no one spit on my entree!!!)

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I don't think the issue applies to tasting what's on your husband's plate. The main thing is hogging a 4 top for two entrees only. I'm sure if they were ordering booze or desserts, it wouldn't be such a big deal. If you can feed them and hustle them out the door in 20 minutes, it sort of saves the night for that table.

[Nathan]

I like the move em out fast technique!

Then you have the table for a walk in party.

(Now I'm feeling guilty--on Fri night the hub gave me some of his Caesar salad on my bread plate--I hope no one spit on my entree!!!)

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I don't think the issue applies to tasting what's on your husband's plate. The main thing is hogging a 4 top for two entrees only. I'm sure if they were ordering booze or desserts, it wouldn't be such a big deal. If you can feed them and hustle them out the door in 20 minutes, it sort of saves the night for that table.

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yup. the basic issue from the restaurant's perspective is that they're losing money on these people (and I don't just mean opportunity cost). on the one hand, restaurants are in the hospitality business. on the other, they're not in the charity business.

Edited June 4, 2007 by Nathan (log)

[FistFullaRoux]

OOh, just thought of something else. When taking reservations, ask "how many entrees" instead of "how many people". If someone balks at this, say that the top restaurants in Spain or LA are taking reservations this way, and you were just trying to be trendy.

Then again, I'm the guy with the mischevious streak, as my responses above clearly indicate. I'd be the one to sit down and talk business with them after they have eaten. Buy them a drink or dessert, pull up a chair, and explain the situation. Try not to offend them, but suggest that they could come back any time other than primetime and get what they want with no problems. And throw in the next 2 entrees on the house.

No sense pussy footing around the subject. Margins are thin, and you are probably not making money on that table, or even losing money. Something proactive has to be done, rather than hoping they get the message.

[zoe b]

fistfullaroux said--

don't think the issue applies to tasting what's on your husband's plate. The main thing is hogging a 4 top for two entrees only. I'm sure if they were ordering booze or desserts, it wouldn't be such a big deal. If you can feed them and hustle them out the door in 20 minutes, it sort of saves the night for that table.

I know, i was kinda kidding--but i did just remember there's a restaurant on the Eastern Shore of MD--I think it's called Latitudes--we go there when we visit friends who live nearby.

They do some really clever things. They offer half orders of dinner--I usually get that because i can't eat a whole portion, and since i'm away i can't get a doggy bag. They also have a really cheap nightly special--it's like $5.99--if you eat at the bar.

Now this is an excellent restaurant with a wealthy clientele--and--the kicker is--and the reason this pricing works--I think they make it all up on the bar bills--the customers can really suck the booze up from what I've observed.

Zoe

[adegiulio]

And throw in the next 2 entrees on the house.

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In this case, free meals for a year

Good post FFR

[MissAmy]

If restaurants are so worried about customers spliting entrees, maybe they shouldn't serve enough food for three people in each one!

I'm sorry, but some of these comments are fairly offensive to me. I am not a rich person, but I like to eat in nice restaurants every now and then. My roommate and I frequently split things (usually we split an app, split an entree, split a bottle of wine) and we leave really good tips. If some waiter insinuated to me that I was "too cheap" to eat there because I split things, I'd be pretty pissed and take it up with management.

[slkinsey]

Mussina, I'm curious as to the age of these customers. I ask because one thing I've noticed about my parents (now in their early 70s) is that they can't eat as much as they used to be able to, and often end up taking something home with them -- although I'm sure they would prefer simply having smaller portions.

Combine a decreased capacity for food with the trend of increasing portion sizes and not wanting to push away a half-eaten portion, and splitting an entre per couple sometimes seems like a reasonable option.

[adegiulio]

I think it's funny that if you ask 100 people about portion sizes, 50 will complain that they are getting too big, and 50 will complain that they are getting too small...

[Nathan]

well...prime time Saturday night reservations doesn't sound like the early bird types.

as for portion sizes...I'd be surprised if the kind of restaurant that is serving amuses and truffles is also serving huge portions...we're clearly not talking about TGI Friday's.

[theisenm85]

  How would you have handled this? (We did nothing but get annoyed).

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I think it's tacky for a restaurant to dictate minimums per person. Unless the resaturant is at the scummiest college joint level it smacks of inhospitality.

It barely okay at the scummy college level- but everyone knows that students are broke cheapskates that don't tip.

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"Restaurants" at that level (usually just glorified take out with some tables) are already charging so little it wouldn't matter.

I just graduated college, and from high school through college I never EVER tipped less than 18%. I didn't always go to places that needed tipping (aka no sit down or just fast food style service), but when it was expected, I did it.

[rconnelly]

Curious what other restaurants do to avoid this situation.  We make most of our money on Sat. nights.  It is reservation only and every seat is called for.  We have a party of four (who have been to the restaurant before) reserve for 7:30 (our prime time).  Their order - 2 entrees to share for four people and no apps.  We average $65/person so this does hurt us.  We also serve a bunch of amuses/post dinner truffles which we gave to all four even though there were only two orders.

What is the industry standard as far as plate sharing charges in high end restaurants?  How would you have handled this? (We did nothing but get annoyed).

Many thanks!

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So what did they tip? Just to be nosy.

There's nothing wrong with charging a share a plate dish, so noted on menu. It's done all the time. $2-$5 per person. You do it enough times with this group and more than likely they will not return. Problem solved.

[Pan]

under U.S. Civil Rights Law, denying someone the right to eat in your establishment on the basis of race, religion, color, sex, etc., is prohibited and actionable. So while I sort of get your point, your analogy is very inapt.

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But you can hold the right to refuse service for any other reason. If that was not the case Steve and Ian would have lost 54 the first month.

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Oh, I agree. You can refuse to serve someone who is dressed shabbily, smells, etc. No doubt. But they certainly can't be required to have a license for dining out, by analogy with drivers.

[Pan]

As a person of advanced age on a limited income I can certainly understand why this situation happens. Most places now days put way more food in a serving than we can eat and some things just don't reheat well.

Just because we're on a limited menu shouldn't preclude us from having a decent meal on occasion.

Having spent my whole adult life in the food service industry there are things that I think are reasonable. There should be a reasonable fee for split plates and a fee for extra bread.

Had one group that split entree and then used three baskets of bread to fill up.

Worst I ever saw was a couple that came in for breakfast regularly. They ordered one cup of coffee which he drank and then she drank the refill. Now that's chintzy.

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Solution: No free refills. We don't get them in New York. But then again, free refills is (are?) one of the things I love about California. I also agree that limiting free bread for people who didn't order much is reasonable.

[Pan]

Customer:

"Waiter how much is bread?"

Waiter:

"sir we don't charge for bread."

Customer:

"how much is water?"

Waiter:

"water is free sir."

Customer:

"how much is gravy?"

Waiter:

"sir gravy, as are all our sauces is not charged for."

Customer:

"ok I'm ready to order. I'll have some bread with a dish of gravy and a glass of water."

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A restaurant should refuse service in that situation, unless it chooses to engage in charity.

[adegiulio]

Customer:

"Waiter how much is bread?"

Waiter:

"sir we don't charge for bread."

Customer:

"how much is water?"

Waiter:

"water is free sir."

Customer:

"how much is gravy?"

Waiter:

"sir gravy, as are all our sauces is not charged for."

Customer:

"ok I'm ready to order. I'll have some bread with a dish of gravy and a glass of water."

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A restaurant should refuse service in that situation, unless it chooses to engage in charity.

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Thank goodness we cleared that up...

[Luckylies]

I think it's tacky for a restaurant to dictate minimums per person. Unless the resaturant is at the scummiest college joint level it smacks of inhospitality.

I think it's tacky for 4 adults to go to a restaurant and only order 2 entrees.. No apps or dessert.

No offense to another poster, but if they have to save up for months just to eat there, only to order less than half of what is considered normal, they shouldnt be dining at this restaurant. I would love to eat at per se, Le Bernardin, and Jean Georges every week, but I can't afford it. Just like driving, eating out is a privilege, not a right...

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I'm not saying it's a habit I'd indulge in often, or one that I actively encourage as a dining strategy, but if I'm not hungry enough to eat a whole main course (which I'm not in so many mega portion restaurants these days) I'll share.

If a business can't figure out how to deal with the "normal" number of plate sharers without resorting to bullshitty games- Fuck them.

Have a sharing fee. Reconsider the prices of entrees, charge more for wine...whatever.

I'm serious too. Is this such a rampant problem?

If it is why?

I don't believe Per se, Le Bernardain, and Jean Georges have this problem. Why?

[Kent D]

I have a real problem with "dining is a privilege, not a right". If I'm eating in a place where the staff believe they're bestowing some great privilege upon me by allowing me to partake of their services, I don't want to eat there.

I wouldn't have a problem paying a "split entree" charge, and tip accordingly to make up for the loss of revenue, but I see some restaurants who charge a silly amount for an entree (mostly steakhouses) and then charge you $6 for a salad, and $8 for a steamed veggie on the side, and $8 for a potato, and end up charging you as much for the sides as you're already paying for the entree. We've got a restaurant here that charges $5 a shrimp for shrimp cocktail -- you want 6 shrimp in your shrimp cocktail...$30.

But like I said, it's a moot point, because restaurants who treat me like I'm an inconvenience to them or just a revenue stream aren't going to get my business.

[Makan King]

But like I said, it's a moot point, because restaurants who treat me like I'm an inconvenience to them or just a revenue stream aren't going to get my business.

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But you are a revenue stream. Restaurants are businesses too.

[Pan]

Customer:

"Waiter how much is bread?"

Waiter:

"sir we don't charge for bread."

Customer:

"how much is water?"

Waiter:

"water is free sir."

Customer:

"how much is gravy?"

Waiter:

"sir gravy, as are all our sauces is not charged for."

Customer:

"ok I'm ready to order. I'll have some bread with a dish of gravy and a glass of water."

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A restaurant should refuse service in that situation, unless it chooses to engage in charity.

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Thank goodness we cleared that up...

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Did you think anyone was suggesting that eating for free was acceptable? That's not the topic at hand. My main point was already made: Don't create a "solution" that's worse than the problem.

[Nathan]

I don't believe Per se, Le Bernardain, and Jean Georges have this problem. Why?

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That's an easy one to answer...none of those three restaurants allows you to eat ala carte. its mandatory to order a prix fixe or a tasting menu.

[robert40]

Once I managed a kitchen where we had brick oven pizza's on the menu. They were offered in two sizes: Small= 1 to 2 servings and large 3 maybe 4 servings.

During service one evening a server walked into the kitchen mumbling under her breath about cheap people and them not getting bread. Curious that there may be a problem I inquired. She hesitated but finely informed me table such in such only ordered one small pizza and there were four at the table. I let her know it was the restaurants policy to serve bread to all tables and if she was going to take it upon herself to discriminate she could punch out now.

In the mean time I took notice of the table as this restaurant had a open kitchen.

Seemed to be a family of four and based on my gut feeling I made the following decision. I cooked a large pizza and told the server to bring it to the table and explain my mistake and their small will be out shortly.

On the other hand I can totally relate to your frustration! I can't count the times I seen red over getting split plate orders. And imagine those restaurants where the order must be split in the kitchen? It can call chaos on the line.

Yet in the end I would hope it all balances out by those diners who go all out in ordering: Tasting menus, extra app. or dessert. Or at least I would like to hope so.

I can guarantee you that naturally a plate charge is a option. But there will be those who will be annoyed by it. Even more so if your restaurant has been around awhile and long time customers notice a sudden policy change.

Like those who commented up thread this is the hospitality business and many in the industry tend to forget that. More then anything we can only second guess what someones situation may be who is sitting in our dining room.

Would your opinion change if you approached the party of four one evening and in conversation one confides they have half their stomach eaten away with cancer and can't finish a whole entree? Or a fathers out of work yet really wants to take his family out to raise their spirit's? Such is life and we really never know for sure.

For the record.. The restaurant did not eat the loss of the large pizza. I paid for it myself.

[ghostrider]

The OP mentions that they are repeat customers so:

A) Maybe they like your food & found that they weren't that hungry on that particular night. How far in advance did they have to reserve? You can't always predict an appetite. Maybe they'll be back for full dinners next time.

B) Maybe, since they'd dined there before, they know that you serve portions too large for one person to finish comfortably & ordered accordingly.

Either way, one presumes that they chose to return your place because they enjoy the food. I'd look at ways to turn that into a positive thing rather than gettng annoyed.

That said, many restaurants note plate-sharing charges on their menus, & I see nothing wrong with that if it's an ongoing issue.

[djyee100]

I don't have an answer for this question (which is a toughie), but maybe I can shed some more light on people who split entrees. A couple I know order separate appetizers when they eat out, then split the entree. They just don't eat that much food, they don't want to take it home, and they don't want to waste it, either. They're financially well-off. However, at times they have not been well-treated by a restaurant because they split an entree, and they tell me (and presumably others) all about it.

[Jakea222]

Sharing fee - and not much you can do - I used to work at a club that had a family night every Sunday - pasta bar themed buffets etc - but this one family would order one adult meal for the 2 adults and one kids pasta - usually some form of the 6 we had on the station tossed in butter - then they would get one buffet and all eat off of the one plate! - One adult 19.95, One kid 5.95 - total around 28.00 after tax and club fee instead of 60.00 - Ok here is the kicker- the people were not just loaded - they were part of the top 1/2 of 1% of the rich folks - The Donald Trump line of money - i guess that is why they haved it - stealing it.