Eating Chinese in New Jersey

[Curlz]

It still is, but I don't know that you'd want to eat the food there...it's Lee's Hawaiian Islander, and it's in Lyndhurst. Karaoke and all.

Went once late on a Sat pm as a goof, and was glad that I'd had a few cocktails before I arrived--that's all I'm going to say!

[rooftop1000]

Went there once...it was in walking distance to my friends house...the food was kinda gloppy

tracey

[jo-mel]

A friend and I had lunch at Joy Luck Pavilion yesterday, and ate off the Chinese menu:

Scallops with Black Pepper Sauce. Really good with just enough black pepper. It was served over broccoli, so the broccoli had lots of sauce, too.

Also -- A clay pot dish : Beef with Ginger & Scallions in XO sauce. I've never understood the craze for XO sauce, but in this dish it was good. The one thing I wonder, tho, is if this is a bone fide clay pot dish. The beef slices were nice and tender and not over cooked ---- not the type of texture you would expect in a clay pot dish, which is usually stewed. Maybe they stirfried the dish and put it in a clay pot for presentation purposes? But --- it was good enough to order again.

[hitmanoo]

A friend and I had lunch at Joy Luck Pavilion yesterday, and ate off the Chinese menu:

Scallops with Black Pepper Sauce. Really good with just enough black pepper. It was served over broccoli, so the broccoli had lots of sauce, too.

Also -- A clay pot dish : Beef with Ginger & Scallions in XO sauce. I've never understood the craze for XO sauce, but in this dish it was good.  The one thing I wonder, tho, is if this is a bone fide clay pot dish.  The beef slices were nice and tender and not over cooked ---- not the type of texture you would expect in a clay pot dish, which is usually stewed.  Maybe they stirfried the dish and put it in a clay pot for presentation purposes?  But --- it was good enough to order again.

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Do you have to ask for the Chinse menu as a special request at Joy Luck Pavilion?

Edit:

I found out for myself that there is in fact a Chinese menu, which I had to get to try the beef dish in the clay pot that of which you spoke so highly. I agree it was exceptional! Thanks of the rec.

We ordered a few things off the American menu, including 2 forgettable soups, both the wonton and the hot and sour.

I guess I just don't understand the purpose of the separation of menus. Would it be so hard for a host a manager or a waiter to take some time out to answer questions and possibly guide people into enjoying some authentic cuisine?

Edited February 11, 2006 by hitmanoo (log)

[Anonymouze]

Actually Han Ah Reum market in Ridgefield has good chinese and korean food (authentic taste/style) in their food court if you are brave enough to view the pictures and read the names. They don't tell you what is in it and to ask isn't worth the headache! LOL

[Jason Perlow]

That Ta Loo Mein soup really hit the spot last week after getting the stiches out of my mouth (I had my wisdom teeth out a couple weeks ago). Really good 3 cup chicken casserole too. So, add us for a fourth rec for Lotus Cafe.

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The 3 cup chicken casserole is by far one of the best chicken dishes I have ever had at any chinese restaurant. Its up there with the freshly killed kung pao chicken from Grand Sichuan International midtown.

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Why do I beleive this new review of a fairly old restaurant is not a coincidence?

Lotus Cafe (Bergen Record, 2006)

Much is made in the menu of the "profound studies" of the chef in Taiwan, Hong Kong and various Chinese provinces to bring North Jerseyans the best these regions have to offer. I'm not sure whether to believe that, but I did delight in some unusual dishes like three-cup chicken casserole ($11.50) and shrimp soong ($13.95).

The former derives its name from the combination of a cup each of rice wine, sesame oil and brown sauce used to douse the chicken in an earthen pot. Woodsy shiitake mushrooms were plentiful. Slices of ginger as big as water chestnuts, wilted basil leaves and curls of red pepper imparted a powerful fragrance to this dish, one of my favorites.

[tommy]

That Ta Loo Mein soup really hit the spot last week after getting the stiches out of my mouth (I had my wisdom teeth out a couple weeks ago). Really good 3 cup chicken casserole too. So, add us for a fourth rec for Lotus Cafe.

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The 3 cup chicken casserole is by far one of the best chicken dishes I have ever had at any chinese restaurant. Its up there with the freshly killed kung pao chicken from Grand Sichuan International midtown.

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Why do I beleive this new review of a fairly old restaurant is not a coincidence?

Lotus Cafe (Bergen Record, 2006)

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you feel the review is directly related to your and rachel's post?

Edited February 13, 2006 by tommy (log)

[Jason Perlow]

I think its highly unlikely an older chinese restaurant would be reviewed by the Record without a reason, lets put it that way.

I'm not the kind of person who beleives everyone is stealing our ideas, but it would be nice if the Record (and the Star Ledger) would acknowledge its legitimate leads from eGullet, even if I so personally happen to be a freelancer for the New York Times. With a new restaurant with a lot of buzz its perfectly reasonable to beleive they came to the same conclusions as the rest of us, (although sometimes, we're creating that buzz) but an older place that was recently discussed and reccomended by the founder of the largest food discussion site on the Internet? I don't buy it.

[menton1]

Bah, humbug. If the Record reviewed every restaurant that was lauded in Eg, they would need a special separate section for resto reviews. Besides, they don't have to agree with the Eg comments, either.

As a segue to the same topic, the Record invariably gives only good reviews, nary a bad word about a place. I still feel that this is somehow tied in to advertising. Surely these Bergen Record reviewers have had an appetizer or 2 that was slightly off?

[tommy]

I think its highly unlikely an older chinese restaurant would be reviewed by the Record without a reason, lets put it that way.

I'm not the kind of person who beleives everyone is stealing our ideas, but it would be nice if the Record (and the Star Ledger) would acknowledge its legitimate leads from eGullet, even if I so personally happen to be a freelancer for the New York Times. With a new restaurant with a lot of buzz its perfectly reasonable to beleive they came to the same conclusions as the rest of us, (although sometimes, we're creating that buzz) but an older place that was recently discussed and reccomended by the founder of the largest food discussion site on the Internet? I don't buy it.

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i wouldn't assume that writers need to acknowledge where they get their ideas from. do you, for example? separately, the founder of the largest internet food discussion site wasn't the only person to recommend this place, no?

[tommy]

As a segue to the same topic, the Record invariably gives only good reviews, nary a bad word about a place.  I still feel that this is somehow tied in to advertising.  Surely these Bergen Record reviewers have had an appetizer or 2 that was slightly off? 

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perhaps they choose to not publish bad reviews. i'm the same way: i don't usually slam places. i'd rather talk about good experiences. that doesn't mean that people can't trust my reviews/opinions, though, just as it doesn't mean the record's reviews are questionable. perhaps their editorial/advertising policies are questionable, but i wouldn't assume their reviews are. unless, of course, i found that i didn't agree with most of them.

[menton1]

Well, I want my restaurant reviewers to tell me the bad along with the good. The reason the public reads resto reviews is to assist in their selection of where to spend their restaurant dollars. Commenting on a board doesn't bring with it the same obligation to the reader, IMHO.

Also, according to the esteemed and respected Holly Moore, even a positive restaurant review can have a limited positive effect on a restaurant. It's really up to the resto to sustain its customers and get them to come back, over and over again. It's not like a movie, where we decide where to go, and only go once. Restaurants need repeat customers, and a lot of them. So if a restaurant thinks it can rest on the laurels of a positive review, it needs to hunker down and re-think its business plan.

Edited to add: Smoke Chophouse in Englewood, a super-ordinary bar/resto that makes its living with cigar-smoker business (it's allowed) got 4 stars from the Record a couple of years ago. now that's an enormous stretch. There are probably other conspicuous reviews, but I don't pay much attention to the Record resto reviews on a regular basis.

Edited February 13, 2006 by menton1 (log)

[Jason Perlow]

i wouldn't assume that writers need to acknowledge where they get their ideas from.  do you, for example? 

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Its never been an issue with my own writing. With the Quick Bites, I have less than 400 words total to work with, the write ups are totally formulaic and nearly boilerplate in their design. There's not much leeway other than getting right to the point. Be it as it may, I do acknowledge on eGullet where I get my tips from -- even a "thanks guys" from Lindy Washburn or some of the other local writers on the site would be sufficient if they can't get it in copy -- although we've seen David Corcoran and Victor Sasson do just that in the past. On a 1000 word formalized review I think its safe to say there's room for an acknowldgement.

[tommy]

Be it as it may, I do acknowledge on eGullet where I get my tips from

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here

http://forums.egullet.org/index.php?showto...dpost&p=1097521

here

http://forums.egullet.org/index.php?showtopic=53514&hl=

here

http://forums.egullet.org/index.php?showtopic=72908

and here?

http://forums.egullet.org/index.php?showtopic=60600&st=0

[menton1]

Even if Eg were the source of the IDEA to review a place (even though I find that improbable), I just don't think that it's important information to reveal in a review. The public just doesn't care. I want to know about the food, the service, the ambience, maybe some owner background, etc. I don't really care if the idea to review the place came in a dream, an apparition, from driving by, or whatever. It's really irrelevant. As long is the prose is original, sincere and objective, that's all that matters.

[Jason Perlow]

Be it as it may, I do acknowledge on eGullet where I get my tips from

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here

http://forums.egullet.org/index.php?showto...dpost&p=1097521

here

http://forums.egullet.org/index.php?showtopic=53514&hl=

here

http://forums.egullet.org/index.php?showtopic=72908

and here?

http://forums.egullet.org/index.php?showtopic=60600&st=0

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Tommy, its pretty damn obvious where I get my tips from, and if pressed I'll say so -- but given that I founded eGullet I'd basically be acknowledging myself. Additionally, virtually all of these restaurants have contacted me directly prior to or simultaneous to there being discussion on the site, with perhaps the exception of Silver Oak. I think its not difficult to surmise that my access to food news and openings is perhaps a bit better then other NJ restaurant writers who may not be covering the goings-on on eGullet constantly.

[menton1]

Even if Eg were the source of the IDEA to review a place (even though I find that  improbable), I just don't think that it's important information to reveal in a review. The public just doesn't care.  I want to know about the food, the service, the ambience, maybe some owner background, etc.  I don't really care if the idea to review the place came in a dream, an apparition, from driving by, or whatever.  It's really irrelevant.  As long is the prose is original, sincere and objective, that's all that matters.

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Call me crazy, but again, I just don't care where the idea to review a place came from. Just be original, sincere, and objective. (And of course, no quid pro quos!!)

[hitmanoo]

Even if Eg were the source of the IDEA to review a place (even though I find that  improbable), I just don't think that it's important information to reveal in a review. The public just doesn't care.  I want to know about the food, the service, the ambience, maybe some owner background, etc.  I don't really care if the idea to review the place came in a dream, an apparition, from driving by, or whatever.  It's really irrelevant.  As long is the prose is original, sincere and objective, that's all that matters.

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Call me crazy, but again, I just don't care where the idea to review a place came from. Just be original, sincere, and objective. (And of course, no quid pro quos!!)

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The idea to acknowledge somebody as the originator of the idea is not meant for the reader. It is a way to give thanks and recognition to the origin of a thought.

Whether or not you as the reader care where the idea came from is irrelevent. Most people who go to the movies don't stick around for the closing credits, but the people who worked hard to make that movie would be pretty upset if they were simply omitted from any credit.

[menton1]

Whether or not you as the reader care where the idea came from is irrelevent

In the newspaper business, it's just about the ONLY thing that's relevant!

[jeanki]

I guess I just don't understand the purpose of the separation of menus. Would it be so hard for a host a manager or a waiter to take some time out to answer questions and possibly guide people into enjoying some authentic cuisine?

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[andrewhwest]

When I ask a variety of people if they would be interested in eating hot and spicy duck's tongue, tongue and tripe, or sea cucumber, or stews with intestine and pig's blood, few respond favorably. Not only that, but many would look unfavorably upon eating anything in such an establishment. And if they accidentally ordered such an item, described less clearly, they might get upset and grossed out, and their kids would start crying, and they would ask for it to be removed from the check. I think this is the reason why some restaurants keep two menus - tastes still typically are in two distinct camps.

Note that I've seen people whine about two menus or different treatment, even when the restaurant actually only has one menu! Discussing my current favorite Chinese restaurant (Sichuanese), China Chalet in Florham Park, I saw posters asking why the items on Chinese people's tables looked better than theirs. It's because the Chinese people weren't ordering the typical "American-Chinese" dishes on the menu. Since posting my review here, I've seen a number of Americans dining adventurously at China Chalet, asking the waiters for authentic sichuan recommendations.

My hope is that Americans will stop asking for fake Chinese food and start asking for authentic Chinese food. Then, an increasing number of Chinese restaurants will surely react to the changing market by emphasizing what people want.

[Anonymouze]

We dined at the restaurant recommended in Livingston across from Eppes Essen, on Route 10 today and for the most part it was good. Not great but good.

The service was good when they remembered we were there... I guess it was a busy Monday? I took my grandmother there (she's 91 and bit picky) she got the Wonton soup and she loved it - score one for them from her! I ordered the pork buns to share with her and she said no, then ate one, then another... well we finished the appetizer between the two of us (score 3 one from both of us!)

I thought I'd have to bring home leftovers like crazy, but only brought home half of my lunch so I can "spice it up or add something to give it flavor when I got home!!

I ordered for her an old "american style" favorite shrimp chow-mein she liked it - she wanted fried rice but ended up with brown rice since they didn't have it?! I ordered Shrimp Pad Thai dish of shrimp w/noodles and slivered egg (yamago?) and peanuts over the top. It was quite bland but edible. Maybe if they had a bit of sauce for the side it would have been better, so you could spice it up?! The manager? seemed real nice as did the staff but again to refill the water would have been nice, to ask every now and then if there is anything else would have been nicer. I had to grab the nearest staffmember to get something cool to drink! She kept staring at the gentlemans plate who sat next to us I explained to her that it was Sushi and explained further outside later! LOL She's so worldly but every now and then ::shrug:: either way I enjoyed my day off with my grandmother... maybe I can find a better place to take her next time?!

[Anonymouze]

Whilst I was out driving today I was reminded of an oldy but goody that Jeff and I used to frequent called Bean Curd - it's on 24/124 in Chatham NJ about 1.25 Miles in from the Short Hills Mall area heading west on your left side. I drove by it and remembered how delicious their cold noodles w/sesame sauce was and other delicious dishes. I am not sure if it's still good 20+ years later but if it is I'd strongly suggest going there... or perhaps my tastes have changed?!

[Anonymouze]

Today we went to Ming on Oak Tree Road in Edison. My friend and I were disappointed, having heard that people liked it but we didn't like it.

We shared an appetizer of shrimp shanghai balls or something like that - minced shrimp, chicken quick fried - like a meatball but with a fishy taste and crunchy outside. UGH.

We shared what was marked as spicy - lamb dish - it was oily/greasy no spicy flavor at all, the kimchee amuse bouche was spicier and that had sprinkled red pepper flakes on it and had a pretty presentation! If that was spicy a McD's shake would be um... an arsonists delight! We also ordered "hakka" to share it's sort of an indian lomein type dish for a side starch - this too was disappointing having more veggies than noodles and no real flavor to it. We both agreed, my friend and I, that next time we go to Rasoi down the street!

[twobrain]

Along those lines, although many Chinese restaurants catering to non-Asian customers automatically bring soy sauce and mustard, I wonder if asking for them starts to put one into the "undiscerning" category in the restaurant's eyes. I could be wrong, but I suspect that putting mustard (even "Chinese" mustard) on Chinese food is somewhat like putting ketchup on French food. I don't think I've ever seen mustard on a Chinese family's table, for example. Similarly, I've wondered if asking for the less authentic Chinese dishes on a menu (granted, one would have to know which are which) also puts one into the non-aficianado category.

I hope none of this sounds condescending. I'm just trying to help explain some of the reasons people might go to the same restaurant and walk away with very different experiences.

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i'm an american born chinese... ive never really seen anyone ask for soy and mustard at a chinese restaurant before

maybe at dimsum, people will ask for la jiao (chili paste) and mustard...

at dinner, maybe la jiao and vinegar, the black kind, shanghai vinegar? but not very often, and i guess it depends on what else youve ordered

eh...

mass produced non fermented soy sauce is scary anyhow

A friend and I had lunch at Joy Luck Pavilion yesterday, and ate off the Chinese menu:

We ordered a few things off the American menu, including 2 forgettable soups, both the wonton and the hot and sour.

I guess I just don't understand the purpose of the separation of menus.  Would it be so hard for a host a manager or a waiter to take some time out to answer questions and possibly guide people into enjoying some authentic cuisine?

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thats near the zoo right? i know the owner's kids, only been there once though for dimsum

i think you just answered your own question, or pre-answered it

most asian people probably woudlnt order the wonton or the hot sour soup

havent had soup at a chinese restaurant in a long time, either cantonese or shanhai restaurants... usually got some sort of winter melon soup

some restaurant give you free "soup" usually just some sort of stock that they made with left over bones... but its usually good

Edited April 2, 2006 by twobrain (log)