buying and preparing fish/seafood

[Hiroyuki]

Other possibilities include nijimasu, yamame, and iwana.

Sorry, too busy to find good photos of them.

You can find some photos of ayu dishes here.

[torakris]

This has been driving me crazy all morning....

I think I may have figured it out though, I can only think of one style of preparing these larger fish that would result in them being eaten whole, kanroni!

All of the fish Hiroyuki mentioned can be prepared in this style, was it soemthing like these?

nijimasu (rainbow trout) kanroni

yamame kanroni

amago kanroni

[puerco]

the first one looks pretty close to what i remember. still doesn't look like something i would want to bite the head off of . how exactly are these prepared? are they any good? i've always kind of regretted not trying it. thanks to you both for solving that mystery.

This has been driving me crazy all morning....

I think I may have figured it out though, I can only think of one style of preparing these larger fish that would result in them being eaten whole, kanroni!

All of the fish Hiroyuki mentioned can be prepared in this style, was it soemthing like these?

nijimasu (rainbow trout) kanroni

yamame kanroni

amago kanroni

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[torakris]

the first one looks pretty close  to what i remember. still doesn't look like something i would want to bite the head off of  . how exactly are these prepared? are they any good? i've always kind of regretted not trying it. thanks to you both for solving that mystery.

This has been driving me crazy all morning....

I think I may have figured it out though, I can only think of one style of preparing these larger fish that would result in them being eaten whole, kanroni!

All of the fish Hiroyuki mentioned can be prepared in this style, was it soemthing like these?

nijimasu (rainbow trout) kanroni

yamame kanroni

amago kanroni

←

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These are quite good actually sort of sweet and salty. Kanroni fall in the category of tsukudani, here is some general information in English.

Quite a bit of sugar is used in preserving them, to make them quickly at home you could use much less but you should eat them soon. I looked at various Japanese recipes and some use three kinds of sugar (regular white sugar, mirin and mizuame, a sugar syrup). One recipe even took three days from start to finish!

[Kent Wang]

I've added this recipe to RecipeGullet.

[markemorse]

This summer at one of the many lovely beaches here in Holland, at one of the many lovely fish trucks/carts on the beach, I was treated to an unexpected pleasure: a plate of deep-fried surimi fresh from the fryer. It was GREAT. The dipping sauces are the standard Dutch fried fish options: tartar, garlic, and something called "cocktail" or whisky sauce that's kinda like Thousand Island. Should mention that the batter was very light, as it typically is with Dutch fried seafood.

I didn't have my camera with me that day, and I kept saying I would go back and take a picture, but I didn't. The fish truck I bought it from has lots of pictures, but none of the deep-fried imitation crabfood.

My question is...has anyone else ever tasted this? Google suggests that not many people have. It's apparently served in exactly two restaurants: a Texan sushi bar and a German tapas bar.

mark

Edited August 17, 2006 by markemorse (log)

[markemorse]

Sorry, I meant to add: the Japanese must do this, right? It's right up their alley.

Edited August 17, 2006 by markemorse (log)

[wattacetti]

I've had this before at a local Vietnamese restaurant called La Petite Tonkinoise. Fried like tempura and served with mayo and fish sauce.

[jmsaul]

I've had this at a couple dim sum restaurants, but it was wrapped in nori before being fried in a very light coating. Surprisingly good, actually.

[markemorse]

interesting, interesting....

what i liked about the way I had it was that it was "cheap beach food", and it was served in a pile for snacking, very informal. the nori thing might be nice...jmsaul, was yours a tempura batter too (if you know)?

[Zeemanb]

I've actually had this at a local fast food Chinese Restaurant in a not-great part of town (just off of 63rd and Troost, for anyone familiar with K.C., Mo.). Had the grease been fresher, and had they not used such large pieces of surimi I could see this being good in a fried cheese curd kind of way. Don't think I've seen them on any other local menus. They were billed as "Crab Sticks" which I just had to try out of curiosity. Definitely not a light, tempura style batter btw.

[Hiroyuki]

Sorry, I meant to add: the Japanese must do this, right? It's right up their alley.

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Of course, we do!

Could anyone provide some photos of deep-fried surimi so I can tell what you guys mean by "deep-fried" and "surimi"?

[EllenC]

Hiroyuki, I love your answer.

Here is an example of deep fried.

And this is a picture of surimi.

[markemorse]

Ellen that was very sweet of you, but "The Japanese", in addition to being in love with deep-fried surimi, appear to also have a taste for disingenuousness. At least on this topic.

So...Hiroyuki, have you ever had it, made it, etc.?

Edited August 17, 2006 by markemorse (log)

[torakris]

By surimi are we talking about the actual sticks that look like fake crab legs? In Japanese the term surimi is generally a generic term to refer to fish paste and usually before it has taken any form. Once it has been formed and most likely steamed it then is often referred to as kamaboko, in my area of Japan those "sticks" are usually called kani (crab) kamaboko.

Sorry, but sometimes the Japanese words when used outside of Japan get confusing...

[markemorse]

I totally thought Hiroyuki was kidding, based on the depth of his discussion on the tempura thread, at least about deep-frying...my bad.

In this case, the surimi we're talking about are the sticks, yes, but in my specific case they're cut a bit differently, on the diagonal like in the photo that Ellen posted.

[Hiroyuki]

Ellen that was very sweet of you, but "The Japanese", in addition to being in love with deep-fried surimi, appear to also have a taste for disingenuousness.    At least on this topic.

So...Hiroyuki, have you ever had it, made it, etc.?

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So, we are talking about some finished fish meat product like imitation crab sticks that is deep-fried with batter? If so, I have, of course! One of my favorites is chikuwa deep-fried with batter containing ao-nori (type of seaweed).

Just as torakris has just clarified, surimi is a generic term for "minced flesh". In Japan, it's usually refers to any raw material for use in making all kinds of fish meat product like kamaboko, chikuwa, and satsumaage (surimi deep-fried without batter).

[markemorse]

Cool! Thanks for taking me to school. So what I had was kani kamaboko.

So is the batter on the chikuwa a tempura-y kind of thing? And is the dipping sauce anything like a gyoza sauce?

[Hiroyuki]

Cool! Thanks for taking me to school.  So what I had was kani kamaboko.

So is the batter on the chikuwa a tempura-y kind of thing? And is the dipping sauce anything like a gyoza sauce?

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I searched for a good photo of deep-fried chikuwa, and I found this (sorry, Japanese only).

The batter is merely normal tempura batter plus ao-nori (green powder in one of the photos). You can eat deep-fried chikuwa without any sauce, with ten tsuyu (dipping sauce for tempura), with soy sauce, etc., etc. But I've never had it with a gyoza sauce (soy sauce + vinegar + raayu (piquant sesame seed oil)!

[chappie]

In the summer of 1997 I worked on a surimi vessel off the coast of Washington in Neah Bay. We took in copious schools of Pacific hake, one of the mushiest, crappiest fish around, and processed them (by adding sugar, sorbitol and -- yes -- beef blood plasma!) into homogenous sweetened fish paste, a.k.a surimi.

All of it went directly onto container ships bound for Japan; in fact, the company was partially Japanese-owned and much of our work was supervised by Japanese surimi technicians. Yes, this was a title and probably involved some lenghty apprenticeships.

Not my favorite substance in the world, but I'll eat it in California rolls. I guess it would be good this way, too. The best part of the surimi summer was that we caught all sorts of delicious fish as bycatch like mackeral, coho salmon and some species of rockfish, all of which were cooked in the galley.

The chefs never once served surimi, however.

[Hiroyuki]

In the summer of 1997 I worked on a surimi vessel off the coast of Washington in Neah Bay. We took in copious schools of Pacific hake, one of the mushiest, crappiest fish around, and processed them (by adding sugar, sorbitol and -- yes -- beef blood plasma!) into homogenous sweetened fish paste, a.k.a surimi.

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That should really be an adventure in eating!

I don't think that all surimi are produced the way you mentioned, but I think that the type of cheap fish meat sausage that I frequently buy is probably produced in a similar way.

[Julian Teoh]

In Australia, "seafood sticks," always battered, are a feature at every fish-n-chip shop. Quality of the batter is greatly variable, but it is served as is, with a slice of lemon and a pile of greasy chips.

Speaking or surimi / kamaboko experiences, I was taken aback the other day on a weekend away to Queensland's Sunshine Coast. I asked for a seafood stick to go with my fish and chip order, and the staffer said "Certainly, would you like it battered or crumbed?" I have never, in all my years living in Australia, been offered a crumbed seafood stick before, so I opted for crumbed.

The verdict: excellent, and not a greasy mouthful anywhere.

[jmsaul]

the nori thing might be nice...jmsaul, was yours a tempura batter too (if you know)?

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Yes, but a very light and thin one.

[torakris]

For anyone interested in learning more about surimi and other Japanese fish paste products should look at this thread.

If you are ready to expand into cooking your own fish paste products here is a wonderful recipe for deep fried fish balls from hzrt8w over in the China forum.

He also has a recipe for using the Thai style prepared fish cakes.

[smallworld]

I made a very unpleasant discovery after dinner tonight.

I had scaled and gutted a small sea bream and then poached it whole. Filleted after cooking, leaving bones and head in the cooking pan. After dinner I decided to pick through the head to retrieve the cheeks, and I got horrible, horrible shock. Inside the head, near the gills, were two nasty creatures that looked like-- well, I'm not sure as I've never seen anything like it. Imagine a large beetle larvae crossed with a mantis shrimp. Then imagine it 10X nastier, and you're getting close.

Now, I have a fairly high tolerance for grossness-- I love bugs, have no problem gutting a fish. But I was so revolted by these creatures that I felt nauseous, and now I'm getting worried. Very very glad I didn't serve the fish whole, as discovering them at the table would have been far worse.

So what on earth were they? The fish's last meal? Parasites? Do they pose any danger? Should I contact the store I bought them (to warn them/ask for my money back)?

If it helps, this was a small sea bream, about 20cm. The Japanese label said "tai", and I don't remember the country of origin or whether or not it was farmed. I was disappointed at the taste of the fish-- too soft, almost mushy. And distinctly fishy, even though it appeared very fresh. (No idea if the taste of the fish would be affected by these creatures, just an observation.) The creatures were inside the head, around the throat or gills. One about 5cm, the other .5cm, both white.

Any help would be appreciated!

Edited September 14, 2006 by smallworld (log)