• Welcome to the eG Forums, a service of the eGullet Society for Culinary Arts & Letters. The Society is a 501(c)3 not-for-profit organization dedicated to the advancement of the culinary arts. These advertising-free forums are provided free of charge through donations from Society members. Anyone may read the forums, but to post you must create an account.

Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0
Mayhaw Man

Why Use fondant?

128 posts in this topic

As far as I know, silver lustre dust is "outlawed" (er, whatever) in California for food consumption.

I don't think this is correct or I am buying back alley cake supplies. :laugh:

"Pssst, buddy, over here. Look at these beauties...*opens his big black raincoat*.. I got some dragees and non-pareils in a dime bag, what say ya?"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
As far as I know, silver lustre dust is "outlawed" (er, whatever) in California for food consumption.

I don't think this is correct or I am buying back alley cake supplies. :laugh:

"Pssst, buddy, over here. Look at these beauties...*opens his big black raincoat*.. I got some dragees and non-pareils in a dime bag, what say ya?"

Actually, several years ago a Napa, CA lawyer named Mark Pollock filed and won a class action suit against The Silver Dragee company in France (who makes them), plus all California retailers known to have sold them. The idea was that silver can build up in the body if these dragees are eaten, or if not eaten, they'd end up in a landfill and contaminate the ground water, because we all know that a naturally occuring mineral CANNOT touch the earth. :hmmm:

Funny thing about class action suits in the US.... you don't have to actually prove any of your claims in court, nor do you actually have to give any of the money awarded to any of the "victims", and can actually keep all the money for yourself.

This same guy's currently working on a class action suit against anyone who sells fish, because of the mercury. :angry:

But, to keep this post on topic about fondant.... er, uhm.... DOWN WITH FONDANT !!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
As far as I know, silver lustre dust is "outlawed" (er, whatever) in California for food consumption.

I don't think this is correct or I am buying back alley cake supplies. :laugh:

"Pssst, buddy, over here. Look at these beauties...*opens his big black raincoat*.. I got some dragees and non-pareils in a dime bag, what say ya?"

Even here in less progressive New England, ALL silver dragees are labeled not for consumption. They still sell 'em in the stores, but you are supposed to pick all those buggers off your dessert before you eat it. Then what? Have a dragee fight?

Shoot, I think I have to rip my fillings out.... silver and mercury you know...


Cheryl, The Sweet Side

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yikes! Years ago I made a cake covered in fondant and decorated with silver dragees (at the bride's demand, um, I mean, request, even though I tried to talk her out of it.)

I wonder how many people died because of that. :shock:

Eileen

PS: I think there is a place in the food world for American buttercream, also. Lots and lots of people like it, and if it's made with butter (and cream, huh, K8? :biggrin: ) I'm not offended. I develop recipes for cookies and desserts, including American buttercream, for consumers. I think it's unrealistic to believe that regular home bakers are going to be willing to make IM/SM/FBC, (and they certainly aren't going to cover a regular, everyday cake with fondant ! I'm just grateful when people are willing to bake from scratch instead of serving BJ's chemical cardboard and plastic cakes.


Eileen Talanian

HowThe Cookie Crumbles.com

HomemadeGourmetMarshmallows.com

As for butter versus margarine, I trust cows more than chemists. ~Joan Gussow

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I like powdered sugar and I like powdered sugar icing. I like powdered sugar glazes for stuff. It's pretty on baked goods. It's good stuff. It's sweet like ahh, icing. My recipe for American buttercream made with powdered sugar, cream and butter is very good. Some people like to eat it. Not all people of course. Powdered sugar is a nice ingredient. It's ok. It's an ingredient. It has no social skill or value. Of course, let me hasten hasten to disclaim that American buttercream is not 'real' buttercream. Why you ask? Because, silly, you need hot eggs to make 'real' butter-cream.  :rolleyes:

So shoot me for liking and using and supporting the cause for UnReal Buttercream.

Nah, ain't gonna shoot you K8! Just won't eat that crusting stuff, and I do consider it buttercream as long as it's made with butter. Just don't like the little socks it puts on my teeth. And if a home baker can only make buttercream with butter and powdered sugar, more power to them. At least it didn't come from a can with all that hydrogenated or fractionated oils in it. I'm all about the light, smooth, silky stuff. And fondant doesn't qualify.

I will admit when using fondant (the GOOD brands, not Wilton), I do eat little chunks like candy. But, won't eat a slab of it on a cake. Texture thing going on there, just like you said -- I don't want to chew my frosting. Now on a cookie, I don't find it all that bad.


Cheryl, The Sweet Side

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

cheryl,

that's funny you mentioned fondant on a cookie not being bad. i made some the other day and i couldn't even tell i was eating fondant, kinda just blended into the cookie. plus it was so much easier to do then icing each individual cookie. :wacko: might have to start offering this to my customers. i just picked up some cheesecake oil, maybe i will add that to my mmf and see what it does to the flavor.


Edited by Dailey (log)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I also make a butter "frosting", American style buttercream with butter, 10x sugar and cream. Smooth, not gritty, not crusty and actually good. Especially on cupcakes. I have a problem with making buttercream that takes longer than it does to make the cupcakes, :blink: . I reserve that for the knock your socks off cakes.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

But didn't you put a layer of buttercream under the fondant already?  I don't see why they should have had to apply a fresh new coat of it.

Yes, but only a thin layer - and after fondant is applied and removed some of the buttercream will stickt to it.

So, with a very large icing tip - a couple of turns on the turntable - and it's all done.....and tasty.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I also make a butter "frosting", American style buttercream with butter, 10x sugar and cream.  Smooth, not gritty, not crusty and actually good.  Especially on cupcakes.  I have a problem with making buttercream that takes longer than it does to make the cupcakes, :blink: .  I reserve that for the knock your socks off cakes.

I am staying out of the fondant debate, but I will stick my nose in on the "american buttercream" debate making it with butter is not unusual all my English cookbooks use a butter + powdered sugar buttercream, and that was what my grandmother and knowing the tradtions in my family her mother, used so I wondering if american buttercream started out with butter, but the birth of crisco gave rise to the current "monster".

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I could be completely off base here, but perhaps the all shortening version came about when butter and such went into ration. A lot of recipes changed during that time because they couldn't get all the ingredients so they had to modify to suit the times.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I also make a butter "frosting", American style buttercream with butter, 10x sugar and cream.  Smooth, not gritty, not crusty and actually good.  Especially on cupcakes.  I have a problem with making buttercream that takes longer than it does to make the cupcakes, :blink: .   I reserve that for the knock your socks off cakes.

I am staying out of the fondant debate, but I will stick my nose in on the "american buttercream" debate making it with butter is not unusual all my English cookbooks use a butter + powdered sugar buttercream, and that was what my grandmother and knowing the tradtions in my family her mother, used so I wondering if american buttercream started out with butter, but the birth of crisco gave rise to the current "monster".

Well yes I totally agree with y'all. And I make cooked icicngs too. And I use fondant and crisco and all manner of controversial contraband.

And I'd like to see someone do a quilted cake, not lattice, not piped on, but quilted, where it's impressed into the surface and the bride does not want fondant. As we've discussed, many brides do not want fondant. Crusting buttercream is as much a decorating implement as the ball tool and cake pan.

Y'know what? I like grocery store cakes. I LOVE hostess cupcakes--the chocolate ones. Ate them every day for lunch in high school, got the celulite to prove it too. :laugh: My son works in a place that Zagat's compares this way, "Heaven comes in second place and it's not close" You can find Chef-boy curled up upon ocassion with a comfy box of Zebra cakes.

Crisco is another great ingredient if you need to bolster your icing from humidity and heat issues. It happens. Or if you need to tune up dry fondant.

A discussion about fondant means it's a discussion about decorating. If you do tier cakes, it's a no holds barred activity. Crusting buttercream is the answer to cakes that look like fondant and still melt in your mouth.

PC's do awesome awesome stuff in the way of those elaborate sugar displays and chocolate creations. Generally those travel a few feet or a few floors in one building. When you start traveling out doors and in traffic and temperature extremes with sugar creations you gotta use everything you know and everything you can find out and everything you can get your hands on to do it. Not to mention in your spare time being an essential part of fulfilling the young lady's lifelong dream.

I just encourage people to broaden their horizons within their own personal tasteful and creative reason.

:raz: Long live UNREAL buttercream and everything else too :raz:

.......................... [merrily waves arms in air]


Edited by K8memphis (log)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
You know, I'm thinking that the icing on good black and white (half and lhalf) cookies is pretty darned delicious. Is that a kind of fondant?

Yes, although it is often referred to as a "poured fondant." I have no idea where the distinction is made between that and a glaze, or if there even is one.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I had a real cake for my wedding, a friend, pastry chef make it. I didn't want that fake fondant crap either!

It was three tiers, chocolate marbled cake , with butter cream (the good stuff) and Grand Marnier. The icing was also flavored slightly with orange.

I asked him to freeze the whole thing, as it was put out to thaw for the duration of the reception, was thawed completly , yet slightly cool when it came time to serve it. Fresh flowers adorned the cake.

It is a cake, to be eaten, and there for should be not only pretty to look at , but tasty !

I think most people have fogoten the reason for the food being there in the first place!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I didn't want that fake fondant crap either!

Ah, but I NEVER use FAKE fondant.....only the real stuff..... :wink:

:laugh: Me neither Ann, only homemade and WHAT a difference! But there are still a few that we just will never bring over to the dark side. :wink:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi all, I'm a long term "lurker," but figured it was time to come out of the closet.

My oldest friend is getting married in six months, and called me last night after spending a week tasting various wedding cake options. It seems that her decorating choices require that she has fondant, but she doesn't want something her guests must peel off. I've always been her food resource, but in this case all I know is that if a cake has fondant, I peel it off. I vaguely remember a "Sugar Rush" on Food TV where the bakery used chocolate plastic/plastique (?) instead of fondant. Is it better tasting? Is this a feasible alternative?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Food TV where the bakery used chocolate plastic/plastique (?) instead of fondant. Is it better tasting? Is this a feasible alternative?

Chocolate plastique or modeling chocolate as it's also called, MIGHT taste better. It all depends on who you ask. The best way to describe the taste of chocolate plastique is to compare it to a white tootsie roll......chewy white chocolate, is basically what it is.

It's a feasible alternative if the bakery she chose uses it. Some bakeries don't because they choose not to, or don't know how, or don't even know about it. Also, most of the time, modeling chocolate will cost more. I charge my brides top dollar for that particular finish.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thank you so much for your answer!

She hasn't chosen a bakery yet, has just been making the rounds. She called me first. I'll tell her what you said, and she will be able to ask the bakeries about it. At least it's another option.

Actually, I'm surprised the whole modeling chocolate as an option didn't come up before within this discussion. I'd think more cake designers would offer it as an option.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Actually, I'm surprised the whole modeling chocolate as an option didn't come up before within this discussion. I'd think more cake designers would offer it as an option.

There is a difference but once that opinion is formed from your own experience or the experience/opinion of someone you know who dislikes it, it's a very difficult thing to get someone to then appreciate the finer differences of the chocolate kind. It does melt in the mouth nicer. I really like it, but fondant gets no respect.

I make my own fondant from marshmallows and I combine this with candy clay. It's easy, inexpensive, handles great and is yumaliscious. But if the cards are stacked against the whole concept...


Edited by K8memphis (log)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

kate,

do you used real chocolate or just the wafers? i think i'm gonna give it a try in the near future. also, i just figured out how to cover my cakes quite well with the mmf, do you think the chocolate clay is similair in the ease of covering? i would think it would be more finicky. any thoughts? thanks :biggrin:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've just used the wafers. When I add the vanilla/butter powder that you can get from King Arthur's into the wafers, my chocoholic daughter cannot stop eating it.

I did my caterpillar cake with the mmf plus candy clay--I think I used two parts mmf to one part candy clay. Was a wonderful product. Very forgiving. Covered great and those are almost round balls of cake. If I recall I only had one or two creases. That I covered up with decor.

I notice I have to keep it warm more so than regular fondant. But it is more user friendly in that it is longer to crust and just as flexible. And it tastes good like candy. Takes flavorings well.

I think this is easier than plain mmf.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

thanks kate! that vanilla/butter powder sounds awesome. :wub:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I make my own fondant from marshmallows and I combine this with candy clay. It's easy, inexpensive, handles great and is yumaliscious. But if the cards are stacked against the whole concept...

Hey K8......

I've never tried mixing fondant and modeling chocolate together before (I assume modeling chocolate is what you are referring to, when you say "candy clay"?).

You wouldn't want to share your recipe or methodology, would you? :wub:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I make my own fondant from marshmallows and I combine this with candy clay. It's easy, inexpensive, handles great and is yumaliscious. But if the cards are stacked against the whole concept...

Hey K8......

I've never tried mixing fondant and modeling chocolate together before (I assume modeling chocolate is what you are referring to, when you say "candy clay"?).

You wouldn't want to share your recipe or methodology, would you? :wub:

For sure. Clickety then scroll down to post #9. Yes, umm modeling chocolate is candy clay.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.