Salt (merged topics)

[cjsadler]

Is there a difference between Morton's and Diamond kosher salt? It seems to me that Morton's is more 'salty' (it seems like I really need to cut back when using it). Is it just a grain size difference between the two or what?

[JAZ]

One thing I do when I'm salting the food I'm cooking is to put a little of the food into a prep bowl when I think I'm getting close to the right salt level. Then I add a tiny bit more to the food in the bowl and see if it helps or hurts. If the food doesn't need more salt, I haven't ruined the whole dish.

Incidentally, I've noticed with my cooking students that the most common error in salting is to get to the point where there's almost enough salt and then stop. When I have them try the trick with the prep bowl, it's often an eye-opener for them. It shows them exactly what we're tasting for.

Keep in mind that when you're "salting to taste," you don't (usually) want your food to taste salty. What you're tasting for is really what the salt does for the other ingredients. If you taste a soup that's undersalted, for example, it'll taste flat, and some herbs or spices might seem overpowering, while others don't seem to show up at all. Add a pinch or two of salt, and the flavor overall will become more lively (for lack of a better term) and the other flavors should come into balance.

Sometimes when you think you need more salt, what you really need is a touch of acid (lemon juice, wine, tomatoes, etc.). You can use the prep bowl trick to test for acid levels, too. And don't discount MSG as a flavor enhancer, unless you have a reaction to it.

Check out this TDG article for more information.

[Dave the Cook]

Is there a difference between Morton's and Diamond kosher salt?  It seems to me that Morton's is more 'salty' (it seems like I really need to cut back when using it).    Is it just a grain size difference between the two or what?

Yes. Morton's is closer to the usual cube in shape (somewhat rougher, but mostly just larger, than standard table salt), whereas Diamond Crystal is formed in flakes. The practical difference is that, when measuring by volume, you get more Morton's in the measure than DC. Roughly:

one teaspoon table salt = 1-1/2 teaspoons Morton's = 2 teaspoons Diamond Crystal

[lorea]

Yes. Morton's is closer to the usual cube in shape (somewhat rougher, but mostly just larger, than standard table salt), whereas Diamond Crystal is formed in flakes. The practical difference is that, when measuring by volume, you get more Morton's in the measure than DC. Roughly:

one teaspoon table salt = 1-1/2 teaspoons Morton's = 2 teaspoons Diamond Crystal

Whew...I thought I was crazy, or something was wrong with my taste buds!

I have a question....is a salt grinder supposed to make food taste better than kosher salt?

[bleachboy]

I have a question....is a salt grinder supposed to make food taste better than kosher salt?

No. A salt grinder is a fetish item.

[Mudpuppie]

Don't excoriate me, but I've only recently (1-2 years) started really using salt in cooking. I had always avoided it because I don't like salty foods, and because my family has a history of high blood pressure.

Now I'm working on not using too much. It's definitely a delicate balance.

And, sigh, I've only recently developed high blood pressure, so now I'm really trying to master the art. When I'm really trying to temper myself, I'll try to add an acid instead of more salt. It somehow tricks my palate.

[Dave the Cook]

And, sigh, I've only recently developed high blood pressure, so now I'm really trying to master the art. When I'm really trying to temper myself, I'll try to add an acid instead of more salt. It somehow tricks my palate.

Only 40 to 50 percent of the white population, and 65 to 70% of the black population (I couldn't find numbers for other groups) are salt-sensitive. I'm not qualified to advise you on the crucial medical aspects of diet, but it might be worth your while to find out if you're really in the sensitive group.

[Verjuice]

Does anyone have strong feelings regarding which stage of cooking ro add the salt? I find that I am much more likely to oversalt at the table if I don't salt enough at the beginning of cooking...

[Dave the Cook]

I agree that undersalting at the stove results in oversalting at the table.

I try to pay attention to salt at pretty much every stage, but I think its effects are most profound in the early stages, especially for starchy things. Rice, potatoes, polenta, pasta and beans don't taste the same if all the salt is added at the end.

[ExtraMSG]

alanamoana and jaz both had excellent suggetions. Three more:

* Don't base your tasting judgments on hot food. It's much easier to taste lukewarm foods.

* Take a drink of water to clear your palate before tasting. I think the mouth gets used to flavors and so this is generally good suggestion for tasting.

* Give the salt a minute or so to dissolve into a sauce or whatever before tasting for salt.

[Mabelline]

Don't you all think the amount of 'uncontrollable' salt you consume has a lot to do with your perception of salt-taste? If I use canned goods in a large amount in a recipe, I drain, rinse, and depending on the meat salt very little, or don't salt at all. With meat, I feel it has to have some salt. And, I agree wholeheartedly with the acidic suggestion- I use lemon, lime, and a variety of vinegars to bring up the salt/sweet balance. And I don't ever leave out the pepper...which varies in what type of pepper to the type of food.

[Katherine]

Don't you all think the amount of 'uncontrollable' salt you consume has a lot to do with your perception of salt-taste? If I use canned goods in a large amount in a recipe, I drain, rinse, and depending on the meat salt very little, or don't salt at all. With meat, I feel it has to have some salt. And, I agree wholeheartedly with the acidic suggestion- I use lemon, lime, and a variety of vinegars to bring up the salt/sweet balance. And I don't ever leave out the pepper...which varies in what type of pepper to the type of food.

Nowadays, supermarket meat is presalted-pumped up with a saline solution which is supposed to make dry, flavorless meat tender and juicy. They claim they're doing this because the customer is demanding it, insists on paying meat dollars for water?

One effect is to make meat broth and stock already too salty to concentrate as I like. I wonder what people who are on a salt-restricted diet are expected to do, pay 4X as much to have boutique meat shipped to them?

[Mabelline]

I guess I am lucky to have my own sources of meat, but can't one buy a roast , blade, shoulder, and have it ground to their order? All the butchers I know would be happy to fill your order, and especially if they are a craftsman at their trade, be glad to give you somethiing out of the norm? I realize the cases full of gray sorry sad looking stuff is what you are referring to, but can't you find someone to make you some good food? But under no circumstances would I accept water and/or salt impregnated meat. I see what you are saying, and believe me, I been there, however the squeaky wheel gets the grease; stand there and bitch!

[Katherine]

I guess I am lucky to have my own sources of meat, but can't one buy a roast , blade, shoulder, and have it ground to their order? All the butchers I know would be happy to fill your order, and especially if they are a craftsman at their trade, be glad to give you somethiing out of the norm? I realize the cases full of gray sorry sad looking stuff is what you are referring to, but can't you find someone to make you some good food? But under no circumstances would I accept water and/or salt impregnated meat. I see what you are saying, and believe me, I been there, however the squeaky wheel gets the grease; stand there and bitch!

Nowadays, this is the type of meat (beef, pork, chicken, even duck!) that supermarkets carry. If you buy your meat in a supermarket, this is what you're getting. If the supermarket only stocks this type of meat, they're not going to do anything for you. They know you have no place else to shop, and nobody else cares.

When you buy a package of meat in the cryovac state, it's always labeled to this effect, but when they repackage it, they don't relabel the smaller retail packages.

Glad you can get what you want, but it's not available here, and I can't afford to have it shipped.

[Oreganought]

Salt, one of the very basic ingredients, yet so very tricky to control.

What's your secret to handling salt?

I find my cooking half the time too salty, the other half the time not salty enough.

I agree.A balancing act that takes a deft hand and an experienced palate to master

properly. I don't seem to be able to come up with any sure fire rules though.

[JAZ]

And, sigh, I've only recently developed high blood pressure, so now I'm really trying to master the art. When I'm really trying to temper myself, I'll try to add an acid instead of more salt. It somehow tricks my palate.

Only 40 to 50 percent of the white population, and 65 to 70% of the black population (I couldn't find numbers for other groups) are salt-sensitive. I'm not qualified to advise you on the crucial medical aspects of diet, but it might be worth your while to find out if you're really in the sensitive group.

Dave, you mean 40-50% (and 65-70%) of the people with high blood pressure are salt sensitive, don't you? Not those percentages of the general population?

[JAZ]

Don't you all think the amount of 'uncontrollable' salt you consume has a lot to do with your perception of salt-taste? If I use canned goods in a large amount in a recipe, I drain, rinse, and depending on the meat salt very little, or don't salt at all. With meat, I feel it has to have some salt. And, I agree wholeheartedly with the acidic suggestion- I use lemon, lime, and a variety of vinegars to bring up the salt/sweet balance. And I don't ever leave out the pepper...which varies in what type of pepper to the type of food.

Nowadays, supermarket meat is presalted-pumped up with a saline solution which is supposed to make dry, flavorless meat tender and juicy. They claim they're doing this because the customer is demanding it, insists on paying meat dollars for water?

One effect is to make meat broth and stock already too salty to concentrate as I like. I wonder what people who are on a salt-restricted diet are expected to do, pay 4X as much to have boutique meat shipped to them?

Meat like this is, in effect, pre-brined. As Dave explains in his great eGCI course on brining, you're paying for extra water when you buy meat like this. But having tried it, I have to say that it does what it claims to -- that is, meat treated this way did cook up very moist and flavorful. I'd still rather brine meat myself, but for cooks who don't know how or don't have the time, I don't think it's a bad idea.

[ExtraMSG]

Katherine, this is probably just pre-packaged meats, though, like whole turkeys and individually packed tenderloins, isn't it?

Most of the meat I buy at the supermarket are just slabs of whatever. I don't even think the individually frozen pieces of chicken breast I buy are brined.

I'd be really surprised if most of the meat at the supermarket is pre-brined. But maybe we're just shopping at different supermarkets.

[jmcgrath]

Meat like this is, in effect, pre-brined. As Dave explains in his great eGCI course on brining, you're paying for extra water when you buy meat like this. But having tried it, I have to say that it does what it claims to -- that is, meat treated this way did cook up very moist and flavorful. I'd still rather brine meat myself, but for cooks who don't know how or don't have the time, I don't think it's a bad idea.

This is a pain for those of us who use spice rubs on our barbecue. A typical rub contains a lot of salt and the brining puts things over the top. I make most of my own rubs and can adjust the salt content to compensate for brining. Anyone using a commercial rub is out of luck. The problem is at its worst with pork ribs which have a large surface area to volume ratio.

Jim

[Mabelline]

I just came to a very thoroughly deserved rough awakening. For I really had no idea that ground meat products were that adulterated. I certainly don't suggest trying to buy untouched wholesome meat by only overpriced name shops, but is there really such a dearth of smallholders that a person can't access them where they live? I have lived in very large cities, and after a thorough rooting- have found requisite provender, but it always took a lot of want-to to obtain it. If a person is on a slim time or money scale, can they not buy a product they're aware is not brined as an alternative to something they know is?

But to begin back at the beginning-I 've always had my unpredictable results with a given food whenever I am using a lot of canned goods. That's salt I can't control.

With regards to the cryovac-packaged meat, it does make a headfuzz trying to allow for previous brining while still making essentially your rub. If you rinse it thoroughly you gotta let it rest another day to dry back up, and that can be a pain in the back, especially for large getdowns.

[Katherine]

Katherine, this is probably just pre-packaged meats, though, like whole turkeys and individually packed tenderloins, isn't it?

Most of the meat I buy at the supermarket are just slabs of whatever.  I don't even think the individually frozen pieces of chicken breast I buy are brined.

I'd be really surprised if most of the meat at the supermarket is pre-brined.  But maybe we're just shopping at different supermarkets.

I've seen labels on pork shoulder and butt, beef, chicken, frozen turkey and duck. I haven't seen it on small packages of repackaged meat, but I seriously doubt that this meat is any different from the pieces they have not cut up.

I have no idea if iqf chicken breasts are brined. Does it come in a package with a label? If salt is listed, then it is. I haven't bought chicken breasts in I can hardly remember when, but that's because I don't like white meat.

Meat like this is, in effect, pre-brined. As Dave explains in his great eGCI course on brining, you're paying for extra water when you buy meat like this. But having tried it, I have to say that it does what it claims to -- that is, meat treated this way did cook up very moist and flavorful. I'd still rather brine meat myself, but for cooks who don't know how or don't have the time, I don't think it's a bad idea.

Yes, it's pre-brined. I know some people brine everything regardless of how they intend to use it, but I've never seen a need to brine meat for what I do with it, so it's just a matter of them ripping me off by preseasoning my meat and pumping it up with water. Why would I want to brine a pork shoulder I'm going to simmer? But afterwords, the broth can't be concentrated or it will be too salty.

[ghostrider]

Katherine, this is probably just pre-packaged meats, though, like whole turkeys and individually packed tenderloins, isn't it?

Most of the meat I buy at the supermarket are just slabs of whatever. I don't even think the individually frozen pieces of chicken breast I buy are brined.

I'd be really surprised if most of the meat at the supermarket is pre-brined. But maybe we're just shopping at different supermarkets.

First, there's a simple answer to the original question: practice. After a while it becomes second nature.

I would be very surprised if steaks & chicken pieces sold at your average supermarket have been brined. I would expect that I'd be able to taste it.

After a heart attack last year, I drastically cut the salt in my diet. I'm allowed 2000 grams a day (approx 1 teaspoon). I keep strict track of what I eat & generally clock in at less than half that.

Once you've gotten used to this low level of salt in your diet, any excess salt becomes almost painful to eat, it tastes quite vile. It's also very obvious, to say the least.

[gus_tatory]

my local newspaper had an excellent article (not available online ) last weekend on various salt varieties. until then, i only had table and Kosher salt in my kitchen.

in the last week, i've bought Moshio (Japanese sea salt) and Kalas (Greek sea salt). and the mission for this weekend is to buy Malden salt and/or fleur de sel.

what are your favourite salts, and for which uses? the Moshio, sprinkled on half an avocado, was a thing of beauty.

[tommy]

salt

[schneich]

i totally ADORE the Maldon salt pyramids,

they are GREAT on wagyu tenderloin sashimi to add a nice crunch factor...

the red hawaiian salt is also nice....

t.