Question about mousses for layer cakes

[CanadianBakin']

Wendy's blog showed lemon mist cakes with a lemon mousse in the middle. For whatever reason I haven't used mousses much and definitely not between cake layers but I have an order that I think this would be great for. Is it best to use a mousse with a bit of gelatin in it? Also, is there a basic formula of whipping cream to flavour? Like lemon curd, raspberry reduction (?), Dulce de Leche, etc. Does anyone have a no-fail recipe they could post? I'm making Pierre Herme's lemon cream for another order anyways so I thought I could just make a bit extra and fold it into whipped cream but I don't know what ratio. I need 3 flavours. Any help appreciated.

[Wendy DeBord]

This is a pm from CanadianBaker that I'm posting in thread with her permission. Although she orginally dirrected her question to me, I hope that everyone knowledgable on the topic will jump in and particapate..........so we all can learn together.

"I'm sorry, I'm technically challenged. I'm not sure how to get the pictures here but hopefully you can tell what I'm asking about by your comments. It's on page 6 of your blog. Looks like 2 layers of yellow cake with chocolate mousse, buttercream on top with a rosette and half a marbled cigarette.

I'd like to make 4 of these in a 9x13 size with different flavoured mousses. I've done a bit of research now and realize that it's probably Bavarian Cream. I found a post you made on... I think it was Chef2Chef in 2001 or 2002 and it mentioned this. I've looked in a few cookbooks and have found limited advice although I haven't begun searching the net for Bavarian Cream yet. My CIA book has a basic recipe with the option of flavouring it strawberry with strawberry puree. I'd like to do a filling with Pierre Herme's lemon cream, raspberry puree, maybe one mocha and one Dulce de Leche.

So my questions are, in the CIA recipe it calls for 8 oz of water or 8 oz of puree. How much lemon cream or Dulce de Leche or melted chocolate & coffee would I add when they aren't nearly as liquid as puree? Second, what type of cake did you use? Is it just a basic yellow cake or a chiffon? I'm not as practiced with chiffon so if that is what you used, would it be successful with a regular yellow or white cake instead? How much can I do before freezing it? Can I fill the cakes? Or can I go as far as icing and garnishing?"

[Wendy DeBord]

Once upon a time I thought mousses never contained gelatin..........until I started working out of some expensive French pastry books. I've always disliked gelatin products, I don't much care for jellies of any sort. BUT after I tried some of Herme's mousse recipes I discovered that you really can't detect the gelatin in his mousses. He doesn't over use them. Theres just enough to make the mousse set, that's it. Then I discovered that theres alot of other chefs that have also used gelatin modestly and it isn't just a Herme' thing. What it was, was a thing of the past. Older baking books did over use gelatin in too large of quantities.

So what you've seen in my blog are all mousses. I do make bavarians..........but not that often.

I'm not aware of any basic proportions one can follow when flavoring whip cream. I really do do it to taste.......and usually I'm pretty liberal. Some flavorings can weaken the stability of your whipped cream, some add to the stability. You can also look at doing this from another perspective. Many pastry books have you whip the cream and then fold in the accenting flavor. I've found by trial that I can add those flavors in before I whip my cream and that gives me the most stable product.

For example, my tirmisu. In my bowl I whip together all at one time, my marscarpone, heavy cream, liquours, egg yolk until it's full and thick, like whip cream. Instead of whipping my cream and folding the other ingredients into it. When making large batches I also keep this in my mixer while I add my whipped egg whites and let the mixer fold together the two. The mixer with the whip attachment doesn't do any harm that hand folding doesn't.....if done responsibly.

(I have to run to work now, I hope others will join in while I'm away.)

[Wendy DeBord]

The recipe I use for strawberry or raspberry mousse comes from Pierre Herme's book, La Patisseried De Pierre Herme', page 33.

The ingredients are:

700 g fruit pulp (raspberry puree or strawberry puree room temp or warmer)

15 g lemon juice

25 g. gelatin leaved

400 g. Italian meringue (I often us instant meringue power)

500 g light cream (I use heavy cream)

Soften the gelatin in cold water. Whip your meringue and you cream seperately. Drain gelatin, then heat to melt/dissolve it. Temper in some of the puree then add the mixture back into the puree. Fold in your whites then your cream. This mousse freezes perfectly.

To make a lemon filling, I might use a lemon curd or a lemon mousse or use Herme's lemon cream as written. You can add some gelatin to Herme's lemon cream filling to further stabilize it if you want. I'd probably add about 3 sheets per recipe. The fillings and cake flavors are your choice.

For a chocolate filling I'd use a chocolate mousse recipe and probably coat/frost my cake with ganche. I often use additional flavorings in my chocolate mousse, items like orange oil, lemon oil, cinnamon, ets...

Do you need recipes for chocolate mousse and lemon mousse or are you familar with them?

For the cake portion.........you really can use any cake you like. You can use a cake mix if you want, or make a chiffon, genoise, etc.... . I can't recall what I did in the photo your mentioning specificly.

How I assemble this type of petite four:

After baking your cakes, level them........hopefully you did bake off thin layers, or else you need to slice them. Then freeze your cake until firm (I use cake cardboards underneath my cakes to carry them around). Melt some chocolate and frost one side of your cake layer (the side you want down) thinnly with the chocolate. Return it to the freezer. Make you filling, when the filling is made pull you cake layers out of the freeze. Put the cake layer with the chocolate on it, chocolate side down in your pan (In a pan so it holds the mousse in place while it's setting up). Pour mousse over the cake, add top layer of cake and refreeze. Once it's solidly frozen I unmold the whole cake(by applying heat to the pan) and reinvert it so the chocolate side is down. Then I frost the top of my cake with anything I like from ganches to frostings and flavored whipped creams. As the cake just so lightly begins to defrost but is still quite firm I cut the whole cake into petite fours using a clean warm knive. Working with the cake while frozen prevents dents and lets you handle them with-out damage. I then refreeze my petite fours until an hour or two before serving. Through-out this process I'm never letting my cakes completely defrost until I'm ready to serve them.

HTH?

[CanadianBakin']

Thanks Wendy! That's a huge help. I think I can figure the rest out except... just one more questions: I don't have ready access to gelatin leaves, any idea how they convert to gelatin in packets?

[ALTAF]

And how much teaspoons there in a gelatin packet?

[ALTAF]

Once upon a time I thought mousses never contained gelatin..........until I started working out of some expensive French pastry books. I've always disliked gelatin products, I don't much care for jellies of any sort. BUT after I tried some of Herme's mousse recipes I discovered that you really can't detect the gelatin in his mousses. He doesn't over use them. Theres just enough to make the mousse set, that's it. Then I discovered that theres alot of other chefs that have also used gelatin modestly and it isn't just a Herme' thing. What it was, was a thing of the past. Older baking books did over use gelatin in too large of quantities.

So what you've seen in my blog are all mousses. I do make bavarians..........but not that often.

I'm not aware of any basic proportions one can follow when flavoring whip cream. I really do do it to taste.......and usually I'm pretty liberal. Some flavorings can weaken the stability of your whipped cream, some add to the stability. You can also look at doing this from another perspective. Many pastry books have you whip the cream and then fold in the accenting flavor. I've found by trial that I can add those flavors in before I whip my cream and that gives me the most stable product.

For example, my tirmisu. In my bowl I whip together all at one time, my marscarpone, heavy cream, liquours, egg yolk until it's full and thick, like whip cream. Instead of whipping my cream and folding the other ingredients into it. When making large batches I also keep this in my mixer while I add my whipped egg whites and let the mixer fold together the two. The mixer with the whip attachment doesn't do any harm that hand folding doesn't.....if done responsibly.

(I have to run to work now, I hope others will join in while I'm away.)

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Hi wendy,

Can you share with us your tiramisu recipe. I feel it taste good

[chiantiglace]

1 packet equals a tablespoon, so thats 3 tsp.

equivalent to 1/4 oz and 8 g

[CanadianBakin']

On the marshmallow thread Patrick mentioned that gelatin leaves and powder can be substituted gram per gram so I'll try that.

[pchef_247]

1 packet equals a tablespoon, so thats 3 tsp.

equivalent to 1/4 oz and 8 g

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Ever tried powdered cocoa butter to replace the gelatin in your mousse recipes? It's a bit more expensive but has a much cleaner taste and nicer mouth feel.

[chiantiglace]

Mycryo powdered cocoa butter, yes its wonderful.