Bergen Record Restaurant Reviews

[dodge621]

[it is a destination restaurant for many of us]  

How do you know this?  

By the way, Manhattan, Queens, Brooklyn are all closer than Garrison.  

no axe to grind.  I am giving my opinions which seems in part to be shared by some others.

[dodge621]

[Regarding reviewing NY places, like Xaviar's, to me it is acceptable occasionally]

you do not even subscribe

I would suspect if the Record had reviews highly worthy of reading, you may have chosen to subscribe

- or perhaps why bother as you can read it for free on the web.

[Rail Paul]

I'd like to take the opportunity to welcome msp to the thread, and acknowledge her relatively gracious response to some very pointed questioning and speculation.

However, we are back to the same point: the editor does suggest restaurants to be reviewed, and msp suggests others. Lots of reasons why a restaurant might be reviewed, and this thread has identified many of them. Msp added others.

In the end, the Record says "We have several reviewers out there, this is what we go with." It would be difficult for me to assume that the advertiser's response isn't considered at some point on the chain. If msp says it isn't in her frame of reference, fine. I'll take her word for it.

Work related question - of the restaurants you visit, what % make it to a formal review? of those that don't make it, what reasons influence that decision?

[Rachel Perlow]

I would suspect if the Record had reviews highly worthy of reading, you may have chosen to subscribe

Nope, wouldn't matter if the reviews were all perfect and duplicated my opinions exactly. 1) I've found that when I've subscribed to newspapers they just start to pile up and then I have to deal with recycling. I prefer to read on the web, and I'll go out and buy an individual paper when there is really something I have to have in print. 2) I usually don't like to read restaurant reviews unless I'm standing in front of the restaurant - and then it is only for ordering suggestions/warnings.

[tommy]

[it is a destination restaurant for many of us]  

How do you know this?  

By the way, Manhattan, Queens, Brooklyn are all closer than Garrison.  

who wants to drive to brooklyn?

if we define "many" as being "more than 3", than it's clear from this thread alone that rachel's assessment is accurate.

[dodge621]

[who wants to drive to brooklyn?]

or to Garrison, NY

Piermont yes this is reasonable but Garrison

Stamford, CT is closer than Garrison from much of Bergen County

[glenn]

Personally, I'd love to hear about upper Westchester & Putnam County restaurants, that is, if I read the Bergen Record.  We've made many trips to the area to dine, particularly to Cold Spring, Garrison & Philipstown.  There are some fantastic places, especially b&bs, which combined with a scenic drive makes for a super outing.  And I'm in Hudson, not Bergen. I see nothing wrong with a paper reviewing a destination restaurant, nor would I see anything wrong in Grimes reviewing outside NY, though the likelihood of that happening is about as good as dodge and tommy playing golf together.

[tommy]

Stamford, CT is closer than Garrison from much of Bergen County

oh, you must know some destination dining spots in stamford.  do tell.

it seems that a vast majority of the respondents here ( approaching 100% i'd say) doesn't have a problem with the reviewing policy of a this paper, which honestly is no more than a local paper than goes largely ignored when it comes to restaurant reviews.  many people have posted many reasons explaining or rationalizing why a review might have been printed, or why perceived policy might be in place, but one person seems to just say "no, no, no", without offering any cognizant, rational, or reasonable arguments to support his case.  baffling to say the least.

[tommy]

My comment "I agree" was to acknowledge Rail Paul's opinion.

punctuation would make your posts read more easily.  honestly, it can be difficult without periods and commas, as the internet is an inherently difficult medium through which to communicate.

[Rail Paul]

I'll claim "reigning deity of semicolons" and add it to my "reigning deity of raw chicken" status...

Who wants "reigning deity of colons..."

[msp]

All journalists, whether news reporters or feature writers, should take their responsibility to REPORT quite seriously. Most I know do. Part of taking the responsibility of being a reporter seriously is to see yourself as existing in a seperate universe from the marketing and sales departments. Any journalist worth his salt will never consider the financial aspects of running a newspaper while reporting a story...including reviews.

Dodge, I am sure you are not alone in disagreeing with the opinions of reviewers. Can you imagine a world where every reader agreed with every review? Conventional wisdom would suggest you follow a reviewer whose writing style and opinions you are in concert with, and trust that person to be your guide. Certainly over the years there have been reviewers in other areas and other papers with whom I tended to disagree more than agree...that's ok. We are reviewers because we  have knowledgable educated palates, are observant, are capable of reporting without bias, and are willing (!)

Rail Paul, thank you for your support. Please especially note what I said above, that any decent journalist-- such as the food editor at the Bergen record, (who is considered amongst the top food editors in the country and has recvd many awards and acknowledgements from her peers) would not be influenced by advertising dollars. Believe me, the food editor at the Record is a strongly ethical woman, to whom other journalists turn for guidance about ethics issues. I write for many national magazines (and much bigger newspapers), and my affiliation with the Record is probably my biggest source of pride when it comes to journalistic standards.

I'm curoius:  from whom did you get that qupote that you attreibute to the Record, and what was the context?

And now to your (rail paul) question...of the restaurants I visit how many do I actually review? Well, if I understand the question, the answer is (with a very rare exception) all. I do not visit a restaurant on the Record's dime unless I review it. Before I visit a restaurant for a review, it is agred and scheduled for publication on a certain date. There is no turning back, no deciding not to review it.

On the other hand, I have a life, a family, friends, a need and desire to eat. There are time, plenty of them, that I go out to eat and do not review the restaurant. Those are the times when I do not have to concentrate on every detail of the room, commit to memory every morsel on the table--- I just relax and DONT think about what I'm doing.

Whew. I hope I answered all the questions...and helped you understand the process, and how hard we all strive to be sure we are fair.

MSP

[dodge621]

msp

thanks for giving me another reason to stop my subscription.

[ngatti]

Someone asked, after my earlier posting, if msp=Marge Perry, reviewer for The Record. Yup, it's me.

Fair enough.  ngatti = Nicholas Gatti, Executive Chef at the Alpine Country Club and Restaurant Coordinator for 'Table to Table', Bergen County's food rescue program. Formerly Chef at The Bacari Grill in Washington Township.  Recipient of three very glowing stars from 'The Record' in 1993 (and still trying to figure out Mary Amoroso's culinary chops vis a vis that review).  I've also been reviewed by Anne Semmes who was not nearly as glowing (only a 'good') but was spot on with her criticism.  I've been a scrupulous reader of 'The Record's' reviews since Mark Howat (I've met him twice).  I know John Foy through my past work as Restaurant Coordinator for North Jersey's 'Share Our Strength' and I've met Pat Mack on more than one occasion.

Now all cards are on the table along with my axe and grinding stone.

Ok, time to address another point raised in this thread: While the people on this site are all affirmed foodies and very aware that the Binghamton (which I did not review)

I thought it was clear that Rene Mack was the reviewer.

many readers of the paper may not be aware of that...think of people new to our area, or generally not knowledgable about the restaurant scene who may see it all lit up at night and wonder  

.  

I think 'The Record' restaurant reviewers should aspire to something beyond mere reportage.  I also think you're grasping at straws.  This restaurant is a landmark.  One with a sordid and tragic past that 'The Record' has reported about on its front pages.  I find it naive to think that the general populations of Edgewater and the surrounding towns have not heard of both 'The Binghamton' AND its reputation.  Perhaps we may agree to disagree on this point  

The purpose of reviews is to inform readers about the experience they can expect when spending their money at a restaurant. To the reader curious about a restaurant we food savvy people  know to be less than adaquate, a review of the place offers an important service.

Of course!, but this belabors the obvious.  How about taking a review to the next level.  Look, as a longtime critical reader of "The Record's'  restaurant reviews,  it's clear to me that this newspaper has a adapted a quasi NYT paradigm with the dual nature of the friday restaurant reviews.  I think it behooves the editorial staff of 'The Record' to take a closer look at that model as currently practiced by the 'Times':  One reviewer (Grimes) provides criticism of important restaurants and chefs that attempt to make unique, strong and, perhaps, cutting edge culinary statements.  The other reviewer (Asimov) attempts to inform us about all manner of relatively inexpensive restaurants.  The criterion being, and here lies the important distinction, that the price of a meal be generally under twentyfive dollars.  Asimov generally writes much more of a descriptive piece than a critical one.  Yes there is criticism, but no vitriol, little sarcasm, and certainly little time is spent on gratuitous rants about food and service.  Misses are quickly and minimally dealt with, generally implied, and the reviewer moves on to the next dish.

The Record started out with a similar model (although for a while it seemed that anyone with a free night off was doing the diamond review).  However a perverse transformation seems to have taken place.  Why is The Binghamton (which provides full bar service and a healthier check average than many BYOBs or diners) getting the diamond review while many BYOBs get the starred review?        

How much would you trust as a source for reviews a newspaper which only reports on restaurants they like? Clearly, the reviewers were pre-disposed to like the restaurant before they even reviewed it!

I don't think anyone ever made such a statement.  'The Record' would never make such a gross ethical breach.  That said, people are human.  Over the years of reading 'The Record', it seems clear that the paper is somewhat enamored of certain Chefs and restaurant groups.  This is bound to happen.  it's a natural occurrence.  But because it does happen it's very very important, IMO, to keep Food editorial staff separate from the reviewing of restaurants.  This is not always the case at 'The Record'.

   

One final note. Many people think reviewing is about finding fault and pointing out weaknesses. I believe that is absolutely not our job. I do not walk in to a restaurant looking for mistakes, looking for oversalting, long waits, dry fish, or any other problems. I go to a restaurant armed only with the need to observe and report. Frankly, I love finding restaurants who do their job well, who are passionate and enthralled and good managers.

I also think that it is not yours or any other reviewers job to deconstruct a meal or a dish to the point where I'm reading a treatise/manifesto on how 'I Would Have Done It Differently' or 'In Cooking School I Was Taught This Way', and maybe YOU don't 'walk into a restaurant looking for mistakes' , but then perhaps someone should inform Foy, and Bonom that they shouldn't either.

I realize that you and 'The Record'  freelancers and regular staff food writers, write for a dining public and NOT for Chefs and restauranteurs.  But I must say that a lot, I mean A LOT

of Bergen County Chefs feel exactly the way I do.  The subject comes up quite often.  We would all like to see a bit more consistency on the review pages (maybe too many reviewers is the problem).  I for one would like to see 'The Record's' dining out reviews garner the same respect that The 'New York Times' New Jersey edition reviews do.

Thanx for listening

Nick

[dodge621]

Nick, excellent post.

punctuation would make your posts read more easily.  honestly, it can be difficult without periods and commas, as the internet is an inherently difficult medium through which to communicate.

if you do not like the posts, skip over them.  Honestly, you are not the monitor of this post.

[tommy]

if you do not like the posts, skip over them.  Honestly, you are not the monitor of this post.

you missed the point.  it was a suggestion that stemmed from the fact that one of your posts went misunderstood.  it has nothing to do with my "like" or dislike of your posts.  it is only in the interest effective communication, which one might assume might come in handy when, um, communicating.  do with that what you will.

[dodge621]

[the bergen record hardly rates when it comes to restaurant reviewing. ]

well I think we are all in agreement with this.  

It is really too bad.  Wish this were not the case.

[tommy]

well I think we are all in agreement with this.  

thank goodness!  

[Rosie]

After reading the reasons that The Bergen Record goes out of NJ to review I have changed my mind ( a bit) on this matter. It does make sense to include some restaurants on the NY or PA border for those people who live near there. Also, learning about destination restaurants is a plus. But since I "specialize" in NJ restaurants I prefer to read about NJ restaurants.

When I was reviewing restaurants I found that if you wrote a good review the chef would think you were brillant--a food goddess! If you wrote a bad review you didn't know what you were talking about! A review is one person's opinion and information about their two experiences at the restaurant.If you usually agree with the reviewer follow their advice. If you don't then do the opposite of what they suggest. BTW-- a reviewer has to eat alot of bad meals also. It's not necessarily a cream puff job.

[dodge621]

Rosie, the Record does a joke of a job at reviewing.

[Rosie]

Look, there's vanilla and chocolate ice cream because we all have different tastes. I enjoy reading the reviews in the Bergen Record every week.

[dodge621]

[it does make sense to include some restaurants on the NY or PA border for those people who live near there.]

Have you looked at a map? Garrison, NY is not on the border of NJ.

[tommy]

[dead horse]

[Rosie]

[it does make sense to include some restaurants on the NY or PA border for those people who live near there.]

Have you looked at a map? Garrison, NY is not on the border of NJ.

Dodge--Lowell and I will often drive over 100 miles round trip to a restaurant and we have driven to Xavier's in Garrison and lived further away in Edison at that time.

[dodge621]

Great, but your comment on being on the border is not correct.

[pbrodsky2]

I agree with Rosie.