The Food Safety and Home Kitchen Hygiene/Sanitation Topic

[fresco]

If Emeril Lagasse (or anyone who cooks) is concerned about the presence of salmonella or e.coli bacteria in food, scientists from University of Alberta have come up with something to "bam" it away:

http://www.cbc.ca/stories/2003/12/05/spice031205

[JAZ]

Interesting that they choose to call this a "spice" when it's tasteless. I guess "additive" doesn't have quite the same ring to it.

It's also worth noting that many real spices and herbs also kill bacteria and other pathogens in food.

[Suzanne F]

I want to know what happens when someone with an egg allergy ingests it. No, on second thought, I don't. Not a pretty sight.

But note that they say it does NOT kill pathogens; only delays the infection or intoxication that results from ingesting them. What the hell good is that?

[Mabelline]

The thymol in thyme is a very powerful bug fighter. We used to make it by mixing it with oil and leaving it set, and used it primarily to rub on mesquite scratches on our horses' legs (&us). Worked.

[fresco]

When in Mexico, I try to douse doubtful food with lime juice, because it is said to have antibacterial properties. Anyone know whether this is so?

[marlena spieler]

Food safety is a pet campaign of mine. Living in Britain it is a more recent phenomenon than in my native California. Having had food poisoning once, i never want to have it again!

In Britain I'm considered a fanatic, but in California I'm considered very lax.

Still, you can't go wrong with the basics: hot thing hot and cold things cold.

Dishwashing is one area: rinsing well etc. And drying the dishes using a less than clean towel! great way to give yourself a nice dose of something nasty!

Kitchen equipment is another area that seems to me to be a fountain of germs. Cutting boards and surfaces especially--use the same board for both raw and cooked and the germs left behind could make you sick indeed!

i for one am enamoured of the "Identibord" system: a different cutting board (thick, wooden, glorious to cut on) with a colour coding of a big fat dot, on the corner of each board. So you remember: this board is for raw meat, this one for cooked, this one for veggies, this one for fish, etc. its fantastic! a restaurant thing that is beginning to be marketed for home cooks.

Does anyone have any other recommendations or hints (or horror stories) about food safety?

Marlena

[Mabelline]

Yes, mayo with anything---keep that stuff COLD... the worst real live food poison I have experienced was from a Mayo-seafood salad in Vegas. I spent two days in hospital while everyone else partied...It's getting on picnic time, so keep that tater salad on ice!! Bring a bigger bowl, and keep the salads cold-please!

Edit to add, a bigger bowl with ice in it, and the salad embedded in that! DUH...

Edited May 7, 2004 by Mabelline (log)

[britcook]

...with a colour coding of a big fat dot, on the corner of each board. So you remember: this board is for raw meat, this one for cooked, this one for veggies, this one for fish, etc. its fantastic!

Been doing that for years...but where do you store the boards so that they don't come into contact (and contamination) with each other? My kitchen doesn't have storage space for a large number of individual boards so they all go in the same slot. At least I mean well.

Other than taking measures against the more obvious forms of contamination, like raw chicken, I tend to be fairly relaxed about a lot of this stuff, I think (personal opinion only, no data to back it up) that you can be too clean and then you lose your immunities to minor bugs.

[marlena spieler]

but where do you store the boards so that they don't come into contact (and contamination) with each other? My kitchen doesn't have storage space for a large number of individual boards so they all go in the same slot.

exactly! thats why i like this identibord thingie: it comes with its own wire rack that keeps it all separate. that was exactly the problem that i had had, and this solved it! and it doesn't take up much space surprisingly! i just have it on my counter stashed behind a door........

marlena, who has the urge to whip up a little homemade mayo and now that we are doing a thread on food safety, is afraid to

[NulloModo]

I am actually pretty bad about this stuff. If I use a pan and it can be easily rinsed, it will just be rinsed and put right back into the cupboard again to be used again, instead of into the dishwasher. My cutting board usually goes through the same process, regardless of what was cut on it, as long as it washes of with a quick scour in hot water, it is clean to go again.

I have given myself food poisoning once, but it wasn't due to food safety as much as undercooked pork. What was funny is that as I was eating it I was thinking at the same time: wow, this is very flavorful sausage, and, wow, I've never had a sausage before that remained pink inside when fully cooked, I wonder what kind of dye or spice they used.... That was a very unpleasant weekend.

[Raynickben]

I am a total nut about food safety to the point that I often refrain from eating at parties where the food has been sitting out for who knows how long. I can't even open a package of raw chicken (or raw meat of any kind really) without a whole arsenal of sanitizing products, paper towels, disposable gloves, etc. I have been hospitalized with food poisoning (and I was 5 months pregnant) and sickened by food three other times. It's the worst.

Try these flex boards from Crate and Barrel as a less expensive and dishwasher safe option to maintaining 4+ cutting boards.

[aliwaks]

I am a messy messy girl and thank god kenahura I have never had food poisoning which I believe has to do with the fact the fact that growing up the women who fed me (Aunt Sandy excluded) were also messy girls. I have an iron clad consitution.

Can be rather laissez-faire about most things, though do take care not to leave raw meat out or anything..also heavily marinate & spice anything that will need to last longer than it takes to get from the pan to my mouth so just in case natures little anti-whatevers are working on my side.

HOWEVER in the restaurant I was a lunatic. Probably threw more stuff out than was necessary but was so afraid someone would get food poisoning, I was constantly running around with my nose down smelling everything, cutting boards, knives, towels, low boys etc. (doesn't sound so hygenic now that I write it)

One area I believe is overlooked is the kitchen phone, wipe it with clorox wipes & lysol it constantly.....also the refrigerator handle & taps on faucets, you can wash up as best you can but you still turned on the faucet with icky chicken hands. (same rules of course as public bathrooms ...the old paper towel on the hand on the way out trick)

Clorox wipes are gods gift to messy girls.

[foodsafetyguru]

Apparently "Identibord" is featured in the latest issue of "Food & Wine" magazine - so maybe worth a look. The idea of color-coding for food safety is long tried and tested by pros in the food service business. It works.

Personally, I just love home-made mayo (and all the wonderful variants you can make with it) - but only when I know that its been freshly made with new eggs that have been kept cool. It's old or badly kept or cracked eggs that cause the problem.

Another tip - when you make fresh mayo - before you break the eggs, always wash 'em well in cold running water and then dry them with paper towel - its the shells that are most often contaminated. I never keep fresh mayo longer than 24 hours and even then, mainly in the fridge. That way the bugs, if any, are prevented from mulitplying.......my basic food rules are five.......buy good quality.......clean hands.......keep raw stuff out of the way......keep food hot, keep food cold or throw it away......if in doubt, throw it out!!

[Toliver]

Keep a refrigerator thermometer.

I visited my mom this last weekend. She had just bought a new refrigerator and was concerned that it kept running all the time. So she kept turning the temperature settings up so it wouldn't run.

DOH!

I had to explain to her that:

1) Even thought it was running, it was an EnergyStar appliance so it wasn't using as much electricity as her old refrigerator.

2) What she was hearing probably wasn't the condenser but was just an interior fan that circulates the cold air...like it said in the instructions, if she had bothered to read them. The fridge came with a thermometer that had a "safe zone" display and when I looked at it, the interior temp was no way near the safe zone!

Your refrigerator's interior temperature should never get higher than 42 degrees (F). Warmer than that and you get your own version of the Culture Club.

[Hest88]

Heh. I'm actually of the school of thought that if you expose yourself to more germs you'll be less likely to suffer from normal bacteria. Of course, I grew up in around a Chinese kitchen, where meat was often at room temp, raw eggs were eaten regularly, and chicken was supposed to be pink at the bone! I'm most carefuly with mayo products, probably because their the most unfamiliar. I'm really lax with meat and poultry.

Oh gee, I guess none of your would accept a dinner at my house, huh?

[SKinCA]

I am all for food safety and I do keep separate cutting boards for different purposes. I also tend to wash my board with hot, soapy water after using it for raw meats. I'm also a fanatic about washing my own hands and my particular pet peeve is clean towels - I have tons and swap my towels out regularly!

But if people who eat at my house expect that their food has come to them untouched by human hands, they can just forget it. I touch my food. I dip a finger into things and taste them. I toss my salads with my hands. I poke at meat to see if it is done.

At cooking classes, I see far too many people obsessed with food issues. In any class with real mayonnaise, at least 3 or 4 people won't eat it because of the fear of salmonella. They still flinch from medium pork. They want their salmon blasted until it screams for mercy. They comment on their feedback form if the chef dips a spoon twice into a simmering soup (it's up at nearly a boil, people!).

The uproar that ensues from a sneeze is comical. If the chef turns his head to side and sneezes into a shoulder they are upset that no kleenex was used, even when the chef walks directly to the sink and washes his hands.

I think people are overly paranoid. You have to build up immunities somewhere. My sister-in-law practically scrubs her house with a toothbrush. She should own stock in Procter and Gamble for all the cleaning supplies she uses. She TRAVELS with cleaning supplies and cleans her hotel room when she arrives. She won't eat at my house --grrrrr!

But her kids are sick all the time - stomach woes, earaches, colds, etc. My kids - well, they are 7 and 5 and between them they have thrown up 11 times in their entire lives. They have never had an earache and I can count on my hands the number of serious colds they have had. They've been exposed to germs and their bodies can deal with them unlike my niece and nephew.

So I've vented a bit here. My basic thing would be to use common sense, wash hands often, don't ask for trouble (tuna salad in the hot sun, anyone) but don't let food safety issues ruin your pleasure in eating.

[Dave the Cook]

Mayo really gets a bad rap. As long as the ingredients are wholesome, most recipes contain enough acid and salt to prevent bacterial growth -- and in fact, fresh mayo is safer if it's left on the counter for a little while after assembly (the acid doesn't work as well at reduced temperature). If you've gotten sick from homemade mayonnaise, it's almost certainly because the eggs were contaminated before you started.

I would very surprised if anyone gets sick from commercial mayo anymore. Even Hellman's/Best does not suggest refrigeration for safety issues, but for flavor and texture preservation.

[fifi]

I am all for food safety and I do keep separate cutting boards for different purposes. I also tend to wash my board with hot, soapy water after using it for raw meats. I'm also a fanatic about washing my own hands and my particular pet peeve is clean towels - I have tons and swap my towels out regularly!

But if people who eat at my house expect that their food has come to them untouched by human hands, they can just forget it. I touch my food. I dip a finger into things and taste them. I toss my salads with my hands. I poke at meat to see if it is done.

At cooking classes, I see far too many people obsessed with food issues. In any class with real mayonnaise, at least 3 or 4 people won't eat it because of the fear of salmonella. They still flinch from medium pork. They want their salmon blasted until it screams for mercy. They comment on their feedback form if the chef dips a spoon twice into a simmering soup (it's up at nearly a boil, people!).

The uproar that ensues from a sneeze is comical. If the chef turns his head to side and sneezes into a shoulder they are upset that no kleenex was used, even when the chef walks directly to the sink and washes his hands.

I think people are overly paranoid. You have to build up immunities somewhere. My sister-in-law practically scrubs her house with a toothbrush. She should own stock in Procter and Gamble for all the cleaning supplies she uses. She TRAVELS with cleaning supplies and cleans her hotel room when she arrives. She won't eat at my house --grrrrr!

But her kids are sick all the time - stomach woes, earaches, colds, etc. My kids - well, they are 7 and 5 and between them they have thrown up 11 times in their entire lives. They have never had an earache and I can count on my hands the number of serious colds they have had. They've been exposed to germs and their bodies can deal with them unlike my niece and nephew.

So I've vented a bit here. My basic thing would be to use common sense, wash hands often, don't ask for trouble (tuna salad in the hot sun, anyone) but don't let food safety issues ruin your pleasure in eating.

Former FDA food microbiologist here.

Hear hear SKinCA. I don't even get "the tourista" when I go to Mexico anymore. Most of that is just unfamiliar common bugs that we don't have immunity to.

This paranoia over mayonaise is unwarranted. The acidity and salt actuallly retard the growth of any salmonella that may have been introduced by the one in many thousands of potentially contaminated egg yolks.

Paranoia over cutting boards is also overblown. A wood board, well scrubbed after cutting chicken, will be just fine. The plastic ones are more of a problem and should be sanitized in a dishwasher. Plastic is not a good thing for cutting boards.

I routinely wipe down my kitchen surfaces, incuding refrigerator handles and faucet handles, with a disinfectant (Con-San) and just keep going. No one has ever gotten food poisoning from my kitchen. (Well, except me. using the "wet hand" to eat some tempura shrimp while doing the cooking. Long story.)

I seem to get food poisoning about twice a year but always from restaurants. I think it is a curse from all of those bugs I autoclaved at FDA so many years ago. (Yes, that crab meat cocktail is risky but what the hell.)

edit to add: I see that my fellow SSB Dave has also weighed in on the mayo question. He is absolutely right. Leaving it "out" for a while is actually safer.

[Mabelline]

Yep, I'm not obsessive, and the mayo/seafood cocktail was in a wellknown Vegas eatery, tho' I never get ill at home from food. I don't think we need all the bactericidal stuff pushed at us. I feel we just breed bigger,better stuff that way.

SK brought up a good point about anal-retentiveness about germs. Hell, I grew up on a farm,and I reckon we'd have starved to death... or my gram or mama would've given us a smack and told us to get over it!

[John Braise]

Those are certainly all good tips, but imagine how much more powerful these messages would be set to music.

[katzenjammy]

Label your leftovers with a "cooked on" or "consume by" date.

Only time I've ever been poisoned by something out of my own kitchen was when I nuked and ate what I thought was the previous night's clam linguine. (Failing to remember that we'd also had clam linguine a week previously.) I've eaten street food all over the world without mishap, but man oh man, I thought I was gonna die. No, I wanted to die.

[John Whiting]

Butchers have used end grain wooden chopping boards since time immemorial. The molecular structure of the wood seems to interact with bacteria in such a way as to kill them within a short time. Plastic however soon develops cavities within which bacteria survive unless boiled in a dishwasher. This in turn further breaks down the structure of the plastic so that it harbors even more bacteria. The only people to benefit are the manufacturers who, having sold us a rainbow-colored collection, then sell us a never-ending series of replacements. Just one more example of built-in obsolescence.

[lala]

10% bleach solution. Works every time to kill those bacteria. Keep it in a spray bottle, spritz on the plastic board. Easy peasy.

[kellycolorado]

Those are certainly all good tips, but imagine how much more powerful these messages would be set to music.

oh my! Thanks- I am going to email the link to my sister in law. She is a sanitation fanatic.

[memesuze]

this isn't really a food safety observation, but it seemed to fit with the thoughts regarding not eliminating all bugs so that our systems could build up a natural immunity - my theory is that we should all eat a bit of fast food several times a year so that if we are ever kidnapped, our body systems won't rebel at the food we are forced to eat by our kidnappers!