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BryanZ

Clarifying juices and broths using gelatin

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I would imagine that sheet gelatin is perfectly fine...they are both pretty much the same thing. Though I do think that sheet gelatin is a purer form and, although a lot of people think I am crazy, I think that powdered gelatin has a bit of a weird taste. But you use it in such small amounts for this technique that I think it's fine.

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I tried this using peanut butter. The result is sort of cool - but the yield is tiny. I probably didn't use enough water this time around (and perhaps too much geletin, I went at nearly 1%), and the result is much of the stuff is left over in the filter (too thick).

Question: Is everyone here using anormal coffee filter? Or do you have something special? Also, has anyone tried repeating the process over again to remove more color? I've noticed a "tint" to most of these clarified stocks which is nice sometimes, but I just wonder what it would take to get it near perfectly clear.

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I decided not to bother melting and dividing it after all. I built a contraption by fitting a large colander on top of a plastic bucket, lining it with cheesecloth and fitting a matching colander into the other one so the cheesecloth is sandwiched in between. I then inverted the container with the ~3 gallons of frozen, gelatinized stock into the colander and wrapped the whole thing in plastic wrap. I'll let it do it's thing for a couple days and see what I get.

The stock was strong going in. I roasted off the chicken for a bit and simmered it in water, strained it and put it in the fridge. Did the same thing the next day with new chicken and just a little more water added. On the third day I did the same yet again with new chicken again but this time I also added the mirepoix and reduced it a bit after straining. I don't usually do all of that for stock of course but this particular consomme has a specific purpose and I wanted a serious "liquid chicken" thing going on, which I got, so I hope it's still there after the filtering.


It's kinda like wrestling a gorilla... you don't stop when you're tired, you stop when the gorilla is tired.

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Question: Is everyone here using anormal coffee filter?  Or do you have something special?  Also, has anyone tried repeating the process over again to remove more color?  I've noticed a "tint" to most of these clarified stocks which is nice sometimes, but I just wonder what it would take to get it near perfectly clear.

I use a normal coffee filter for smaller amounts, layers of cheesecloth in a colander for larger amounts. I think some things are going to be tinted (but still crystal clear) no matter what you do. My strawberry consomme was very clear, you could read text through it, but still had a pink/red color to it. Kinda like putting a drop of red color in a glass of water. Some fruits gave this "tinted" result, some actually turned out literally "clear as water". I'm fairly new to this technique but I think it may depend in part on what you're using and how you extract the liquid. Some things just seem to "stain" (for lack of knowing a better description) the liquid. I don't think you can always end up with something that looks like water but tastes like something else but you can always end up with something that's completely free of cloudiness. Of course this is all just from my personal observation and not an educated reply so take it for what it's worth.


It's kinda like wrestling a gorilla... you don't stop when you're tired, you stop when the gorilla is tired.

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I see that a couple of people upthread have mentioned that chocolate consomme can't be heated. What happens if you do? Does it matter what type of chocolate you use? I'm thinking cacao nibs or powder might be different from bar chocolate, which might be different again at different concentrations.

I was thinking it might be fun to do a riff off of wd-50's miso soup with sesame noodles by doing "chocolate-dipped strawberries," with a warm chocolate broth and strawberry yogurt noodles. Purely for the interactive, entertainment value, of course. :wink:


Matthew Kayahara

Kayahara.ca

@mtkayahara

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I like the idea.  How do you bind the noodles again?  I think I knew at a time but have since forgotten.

I was planning on using methylcellulose, which is why it's important to be able to heat up the chocolate consomme. :biggrin:

It's still a very preliminary idea, though, since I've never used methylcellulose or the gelatin clarification process before. If you want to run with it, though, please do! I'd love to see it pulled off.


Matthew Kayahara

Kayahara.ca

@mtkayahara

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This thread is fun. From the department of weird, fried egg consomme. I don't have a practical use for this but it was an idea I wanted to try and it worked. The flavor is there and it clarified nicely. You can distinctly taste the egg, that they were cooked in butter, that they were fried (you can taste the caramelization) and you can pick up the pepper they were seasoned with. It took a little playing around and there were a couple of unsuccesful batches before I got it right. I'm happy it worked even if I never do it again.

gallery_53467_4795_27963.jpg


It's kinda like wrestling a gorilla... you don't stop when you're tired, you stop when the gorilla is tired.

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Yeah, it doesn't sound too exciting and it's not too exciting cold. Actually, it's not super exciting warm either but it tastes like what it is and that was my goal. Actually getting the flavor into the water didn't turn out to be as easy as just pureed fried eggs in water. That was my first failed batch. What finally worked was eggs fried well above and beyond what should be done to any egg, raw egg yolks (that was the part that was most difficult to get across, the first batch just tasted like boiled egg whites), a few peppercorns and a dose of brown butter all simmered in water, strained, reduced and filtered. I wasn't actually after something I would eat or serve to someone else with this, just playing with moving flavors to another medium without all the fancy (pronounced: expensive) gadgets that are out there. Now if somebody wants to buy me a Rotaval or Heidolph evaporator (or a Gastrovac!) I'll be glad to accept. Might as well throw in a Clarimax while they're at it and I can dispense with the whole raft or freeze filtering process for consommes. :biggrin:


Edited by Tri2Cook (log)

It's kinda like wrestling a gorilla... you don't stop when you're tired, you stop when the gorilla is tired.

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I recently made chicken stock (following the recipe in the Zuni Cookbook) and it turned out well. I put it in the fridge to cool and it was 100% gelatinized (is that a word?). I'd like to try it again and clarify it using this method, but I don't think that it would go through a filter if I kept it in the fridge, it was too solid. Am I wrong about this? I'm leary about leaving it out on the counter for long periods of time.

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Once you get it to the gelatin point in the fridge, freeze it solid then put it in the filter in the fridge. It will do it's thing. The liquid will slowly (overnight to a couple days depending how much you do/how cold your fridge is) seep out leaving a sludgy mass in the filter. You don't want to leave it out at room temp, the gelatin will just melt along with everything else and you'll have to start over.


It's kinda like wrestling a gorilla... you don't stop when you're tired, you stop when the gorilla is tired.

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Once you get it to the gelatin point in the fridge, freeze it solid then put it in the filter in the fridge. It will do it's thing. The liquid will slowly (overnight to a couple days depending how much you do/how cold your fridge is) seep out leaving a sludgy mass in the filter. You don't want to leave it out at room temp, the gelatin will just melt along with everything else and you'll have to start over.

Ah, I see. I'll give it a shot and report back. Thanks for the help.

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I recently made chicken stock (following the recipe in the Zuni Cookbook) and it turned out well.  I put it in the fridge to cool and it was 100% gelatinized (is that a word?).  I'd like to try it again and clarify it using this method, but I don't think that it would go through a filter if I kept it in the fridge, it was too solid.  Am I wrong about this?  I'm leary about leaving it out on the counter for long periods of time.

If it's too gelled, your yield will be low. Probably the best bet is to dilute it until it can just gel in the fridge.


PS: I am a guy.

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I made strawberry consommé and it turned out quite well. The liquid is not very clear but an intense red/pink. It has a very strong strawberry flavor but it's also very sour. I didn't sweeten or flavor the broth I made before I filtered it. I just blended strawberries then heated the thick liquid to reduce some liquid (not sure if this affected anything) and then strained it through a tamis. I added 1 sheet of silver bloom gelatin, poured it into ramekins and froze. Then I put the pucks into a Superbag and suspended it in the fridge. It took about 4 days to get all the consommé out.

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How to Pick(le) a Peach:

Ok, not really. Pickled peaches are easy and google can give you 100 variations faster than I can type "pickled peach" so I won't bore anybody with that. However, I will self-indulgently bore you with the next step I took them to. Pickled peach consomme. I took pickled peaches I made along with their pickling liquid, added roasted fresh peaches, some peach nectar and some water. I blitzed it smooth, heated it, sieved it, adjusted it to my taste with honey and salt (keeping it on the savory side) set it with .5% gelatin and put it through the syneresis filtering process.

gallery_53467_4795_64944.jpg

I'm doing the test run of two dishes I want to bookend a meal with featuring this consomme. A starter and a dessert. I'll report back on how those work out.


It's kinda like wrestling a gorilla... you don't stop when you're tired, you stop when the gorilla is tired.

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Not sure if this has been linked in this thread or otherwise (and I can't vouch for it) but apparently the latest khymos.org hydrocolloid recipe collection has some techniques for agar clarified broths:

http://khymos.org/hydrocolloid-recipe-collection-v2.1.pdf

Thanks to feedback from a reader there is also recipe now for agar filtration (based on a Spanish forum post). This works just like gelatin filtration, but is much faster. Apparently you get more or less the same results with regard to clarity, flavor and color.

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This is fascinating. I hate when I stumble upon things like this so long after everyone else is bored with it already. Oh well... I'll check it out anyone and see what happens.

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This is fascinating.  I hate when I stumble upon things like this so long after everyone else is bored with it already.  Oh well...  I'll check it out anyone and see what happens.

I'm not bored with it. I do tons of things with it. I just try to keep the posts limited to things I'm particularly proud of so I don't completely bore everybody else to death with it. Play away and share what you discover and create... at minimum one of us (me) will check in to cheer you on. :biggrin:


It's kinda like wrestling a gorilla... you don't stop when you're tired, you stop when the gorilla is tired.

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Artisan made beer, cider, wine, etc is clarified by using isinglass finings or Irish moss.

Perhaps a variant on this process would work for stock?


Nick Reynolds, aka "nickrey"

"The Internet is full of false information." Plato
My eG Foodblog

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Not sure if this has been linked in this thread or otherwise (and I can't vouch for it) but apparently the latest khymos.org hydrocolloid recipe collection has some techniques for agar clarified broths

Yeah, I'm giving that one a go this weekend. If it's that much faster with comparable results I'll definitely adopt it.


It's kinda like wrestling a gorilla... you don't stop when you're tired, you stop when the gorilla is tired.

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This is fascinating.  I hate when I stumble upon things like this so long after everyone else is bored with it already.  Oh well...  I'll check it out anyone and see what happens.

I'm not bored with it. I do tons of things with it. I just try to keep the posts limited to things I'm particularly proud of so I don't completely bore everybody else to death with it. Play away and share what you discover and create... at minimum one of us (me) will check in to cheer you on. :biggrin:

Haha... Thanks.

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So I gave the agar version a shot and at this point I'm not impressed but that's with the disclaimer that there may be self-inflicted problems I'm dealing with. I used .07% agar in a batch of smoked turkey stock, froze it, dumped it in a filter lined sieve and after 72 hours in the cooler it's still not completely drained out. It was a decent sized batch of stock (about 4400g) but I've done similar and much larger with gelatin in a shorter time frame. So at this point it's no faster for me than gelatin and probably slower. The clarity does appear to be on par though.

Now on to the possible fly in the ointment I considered. I did this with turkey stock which should have some self-created gelatin already going on. Would this be a factor? I'm going to give it another go with a fruit or veggie juice or something that has no natural gelatin and see what happens with that.


It's kinda like wrestling a gorilla... you don't stop when you're tired, you stop when the gorilla is tired.

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...

I did this with turkey stock which should have some self-created gelatin already going on. Would this be a factor?

...

I've no idea how gelatinous your turkey stock is in itself, but my chicken stock usually has enough gelatine to set in the fridge. Adding agar to that will probably just slow things down.

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Yeah, I'm convinced that the gelatin was the culprit. The gelatin/agar combo was just too much. That was my fault, a few seconds spent thinking instead of rushing right into trying the new trick probably would have floated the possibility of that problem through my head before it was too late. Oh well, sometimes you learn things the hard way. It's still learning, so that's ok.


It's kinda like wrestling a gorilla... you don't stop when you're tired, you stop when the gorilla is tired.

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