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Franci

Burnt sugar pudding from Ideas in Food

13 posts in this topic

Hi.

I made the two pudding recipes from Ideas in Food. The method is similar for both recipes.

Blend some yolks and tapioca starch, warm up liquids with sugar, pour in the blender while it's running, increasing the spead. According to the recipe it should get like a thick mayonnaise at this point (not in my case). Then add chocolate for the chocolate pudding and butter for the burnt sugar pudding to emulsify. Well, they didn't thicken. The only thing I did different was cutting the recipes in half.

For the chocolate pudding refrigeration helped and thickened there but the burnt sugar one was just liquid.

Any ideas? Does the type of blender make a difference?

This is the chocolate pudding after the rest in the refrigerator. Here a link to the recipe.

Thanks for any input.

dessertchocolatepudding_zpscbd44fc4.jpg

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Well, the weight amounts in the recipe you linked to are not the same as those in the book, which calls for 36 grams of tapioca starch, not 28 and 520 grams whole milk instead of 460. (The volumetric measurement is the same.) But since you refer to the burnt sugar pudding as well, I'm guessing you're using the book?

I've made the chocolate pudding, and it turned out quite nice, in my opinion. Were you measuring by weight or volume? If by weight, my guess would be either that you need a high-speed blender for these recipes (I used a Vitamix), or else cutting the recipe in half interfered with how it blended. Did you have lumps in the bottom from undispersed tapioca-egg mixture, or anything like that?


Matthew Kayahara

Kayahara.ca

@mtkayahara

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Halving the recipe may have been the culprit, or maybe "warming up" the liquids wasn't hot enough. I've used Francisco Migoya's perfect pastry cream recipe, which is similar, and he does state that there is a minimum volume at which the formula will work. The liquid also need to be at a full rolling boil for that one, maybe for the IIF puddings too?

The chocolate pudding would thicken anyway due to the chocolate solidifying rather even if the eggs and starch didn't perform.


Edited by pastrygirl (log)

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But since you refer to the burnt sugar pudding as well, I'm guessing you're using the book?

Yes, I used the book.

I've made the chocolate pudding, and it turned out quite nice, in my opinion. Were you measuring by weight or volume? If by weight, my guess would be either that you need a high-speed blender for these recipes (I used a Vitamix), or else cutting the recipe in half interfered with how it blended. Did you have lumps in the bottom from undispersed tapioca-egg mixture, or anything like that?

I measured the tapioca by volume and than weight. It was 20 g for half a recipe for the chocolate pudding. But as you said there were lumps of tapioca egg at the bottom of the blender. I didn't use a powerful blender, for sure.

Halving the recipe may have been the culprit, or maybe "warming up" the liquids wasn't hot enough. I've used Francisco Migoya's perfect pastry cream recipe, which is similar, and he does state that there is a minimum volume at which the formula will work. The liquid also need to be at a full rolling boil for that one, maybe for the IIF puddings too?

The chocolate pudding would thicken anyway due to the chocolate solidifying rather even if the eggs and starch didn't perform.

Yes, I guessed the chocolate pudding would thicken anyway...the liquids were very hot, so I guess it's either halving the recipe the problem or my blender.

Do you think an immersion blender would work? Maybe a could try with the chocolate pudding, since it's going to thicken anyway.


Edited by Franci (log)

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If there were lumps of tapioca-egg mixture at the bottom, I'd say that's your culprit right there: that's the part that's going to thicken your pudding, so if it wasn't mixed in, it couldn't thicken. I don't see why an immersion blender wouldn't work. It's certainly worth a try! Though if it were me, I'd try it out on the burnt sugar pudding, partly to make sure it works, and partly because the ingredients are cheaper.


Matthew Kayahara

Kayahara.ca

@mtkayahara

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I'm back.

I tried first the chocolate pudding. I used an immersion blender this time. I whisked the yolks and the tapioca starch and poured in a 2 liter Bormioli jar, then I added the boiling liquid mixing with my immersion blender. I got the consistency of a creme anglaise not of a thick mayo. But I thought it is would work out and I found it much creamier than my first attempt.

photo1_zpsb31857bb.jpg

Then I tried the burnt sugar pudding. It has only a little less tapioca starch compared to the chocolate pudding. I did measure first in volume and then in weight. On my scale it was actually 34 g not 27 g as per recipe. The liquid was also very hot. This time, don't know why didn't thicken. So, to avoid waiste, I tossed everything in a pot, brought to a boil (at that point got really thick and then, off the stove, I emulsified the butter.

This is the pudding still warm

photo2_zps74c12b8d.jpg

I think I did this more of experimenting since I didn't like the flavor of both puddings much.

If the heat is not enough and the result is a partial swelling of the starch I don't think it's a great outcome, since I don't like the idea of eating uncooked starch.

In cooking for geeks it is stated that cornstarch gelatinize at 100 C and tapioca starch at 85 C. In the link for the perfect pastry cream, here, Migoya says that corn starch coagulates at 85 C. And tapioca, then.

I thought this is a simple straight forward recipe...but not a winner recipe for me.


Edited by Franci (log)

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Hi,

I was triggered by your results to try the recipe. Did hald the burnt sugar recipe, which turned out very delicious but thin. More like a thick custard. It did not taste weird so I did not bother cooking further. I have probably added my butter too early, before the liquid thickened properly. Will try again some other time, maybe with a tad more tapioca and waiting longer to add butter. Or may toss it all sous vide.

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Hi Bojana,

glad I triggered you to try out the recipe. Just out of curiosity, which blender did you use? The thickness, of thick custard you are referring to, was after you emulsified with butter?

Given how thick my pudding became, after I put it back on the stove, brought me to the conclusion that it was not hot enough to fully gelatinize the starch. In the case of the "perfect pastry cream" it is suggested a minimum of 1 liter to carry enough heat...but tapioca starch should gelatinize at lower temperature. So, I'm missing something here. I made sure my milk was at a rolling boil, coming to the top of my pot, almost spilling.


Edited by Franci (log)

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Hi Franci,

I have blender on the top of my kenwood chef 010 stand mixer, don't remember the speed on that outlet but the motor is 1400W. Yes, the custard thickness was after I emulsified butter but I dropped the butter in literally few seconds after I finished pouring cream mixture. I dropped the cube and went "Ooops" I did not intend to do that but you know how sometimes your cooking hands are faster than your brain?

I'll try it again coz I liked it but will make the full batch and will be patient with butter.

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So I tried this again, this time the full batch as described in the book and did not add butter too early. Same result, texture that was too liquid and the same, amazing, salted butter caramel taste. I put half of it in a pan and cooked, butter and all. The cooked half set to a great texture, as you would expect from a pudding. However, the taste changed, it was still good, but not the mouth tingling toe curling good like the uncooked one. So next is to play with texture while keeping the yummy caramel taste...to be continued

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I have made the burnt sugar pudding recipe twice. The first time I used Minute tapioca pearls and even though they clumped at the bottom of the Vitamix, everything gelled well. Perfect. The second time, I had trouble dissolving all the caramel in the milk and it took too long to stir it in, thereby reducing the heat of the milk to the point where I don't think it cooked the eggs and hydrated the tapioca flour (not Minute this time) properly. I wonder if I over blended the mixture and caused the egg protein/starch bond or emulsification to fail. Anyway, this second batch did not gel. So I heated it up to try to re-hydrolyze the tapioca starch, but alas, the stovetop was too unwieldy and the temp jumped from 150 to 200 in the blink of an eye and some of the product curdled. I tried cooling to room temp in ramekins anyway, despite the symptoms of overheating, and now the ramekins are in the refrigerator, not looking like they will gel up. Oh well, too many errors in this run to make it to the podium. I will try the Migoya method. It's funny, I came across that post recently looking for something else. By the way, is there a better place to be discussing IIF recipes? I have the new Maximum Flavor and so far it has been spot on.

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