Working for trade?

[pastrygirl]

Do you ever trade your food or services? Rather than selling them, that is? A "friend" roped me into doing some desserts "in trade" for an event, I'm not sure exactly what I'm supposed to get out of it (contacts/referrals for future orders, I suppose), so I'm still a little skeptical that it will be worth doing. I feel like the whole thing is a bit nebulous with an uncertain return on my investment of labor and product. The client is supposed to be making an offer, I'm curious to see what they have to offer, if anything, beyond exposure to their contacts. How much is exposure worth? What if it's to a segment of the industry you have mixed feelings about? In this case, wedding catering... I just want to make stuff and not have to deal with crazy people!

If you have any experience trading your product/services for something other than money, I'd like to hear what deals were worth it to you and which weren't. Or more generally, how to make trade worthwhile.

Thanks!

[JeanneCake]

When the friend asked you, what did they say you would be getting out of it?  Contacts and exposure don't mean much, frankly; guests at an event are there to mingle or celebrate or shell out money (if it's a fundraiser).  They're not critiquing the food and looking for a new supplier and asking for business cards; but if something is wonderful, they may take note.to remember to get in touch later.

 

In my experience, with a fundraiser (sort of like a taste of the town event), it helps to get your name out there, and can be useful for reaching a large group of potential customers.  Doing it to get contacts rarely turns up anything useful for you; it's helpful for the friend because they get free stuff.  A lot of people think their event will help promote you, but typically the return on the investment is very very low.  A free advertisement in the event brochure doesn't count.

 

If they know that a restaurant chef is going to be there, then ask them to set up a meeting with that chef outside of the event (at the event, too much is going on and they won't spend more than a minute chatting with you, if that); make sure the friend knows the value of what you are providing (the retail value) so they can't just dismiss it as "a few chocolates".  Do they know someone at a magazine or social media covering the event? Make sure they feature you - photos, a few words, something more than "Pastrygirl with chocolate was here".  If they start to back away from making this sort of thing happen, you know not to expect too much.

[Tri2Cook]

I don't do free catering. For a good friend with real potential for meaningful ($$$) contacts, maybe a discount. But provide free product with minimal potential for return? Not unless it's a charity event that I'm in favor of supporting.

As for wedding catering, nope. Not me. Never. Well, maybe if catering was my primary income and I was having trouble keeping enough work outside of weddings to pay the bills. There's good money to be made from weddings but it's just not worth the headaches for me. The last one I did was completely no pressure do-whatever-I-want for a very close friend and it was still a pain in the arse. Of course, they could possibly be less painful if I was able to devote my full attention to them but catering takes a backseat to my restaurant job.

[Edward J]

I don't understand...

 

You will be providing  X dollars worth of food and labour.

 

What is your compensation?

 

If your client can't give you a straight answer and can only mumble something about "advertising" or "potential" clients or business, then it's obvious:  They're just looking to get freebies.

 

I passed up a "Golden opportunity" last year, and was contacted to contribute abut $1500.00 worth of product for "grab bags" at a film festival, to be handed out to dignitaries. I declined 

 

"What do you mean, No?  "X"( big name hot-shot actor, Vancouver's no stranger to big shot actors/esses) will be there.  Don't you want "X" to sample your product?  And "y" too, you remember "y" in that movie where she...."

 

I blankly told them that X and Y had enough money to buy my product, and didn't need freebies.

 

I give a lot to charities, especially at christmas, and work for free with kids in school programs, but other than that, it's like that bumper sticker from the '70's

 

"Cash, A**, or grass.  No one rides for free".... 

[Edward J]

 

In my experience, with a fundraiser (sort of like a taste of the town event), it helps to get your name out there, and can be useful for reaching a large group of potential customers.  Doing it to get contacts rarely turns up anything useful for you; it's helpful for the friend because they get free stuff.  A lot of people think their event will help promote you, but typically the return on the investment is very very low.  A free advertisement in the event brochure doesn't count.

 

 

 

My experience was a bit different.  If I provide food+services for a charity for free, the only contact I will get from that event is contact from other charities looking for freebies.  I call it Murphy's law.

 

When I do give freebies (items for auctions, raffles, etc) I specifically request that my name remain anonymous.  If I find out that my business name was used, I will not donate again to that charity or event planner.

[pastrygirl]

I don't understand...

 

You will be providing  X dollars worth of food and labour.

 

What is your compensation?

---

"Cash, A**, or grass.  No one rides for free".... 

 

Ha!  EdwardJ, I knew you'd have something to say   They are supposed to be getting back to me with a 'trade agreement', so I'm curious what that will be.  In theory, I could probably still decline.  In practice, I feel stuck.

 

Jeanne, when my friend initially mentioned the party there was no talk of trade, and I'm irritated that she seems to have promised my services for trade without my explicit consent.  It's an industry event for local wedding planners sponsored by a wedding planning website.  Friend works with the event space and does send me paying business sometimes.   And thinks I owe her big for this amazing opportunity

 

It  sounds like good exposure on the surface - local wedding planners and my sweets, but in reality, don't most people either get a cake from a cake artist, or go with whatever dessert their caterer offers?  I would rather sell party favors and chocolates than be a caterer per se, so I guess I need to promote what I want to sell.  I have a few things in the freezer I could get rid of

[Lisa Shock]

Every time I have been encouraged to participate in something like this, it's been a scam of one sort or another.

 

The part of the wedding business I'd focus on is the party favor type gifts for the reception. Most people look for a small token gift, is place of or in addition to, the traditional bag of jordan almonds. I have seen soap companies aggressively vying for this business at wedding shows, when, IMO, giving out soap isn't really polite. (do you really want to imply that people smell?) Anyway, I'd give out what you can as tasting samples, and show demonstration samples of small bonbon boxes like 4 packs and 6 packs, and maybe other small things like 4oz boxes of other candies featuring high end finishes like gold leaf.

[Edward J]

...In theory, I could probably still decline.  In practice, I feel stuck.

 

....I'm irritated that she seems to have promised my services for trade without my explicit consent. 

... And thinks I owe her big for this amazing opportunity

 

 

 

 

So this is your first blush with an event planner, and it's pretty typical compared to other caterers, pastry people, and photography/videography people.  In your first post it seemed your gut feeling was that something smelled--and it wasn't soap.

 

The best way out of this--I didn't say easiest, I said best-- is to get your friend to call it off.  If you do, she will never leave you alone.

 

What comes as natural as breathing to caterers in this scenerio is the "Call", as in Poker call.  It goes like this:

 

"Hi X, are we still on for the 16th?  I need to know because I'm working on another quote for the same day.  I want to be fair and diplomatic about this, so the first client who can put down a 10% deposit first gets me!"

 

Ah... but she is your friend AND she has "sent business your way".  A 99% chance she'll lay the guilt trip on you and remind you of all the business she "gave" you.  Your response?

 

"But X, you never told me about this big event coming up!  Providing you with ________ is definately do-able, but I need to know before hand.  If you would have told me, I could have adjusted the pricing  on those contracts and covered my costs for this upcoming event."

 

Whatever you do, negoatiate your way out, and let "her" call it off.

[pastrygirl]

Edward, this woman used to be the catering director at the restaurant I recently left.  She's super hyper and would book as many events as possible, then bitch about working too hard.  She has her good moments, but a lot of questionable ones. 

 

Will I ever succeed as a capitalist if I can't learn how to use people to my advantage?

 

[JeanneCake]

Ha!  EdwardJ, I knew you'd have something to say   They are supposed to be getting back to me with a 'trade agreement', so I'm curious what that will be.  In theory, I could probably still decline.  In practice, I feel stuck.

 

Jeanne, when my friend initially mentioned the party there was no talk of trade, and I'm irritated that she seems to have promised my services for trade without my explicit consent.  It's an industry event for local wedding planners sponsored by a wedding planning website.  Friend works with the event space and does send me paying business sometimes.   And thinks I owe her big for this amazing opportunity

 

It  sounds like good exposure on the surface - local wedding planners and my sweets, but in reality, don't most people either get a cake from a cake artist, or go with whatever dessert their caterer offers?  I would rather sell party favors and chocolates than be a caterer per se, so I guess I need to promote what I want to sell.  I have a few things in the freezer I could get rid of

 

Industry event for local wedding planners means that the planners show up for the free food and drink and never remember who or what was there.  You want to be there as a guest NOT as a supplier.  As a guest you will get to mingle and if you carry a big purse, you can give out individual chocolates to people who give you their business card. So, my opinion is don't do it and go as a guest.

 

And yes, most brides get the cake or dessert from the caterer; or from whomever the caterer or venue contracts with for their cakes; you would be better off bringing samples to caterers and venues with a card and a price list and meeting the catering sales director at various high end venues.  The other "gotcha" is some venues get a brochure printed free of charge (to them) because the publisher gets the preferred vendors to BUY advertising in the brochure.  They'll tell you if you don't pay up, you won't get in the brochure and if you're not in the brochure, people won't buy from you....

[ChefPip]

If I were to barter my goods & service they would be kept to small ticket venues.   I would rather keep the arrangement to baked goods and pastery opposed to meat, luncheon, and dinner fare.   Depending on how well I knew the other person in this partnership, I'd probably put a $500 cap on any trade offs.  But such ventures are not something I'd seek.  Especially during election cycles.

[LizD518]

I am doing an event for the local newspaper/magazine company for trade but it is a very concrete thing.  I gave them a retail estimate of their event and they are providing me free advertising in the value of that estimate in their publications - including labor charges.  Otherwise, you are doing it for exposure and it is very hit or miss whether it will result in any actual payoff.  If it is an established annual event that many other restaurateurs in your area participate in then yes, it can be beneficial to get exposure in those types of events, but if it is a private event then the food is not generally why people are there.  And those aren't the types of events where it is really appropriate to label where something is coming from or if it is donated.