Cocktail Sorbets

[eje]

It worked!  It worked!

[...]

But, at the last minute, as I was enjoying a gin and tonic while getting the stocks ready for dinner (okay, my definition of last minute may not be everyone's) I thought, "frozen G&T"?

[...]

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Cool! Sounds like a perfect palate cleanser to me!

By the by, while I don't know that he reads eGullet, Jamie Boudreau's current spirits blog is here:

Spirits and Cocktails

There's contact info there and what not. I expect if you drop him a nice note he would respond and send you the procedure for the Gin Sorbet.

[jmfangio]

I just made an Aperol and blood orange sorbet, simply swapping out the ingredients in a Campari/orange sorbet recipe that I found. Very easy to make, and stupidly good:

2 1/2 cups fresh blood orange juice

1/2 cup sugar

1/3 cup Aperol

Zest of one orange

Juice of half a lemon

[mkayahara]

Jamie Boudreau just posted an interesting recipe for Martini Sorbet on his blog, spiritsandcocktails.com. He uses xanthan gum and agar for texture. As "molecular mixology" ingredients go, these two are relatively easy to come by, since xanthan gum is common in gluten-free recipes and agar can be found at most any Asian grocery.

[bostonapothecary]

Jamie Boudreau just posted an interesting recipe for Martini Sorbet on his blog, spiritsandcocktails.com. He uses xanthan gum and agar for texture. As "molecular mixology" ingredients go, these two are relatively easy to come by, since xanthan gum is common in gluten-free recipes and agar can be found at most any Asian grocery.

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his picture looks beautiful... i more or less gave up on using xanthan gum because it would stick to my glassware...

i made the most beautiful sorbet a couple days ago with my pastry chef from the left over seville orange juice from the charity bar thing i did... i thought i knew how to make sorbet but apparently not... i would have easily obscurred its potential on my own... sevilles have the most beautiful orange identity and i think they work magically in a sorbet because you don't have to embellish their acid identity... part of it was even accented and intensified by creole shrub i made from the previous case of sevilles... its strange how harold mcgee's tables show sevilles as being less complex as the sweet orange but they still bring some kind of strange magic and intensity... they barely have any juice maybe they struggle like good wine grapes?

[mkayahara]

Has anyone tried doing a straight vermouth sorbet? I was thinking I could just freeze sweet vermouth and have the sugar levels be right, but it seems that the alcohol level is too high for it to freeze solid. Any pointers?

[JAZ]

No specific pointers, but keep in mind that frozen, the vermouth will taste much less sweet than at room temp or even just chilled. I've made sorbets with champagne, and the first time, I way underestimated the amount of sugar needed.

[thirtyoneknots]

No specific pointers, but keep in mind that frozen, the vermouth will taste much less sweet than at room temp or even just chilled. I've made sorbets with champagne, and the first time, I way underestimated the amount of sugar needed.

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What if you started with a Demi-sec? You might not need any sugar at all.

[eje]

Isn't there some home friendly way to tell if your sugar concentration is correct for sorbet with a fresh egg?

Ah, yes:

The Search for Silky Sorbet...

Here's an old-fashioned trick that will help you get the right balance of sugar to liquid: Float a washed, uncooked egg (still in its shell) in the liquid; if the part that shows above the surface is the size of a dime, the sugar concentration is right; if it's larger than a dime, the sugar content is too high.

[mkayahara]

So what I think I'm hearing is that I might be able to lower the alcohol and raise the sugar level using some simple syrup. I'm a little worried that, by the time I get the alcohol level right, the vermouth flavour will be diluted, but there's only one way to find out!

Barring that, I may just do a mixed citrus/vermouth sorbet...

[mkayahara]

I tried out the vermouth sorbet on Saturday: I took a half cup of 1:1 simple syrup and topped it off with M&R Bianco vermouth to reach 1.5 cups. Churned that and put it in the freezer to harden. It was really, really wet coming out of the ice cream maker, and better, but still too soft, after a few hours in the deep freeze. I forgot about it until tonight, when I checked on it again. It's still pretty soft, but firmer than it was on Saturday evening. The flavour is strong enough, but a touch too sweet.

I don't know where to go from here, since it looks like I need to lower the alcohol level still further to get it to freeze up harder. I can't add more syrup, because that will bring the sweetness over the top (and the sugar might also be contributing to the softness). I guess I could just add more water and hope it doesn't dilute the flavour too far!

At least the first batch, while not perfect, is edible.

[bostonapothecary]

I tried out the vermouth sorbet on Saturday: I took a half cup of 1:1 simple syrup and topped it off with M&R Bianco vermouth to reach 1.5 cups. Churned that and put it in the freezer to harden. It was really, really wet coming out of the ice cream maker, and better, but still too soft, after a few hours in the deep freeze. I forgot about it until tonight, when I checked on it again. It's still pretty soft, but firmer than it was on Saturday evening. The flavour is strong enough, but a touch too sweet.

I don't know where to go from here, since it looks like I need to lower the alcohol level still further to get it to freeze up harder. I can't add more syrup, because that will bring the sweetness over the top (and the sugar might also be contributing to the softness). I guess I could just add more water and hope it doesn't dilute the flavour too far!

At least the first batch, while not perfect, is edible. 

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no acidity in the picture?

1 cup water

1 cup sugar

1 cup fresh lemon juice

1 tablespoon lemon zest

this is a classic lemon sorbet recipe... i'd try to fit the bianco vermouth into that...

[eje]

I tried out the vermouth sorbet on Saturday: I took a half cup of 1:1 simple syrup and topped it off with M&R Bianco vermouth to reach 1.5 cups. Churned that and put it in the freezer to harden. It was really, really wet coming out of the ice cream maker, and better, but still too soft, after a few hours in the deep freeze. I forgot about it until tonight, when I checked on it again. It's still pretty soft, but firmer than it was on Saturday evening. The flavour is strong enough, but a touch too sweet.

I don't know where to go from here, since it looks like I need to lower the alcohol level still further to get it to freeze up harder. I can't add more syrup, because that will bring the sweetness over the top (and the sugar might also be contributing to the softness). I guess I could just add more water and hope it doesn't dilute the flavour too far!

At least the first batch, while not perfect, is edible. 

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It's probably not the alcohol content, but the sugar that is the problem with the texture.

I think 1 parts sugar to 2 parts water, in a really basic sorbet, is about where you want to be.

But you'd need to whip out that raw egg, or a fancy refractometer, to know exactly.

[bostonapothecary]

I tried out the vermouth sorbet on Saturday: I took a half cup of 1:1 simple syrup and topped it off with M&R Bianco vermouth to reach 1.5 cups. Churned that and put it in the freezer to harden. It was really, really wet coming out of the ice cream maker, and better, but still too soft, after a few hours in the deep freeze. I forgot about it until tonight, when I checked on it again. It's still pretty soft, but firmer than it was on Saturday evening. The flavour is strong enough, but a touch too sweet.

I don't know where to go from here, since it looks like I need to lower the alcohol level still further to get it to freeze up harder. I can't add more syrup, because that will bring the sweetness over the top (and the sugar might also be contributing to the softness). I guess I could just add more water and hope it doesn't dilute the flavour too far!

At least the first batch, while not perfect, is edible. 

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It's probably not the alcohol content, but the sugar that is the problem with the texture.

I think 1 parts sugar to 2 parts water, in a really basic sorbet, is about where you want to be.

But you'd need to whip out that raw egg, or a fancy refractometer, to know exactly.

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i need still need lots of acid to like anything... soup or sorbet...

i drink dakyree's for the lime...

[eje]

i need still need lots of acid to like anything... soup or sorbet...

i drink dakyree's for the lime...

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Yeah, as long as it remains recognizably vermouth.

I think I've said this before, but you might want to do some careful tasting and attempt to tease out what some of the botanicals or spices are in the M&R Bianco. Then use small amounts of those fresh or dry herbs and spices in your sorbet syrup to punch up the character of the vermouth. Any sorbet base should be sweeter and more intense than something you would expect to consume at room temperature. You have to account for the temperature it is served at.

[jmfangio]

Long dormant thread bump...

I picked up some Dolin Blanc over the weekend, and my first thought after tasting it was that it would go beautifully with strawberries.

I had a bunch of strawberries left over from putting up this year's batch of Tequila Por Mi Amante, so I decided to make a strawberry sorbet with the Dolin. As is my wont to do, I looked up a few different recipes, and combined them, ending up with:

1 cup Dolin Blanc

1 cup superfine sugar

18 oz strawberries

3 tablespoons lime juice

Throw everything in the blender, whip into submission, let it chill in the fridge for a few hours, then pour into the ice cream maker. The results? Absolutely delicious, and the Dolin is low enough in proof that even in that quantity the end product holds together nicely.

Edited May 12, 2009 by jmfangio (log)

[mkayahara]

So... after leaving this project on the back burner for way too long, I finally got around to measuring the specific gravity of Martini bianco vermouth (it's 1.050) and using the info provided and linked to by bostonapothecary in this thread to calculate how much sugar I needed to add to get to Francisco Migoya's recommended 25-32 degrees Brix for a sorbet. I ballparked it into the middle of the range (aiming for about 28° Brix), as well as diluting it down to 12% alcohol with plain water. I also added some citric acid for flavour and a touch of xanthan gum, figuring it would help with any free alcohol, but I'm not convinced the latter was a good idea. The final result is still a touch softer than I'd like - it slumps on the plate, rather than holding its form - but it's a heckuva lot closer than my first try. The flavour is fine, though the bitterness of the vermouth may be a touch more evident than usual.

Anyway, if anyone is interested, here's the formulation I used, with some notes for what I'd try in future:

500 ml Martini bianco vermouth

167 ml water

88 g sugar [should go down]

1.97 g xanthan gum [maybe omit?]

1.3 g citric acid [maybe raise]

[Maybe add a pinch of salt?]

[Tri2Cook]

Interesting... sounds like you're on the right track even if it's not quite where you want it yet.

[KatieLoeb]

picked up some Dolin Blanc over the weekend, and my first thought after tasting it was that it would go beautifully with strawberries...

It does. I believe one of the traditional methods of serving the Dolin Blanc is with a few sliced strawberries and soda water. Dolin makes an aperitif called Chamberyzette that includes a syrup made from Alpen strawberries. That sorbet sounds like just the ticket on a brutally hot day like today. Yum!

Edited June 9, 2011 by KatieLoeb (log)

[jmfangio]

picked up some Dolin Blanc over the weekend, and my first thought after tasting it was that it would go beautifully with strawberries...

It does. I believe one of the traditional methods of serving the Dolin Blanc is with a few sliced strawberries and soda water. Dolin makes an aperitif called Chamberyzette that includes a syrup made from Alpen strawberries. That sorbet sounds like just the ticket on a brutally hot day like today. Yum!

I've heard of the Chamberyzette, but haven't had the opportunity to try it. However, a friend of mine is in France right now, in a town not far from Chambery, and I'm begging her to pick me up a bottle.

The strawberries at the Hollywood Farmer's market are ridiculously good right now, so tomorrow I think I'll put up a batch of Tequila por Mi Amante and make the sorbet again.