Troubleshooting Caramels

[Kerry Beal]

I'd add about 1/2 a cup of sesame paste to the cooked caramel before pouring it out - and a good handful of toasted sesame seeds and see how it turns out.

I'd toast the seeds - the only time you don't need to toast the nuts is in things like krokant or brittle where the nuts are cooked with the syrup and the temperature gets up to about 300 F.

For the matcha - in order not to lose the flavour, I'd probably stir it in before pouring out the caramel.

[prasantrin]

I'd add about 1/2 a cup of sesame paste to the cooked caramel before pouring it out - and a good handful of toasted sesame seeds and see how it turns out.

I'd toast the seeds - the only time you don't need to toast the nuts is in things like krokant or brittle where the nuts are cooked with the syrup and the temperature gets up to about 300 F. 

For the matcha - in order not to lose the flavour, I'd probably stir it in before pouring out the caramel.

←

Thanks! I wish I had picked up some of the black sesame extract from the Flavor Shop when I was in Tokyo. I think it would perk up the flavour. But I can always do mail order, the man said! If my experiment is successful, care to try my final product? You can be my official guinea pig!

[Kerry Beal]

I'd add about 1/2 a cup of sesame paste to the cooked caramel before pouring it out - and a good handful of toasted sesame seeds and see how it turns out.

I'd toast the seeds - the only time you don't need to toast the nuts is in things like krokant or brittle where the nuts are cooked with the syrup and the temperature gets up to about 300 F. 

For the matcha - in order not to lose the flavour, I'd probably stir it in before pouring out the caramel.

←

Thanks! I wish I had picked up some of the black sesame extract from the Flavor Shop when I was in Tokyo. I think it would perk up the flavour. But I can always do mail order, the man said! If my experiment is successful, care to try my final product? You can be my official guinea pig!

←

I'd be thrilled to try them.

[prasantrin]

New questions. . .

I haven't made my sesame caramels, yet, but am now buying supplies. Should I just get ground black sesame seeds and add those, or should it really be a paste (i.e. should the oil have separated from the seeds)?

If it should be a paste, is there any reason I couldn't use other nut or seed pastes in my caramels? I'm thinking of adding some hazelnut praline paste to my order. I think it would be smashing in caramels, but it's also expensive. That means I can't afford to waste any in trial-and-error experiments.

[Kerry Beal]

New questions. . .

I haven't made my sesame caramels, yet, but am now buying supplies. Should I just get ground black sesame seeds and add those, or should it really be a paste (i.e. should the oil have separated from the seeds)?

If it should be a paste, is there any reason I couldn't use other nut or seed pastes in my caramels? I'm thinking of adding some hazelnut praline paste to my order. I think it would be smashing in caramels, but it's also expensive. That means I can't afford to waste any in trial-and-error experiments.

I suspect you'll be fine with the ground rather than the paste.

[EvanT]

I make a lot of caramels - And I rarely have problems with crystalization at the time of them being made, but I sometimes have problems with it several days after making...

However, there are some batches, when about a week or two after being made and wrapped, develop a very fine crystal on the outside of the already wrapped caramel.

I'm not sure why, or when, and it will happen on an entire batch or two at the same time...

Any ideas? It's driving me crazy. And I never know when it's going to happen...

[Sue Casey]

Has anyone heard of the French caramel making technique for fudge? Just wondering what it is and how it is done.

[Jim D.]

My question seems to go under this general topic, though it's been a long time since the topic had any comments.

 

Today I tried Peter Greweling's walnut bon bons.  He calls for a "dry caramel."  I did that, using a bit of glucose as a "doctor," then added the heated cream and right away added the almond paste and fondant, then the toasted walnuts.  He does not call for any cooking beyond the initial caramelizing of the sugar.  Once the mixture cooled a little, I tasted it, and it was delicious.  But later, when the mixture had solidified, it had become almost too firm to eat.  I might have been able to pipe it into molds at an earlier point, but it would have made for a rough eating experience once it was completely cool.  My question is what to do to keep it pliable.  Since there is no cooking of the caramel (as in the case of a "wet caramel"), I don't see how I can cook it less.  I thought of using a wet caramel instead, but the adding of almond paste and fondant make getting the measurements a little tricky--obviously the fondant contributes some sweetness that is not in the usual caramel.  It almost seems as if the recipe doesn't call for enough cream (amounts are 240g cream, 110g sugar, 190g fondant, 230g almond paste).  Any suggestions would be welcome.

[pastryani]

Jim - my understanding of dry caramel is that just like wet caramel, you're still cooking it, but the whole process is just a lot faster because you don't have to evaporate out all that extra water.  However, because there's no extra water in dry caramel, it can go from soft to firm very quickly.  That might be what happened in your case - did you use a thermometer to check the temp when you took it off the heat?  Also, when you say "beyond the initial caramelizing of the sugar", did you mean that all the granules had just melted, or that it had color?  In my experience dry caramel can be pretty tricky and you have to be super fast - you could try repeating the recipe but with a wet caramel for a little added insurance.

[Jim D.]

pastryani,

 

"In my experience dry caramel can be pretty tricky and you have to be super fast - you could try repeating the recipe but with a wet caramel for a little added insurance."

 

As I gave the issue more thought after posting, this was my conclusion as well.  As for the process, I think the sugar was all melted and was a rather light color (which I was aiming for).  To support your diagnosis, I was making a very small amount of the Greweling recipe, so the sugar went from white to brown quite quickly.

[Jim D.]

A further question:

If I switch to the wet caramel method for the walnut recipe, what amount of glucose would be recommended?  A typical caramel recipe might call for 4:1 sugar to glucose.  Greweling specifies 110g of sugar (no glucose mentioned).  Should I assume the amount of sugar should be adjusted downward to account for 1/4 glucose?  As I mentioned previously, the addition of fondant and almond paste (both of which contain sugar) complicates matters.

[pastrygirl]

Just add more cream. Caramelized sugar is going to be hard crack no matter how you get there. Adding glucose is adding more sugar and may have thrown the cream:sugar ratio off. 

Edited April 15, 2016 by pastrygirl
Glucose (log)

[pastryani]

2 hours ago, Jim D. said:

A further question:

If I switch to the wet caramel method for the walnut recipe, what amount of glucose would be recommended? 

 

I don't think you'd have to adjust the formula since you're not really changing it.  You're just adding water that will eventually evaporate.  But if you would like the end result more fluid, then I second what pastry girl said about adding more cream.

 

(btw - when I've screwed up my dry caramel batches, it's usually been when making a tiny batch as well.  Safer to stick to wet method when doing such a small batch I guess)

 

[Jim D.]

56 minutes ago, pastrygirl said:

Just add more cream. Caramelized sugar is going to be hard crack no matter how you get there. Adding glucose is adding more sugar and may have thrown the cream:sugar ratio off. 

 

My question about using glucose was whether I should proportion the amount of sugar in the recipe to (approx.) 75% of the sugar called for + 25% glucose.  I know sugar and glucose don't have the same degree of sweetening, but, roughly speaking, if I split the sugar into sugar + glucose, this is not adding any sugar to the recipe.  Greweling doesn't mention using a "doctor" in this specific recipe, but he refers to his basic dry caramel method, in which he calls for some sort of doctor but doesn't give an amount.  I'm making the basic assumption in the walnut recipe that he is taking into account the additional sweetness of the fondant and the almond paste.

[pastrygirl]

Ok so I guess if you're substituting with glucose not adding it you're fine but I don't see why you need glucose. The caramel is 2:1 so it should be really runny. Maybe your cream reduced too much? Some water will boil off but I'd guess you would want at least 300g of caramel. Or can you add less fondant?

Edited April 16, 2016 by pastrygirl
correcting autocorrect (log)

[Jim D.]

I had decided to learn to make chewy caramels (to be dipped in chocolate) this summer and am looking for some insight from those who are more experienced. I know that it is the final temperature of the caramel that determines whether it will work or not. I used David Lebovitz's recipe, which calls for cooking the caramel to 260F/127C. I knew that was higher than anyone else recommends, but it's David Lebovitz, so who am I to doubt? After seeing Jin's silicone caramel mold at the eGullet workshop in Las Vegas in May, I found one (less expensive), so was using that to make nice neat pieces.

 

Attempt #1: I poured the 260F caramel (also tested in cold water to check the consistency) into the mold. When I removed the hardened pieces, "hardened" hardly begins to describe how firm they were--tooth-breakingly hard.

 

Attempt #2: I added a little skim milk and melted the pieces from the previous try. Meanwhile I had checked multiple recipes, including Peter Greweling's (239F/115C recommended) and Kerry Beal's (244 to 250F / 118 to 121C), and this time stopped at about 245F/118C. Better, but still too firm--and worse, stuck to my teeth.

 

Attempt #3: Again, melted down the caramel. This time went to about 240F/115.5C. I decided to add some cocoa butter to help firm up the finished product (an idea from Jean-Marie Auboine, also at the Vegas workshop). This try was much better, but the caramel was too soft to hold its shape after removal from the mold. And, quite unexpectedly to me, the bottoms of each piece stuck to the silicone mold. Who knew? So a quick online search revealed that oiling the silicone may be necessary.

 

Attempt #4: After the messy job of oiling the mold (using cooking spray and wiping most of it out), I began again. This time I went to about 242F/117C. These came out of the mold without sticking (though they had to be patted dry from the oil), and I just finished dipping them in dark chocolate, topped with some Himalayan salt I have been waiting to use for something.

 

In spite of this final success (at least it appears so at this point), I have to ask: Is making "stand-alone" caramels really this difficult? Do 2 degrees make that much difference? Of course, I realize that taking the temperature of a boiling liquid is a very iffy proposition--moving the Thermapen around the pot shows how the temp varies from place to place. And there is the residual heat once the pot is removed from the stove (I tried dipping it in cold water, but that cooled off the caramel too much to be poured into the mold). Testing by dropping some caramel in water seems inconclusive as the firm ball stage covers a range of temperatures, and meanwhile the caramel in the pot continues to cook, even if it's off the heat. At this time of year I have time to experiment, but in the midst of Christmas production, there can be no recooking of caramel three times and waiting for it to harden in order to determine if it is right for dipping.

 

I use Rose Levy Beranbaum's caramel pot. It's narrow enough that even a small batch is deep enough for a thermometer to register. But it's not a particularly heavy pot. Might that be an issue?

 

Any suggestions or insights?

 

 

Edited June 23, 2017 by Jim D. (log)

[Chocolot]

Jim, are you making a french caramel like Jean Maries, or a Maillard caramel? What is your altitude?

[Jim D.]

Ruth,

I'm not entirely sure of the difference. Following Lebovitz's recipe, I made a caramel (he says cook it to 310F--which is a rather light caramel), then I added hot cream and cooked the mixture to the desired temperature. This is mostly the same as Notter's recipe and many others.

 

I am at an altitude of about 1400 feet. I checked the charts on that, and it should make only a little difference.

[Chocolot]

That is a French caramel. You cook those to a higher temp than a Maillard. Cook 2F less than at sea level. In caramels, that is a big difference.

[Jim D.]

What is an example of a Maillard caramel? How does it differ in technique?

[pastrygirl]

2 hours ago, Chocolot said:

That is a French caramel. You cook those to a higher temp than a Maillard. Cook 2F less than at sea level. In caramels, that is a big difference.

 

So French caramel is where you caramelize the sugar separately, and Maillard caramels are where you cook everything all together?  Interesting, I'd never heard those terms for the two methods.

 

I'm more curious about silicon caramel molds.  Jim, what did you find, and how much time will they save over individually cutting by hand?

 

 

[Jim D.]

27 minutes ago, pastrygirl said:

I'm more curious about silicon caramel molds.  Jim, what did you find, and how much time will they save over individually cutting by hand?

 

 

The one I saw in use at Jinju Chocolates in Las Vegas was from Chef Rubber. They are on the pricey side (but isn't everything in the chocolate world?), but, more important, they weren't the right size for me--I like rectangles and those were either too small or much too large. The website says lots more sizes are coming soon, but when I asked, I was told to put in a request for a special project (we know what that probably means). So I did a search and found a mold closer to what I wanted on Bakedeco at a considerably lower price. It doesn't save time over pouring the caramel into a frame, but the caramels I finally made today (with the texture I was looking for) would have been horribly distorted by the time I finished cutting them (that may well be related to the one doing the cutting!). Needless to say, I would never cut them on my guitar, though some (braver) people do. The ones made in the mold and now dipped remained rectangular in shape through the whole process yet are soft in texture. I watched the process in Vegas, and it was obvious that, with practice, removing the perfectly shaped caramels is fast and easy. The Chef Rubber mold in use there made small rectangles, and I know you tend to prefer smaller chocolates, so it might be worth looking into (Bakedeco has a small cube as well as the rectangle).

 

On the caramel issue more generally, do you also find that a few degrees makes all the difference in the world? Do you have trouble achieving consistency from batch to batch?

[pastrygirl]

Thanks for the links.  I haven't tried cutting caramels on the guitar because I'm 99% sure there would be a disaster of some sort, instead I use my guitar strings to mark the top of the caramel slab then cut by hand.  So tedious!  

 

I'd say that yes, I have trouble with consistency from batch to batch.  Lately because my candy thermometer died and little instant read digital ones can't be left in the pot.  But some batches do end up squishier than others without that being my intent.  I think there is some sort of correlation between formula and cook temp, but I'm not sure what it is - like if more or less butter in a given recipe equals a higher or lower cook temp to get the same texture.  For my chewy caramels, I go to about 155-160F, a little hotter in the summer so they will be firmer at room temp - sometimes I'm cutting caramels when it's 60F in the kitchen, sometimes it's 70 .  A few degrees does make a difference, which is not as crucial for caramels that will be wrapped in cello.  More crucial for caramels to be dipped - too soft and they'll find the weak spots in the coating and ooze out.  And that's why I haven't dipped caramels in a very long time! 

 

Caramel molds in use at the end of this video - so easy!  Molds plus an enrobing line and voila!  a zillion pieces of product (note: Fran did issue a correction on the "I invented them statement"  she knows she just helped to popularize them in the US: 

 

[Chocolot]

On the caramel issue more generally, do you also find that a few degrees makes all the difference in the world? Do you have trouble achieving consistency from batch to batch?

 

I make Maillard caramels and take them to 232F at 5000 ft. French caramels I take to 244F plus.  If my ingredients are consistent, so are my caramels.

 

 

[Jim D.]

I had a peculiar situation happen today when making caramel. I had the caramelized sugar the color I wanted, removed it from the heat, then immediately added the almost-boiling cream (and some flavorings). After the usual bubbling subsided, I put the pot back on the heat and took the temp. To my surprise, it was already at the end temp I was aiming for (this caramel will be piped). I couldn't believe it and checked a bit in ice water--it was perfect. Yet the consistency of the caramel was quite thin. I put it back on the heat for a while, and the temp was still high, even a little above my goal. So I took it off the heat.

 

Now this has happened to me at least once in the past, and the caramel eventually thickened to the right consistency and was fine. But I'm trying to understand what happened--how could this work? It was in complete contrast to another caramel I made earlier, when after adding the hot cream, I had to cook the mixture for quite some time before it got to temp, and it thickened along the way to the expected texture.

 

So I remain suspicious at the second caramel. Will it suffer in any way from not thickening in the customary gradual way? I must say, the method is very quick, compared to the usual tedious boiling and checking the temp and texture.