Deli meats for hoagies

[CoolPapaBell]

Okay, I see the talk about meat in a cheesesteak, but how about another item on the menu?

When I visit my old stomping grounds, I always have to pick up a hoagie…or two or three. What elevates a Delaware Valley version from the rest of the world is the quality of the rolls.

However, I notice most of the top shops in metro use either Dietz & Watson or Thuman’s meat. Both are high quality, but IMHO Boar’s Head is the king. Why the dearth of Boar’s Head in Philly area hoagie places? To me, a place that has Amoroso rolls with a generous serving of Boar’s Head can rise above the rest.

[Sfuffy]

Philly hoagie shops probably use D&W meats for the same reason they use Amoroso rolls (which I have always found to be soft and flabby) - they're a local product with a long history in the area. And we all know that Fluffyans can be incredibly loyal (and more than a little provincial) to what they grew up with. I've always thought of Boar's Head as a NYC product while Thumanns being from North Jersey straddles the gap.

(It may also have something to do with which lines local deli meat distributors carry.)

Edited July 18, 2004 by Sfuffy (log)

[Gifted Gourmet]

While there are innumerable varieties and brands of cold cuts, but I believe that nothing compares to Boar's Head.

One of the few brands recommended by the American Heart Association and the American Diabetic Association, and I find them incredibly tasty and much better than what you can get at most of the supermarket delis. Just my personal preference! oh, and their muenster cheese is another of my favorites ...

Edited July 18, 2004 by Gifted Gourmet (log)

[Holly Moore]

In my experience the meat is usually D&W - but I place the meat way low in priority when deciding how much I like a hoagie. The roll is first, the quality of the aged provolone second, the salad fixins, the oil and other garnishes third and the meat last. I think that's because the quality hoagies shops seem to use very similar quality meat and by the time everything else is layered on, the meat is somewhat overpowered by its supporting cast.

My two favorite Philadelphia (City of) hoagie shops - Chick's and Sarcone's - and one I am coming to like a lot - Campo's - all use Sarcone's bread, not Amoroso.

Note to Holly - Next time you order dogs and brats from Usinger's see if they'll throw in their equivalent sausage products to Philly hoagie meats. Could make a world class German style hoagie

Edited July 19, 2004 by Holly Moore (log)

[rlibkind]

It's almost a sin to say this, but some of the best Italian meats for hoagies comes not from the Philadelphia area, or even North Jersey or New York, but from (gasp!) St. Louis. Specifically, "The Hill," home to Yogi Berra and Joe Garagiola. (Must be something in the water or wine there to produce catchers.)

The purveyor is John Volpi & Co., which arguably makes some of the best domestic Italian cold cuts you can find. They've been at it for more than 100 years, just about as long as anyone in the U.S. You have to like a maker of ham who says: "taking the fat completely off a prosciutto is like removing the bubbles from Champaign'.

The only local hoagie maker I know using Volpi's meats is Salumeria at the Reading Terminal Market. I recommend the prosciutto with the house dressing and marinated artichokes, along with along the regular fixings.

A few years back, visiting friends from the area who had moved to St. Louis, I brought them some Salumeria hoagies, with the meat re-imported back to St. Louis!

[MarketStEl]

Okay, now I know it must be the bread and the cheese, for Planet Hoagie uses Hatfield meats--the first hoagie shop I've run across that does. PH's sharp Provolone is first-rate, BTW.

Or maybe Hatfield is underrated?

Boar's Head, OTOH, is as good as everyone else says it is. I've never had a tastier deli ham--it's actually a touch sweet, which I find preferable to the saltiness of most deli ham.

[MarketStEl]

I was chowing down on a Melino's hoagie with my roommate (while simultaneously engaging in a discussion of food preparation hygiene with his cousin that did not reflect well on that establishment) last Saturday when I realized that not only am I apparently a hoagie heretic, I seem to pay attention to the meat more than the bread.

I had been under the impression that Melino's, like most of the better hoagie shops in Philadelphia, used Dietz & Watson as their meat supplier.

I was wrong.

Like Planet Hoagie--whose sandwiches have underwhelmed everyone else on this board who's tried them, but which I love--their meats come from Hatfield.

And over on the DC/Delmarva board, where I asked for recommendations on places to lunch in Wilmington, one DTBarton recommended Capriotti's, on the city's west side, as a place where I could get good sandwiches in Wilmington.

I checked out their Web site, and right on the front page is the legend:

"Capriotti's Is Proud To Use Hatfield Products"

and a link to Hatfield's corporate Web site. (How they get them to their West Coast locations is a mystery to me.)

When buying kielbasa or smoked sausage now, I usually wait until I can get to the South Philly Acme, because they stock Hatfield while the Super Cruise only carries Hillshire Farm, which I consider inferior.

I think I see a pattern here. And Hatfield is a local company, like Dietz & Watson, but I don't see their products in as many places as I do D&W.

So: Does the meat matter in a hoagie? And are people overlooking an excellent local purveyor whose name and reputation may not be as well known or established? And whose kielbasa should I buy, while we're at it?

[mrbigjas]

i don't think you're a heretic, sandy. i've liked the hoagies i've gotten from planet hoagie--although i have to admit there have been only two, and they were from the one in media.

i buy kielbasa from the amish vendors in the terminal (usually dutch country meats), but many people have recomended the various polish places in port richmond or the northeast...

[rlibkind]

The meat makes a difference, especially in Italian hoagies. Salumeria at the Reading Terminal Market uses my favorite brand of domestically-produced Italian deli, Volpi products, imported from "The Hill" in St. Louis.

A few years back I was visiting friends in St. Louis originally from Reading, and one of them craved a hoagie from Philadelphia; so, I "re-imported" the Volpi meat back to St. Louis by picking up at Italian hoagie at Salumeria on my way to the airport.

Now, if only Salumeria would switch to Sarcone's bread, it would be the best hoagie in town rather than merely one of the best (especially when you add the artichokes)!

[mrbigjas]

so i'm thinking about this topic a little more, and here's my thing about this: generally speaking when i get a hoagie (specifically i'm talking italian hoagie here) there's all kindsa lettuce and tomatoes and peppers and onions on it. and not only that but there are generally three or four kinds of meat on it, and cheese. so i don't mean this quite the way it sounds, but small differences between the brands of meat don't make that much of a difference to me, because with all that going on, the sandwich becomes more than the sum of its parts, and a lot of subtlety is lost.

[ghostrider]

The meat makes a difference, especially in Italian hoagies. Salumeria at the Reading Terminal Market uses my favorite brand of domestically-produced Italian deli, Volpi products, imported from "The Hill" in St. Louis.

A few years back I was visiting friends in St. Louis originally from Reading, and one of them craved a hoagie from Philadelphia; so, I "re-imported" the Volpi meat back to St. Louis by picking up at Italian hoagie at Salumeria on my way to the airport.

Now, if only Salumeria would switch to Sarcone's bread, it would be the best hoagie in town rather than merely one of the best (especially when you add the artichokes)!

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Wow. I'm browsing around here, preparing for a couple of days in Philly this week. Next trip, in April, is back to my home town of St. Louis. Was planning on reacquainting self with The Hill. Talk about your serendipity! Sometimes I just love this place.

Of course it sounds like I have a pretty good chance of finding Volpi products locally. Still, it'd be nice to visit the source.

[stephenc]

Planet Hoagie makes a really good chicken cutlet hoagie.

[jmbrightman]

thumann's meats are very good. the key is not layering the meats in wax paper prior to making the sandwich - that way the meat flavors stay distinct. Salumeria uses mortadella on their hoagie, also romaine rather than iceberg. theirs is a variation of, not a traditional Italian hoagie. and the marinated artichokes are a great addition.

[Behemoth]

A few years back I was visiting friends in St. Louis originally from Reading, and one of them craved a hoagie from Philadelphia; so, I "re-imported" the Volpi meat back to St. Louis by picking up at Italian hoagie at Salumeria on my way to the airport.

Volpi is a good brand...you can tell your friends it is carried by Schnuck's supermarket, a St. Louis chain that has branches in Central IL, where I'm at. (Though my first choice: my Italian guy in Urbana carries Batali's dad's stuff, which is amazing. ) But Volpi is quite good. Schnucks has it both pre-sliced in packages, and whole, behind the deli.

Edited March 25, 2005 by Behemoth (log)

[DTBarton]

I'll have to go along with the post that said a hoagie (as someone who grew up in northern Delaware, they'll always be subs to me) is more the sum of the parts. I distinguish places based on whether they use good quality, flavorful meats and ingredients in the right proportions on a good roll. If they do this, I'm usually not hard over on the particular brands. I like all good subs, but tend to favor the traditional Italian (which for me means spicy capacolla, genoa salami, provolone, lettuce, tomato, onion, crushed red peppers, dressed with light oil and Italian herbs). When ordering, you should be asked "pickles and peppers"? Further refining the peppers with "hot, sweet?"I've had great sandwiches from Salumeria, but they're "nouvelle" Italian subs to me.

You folks who live in Philly (or northern Delaware) are blessed with many good places that use good ingredients. I live in central Maryland and most sandwich places are inedible. An "Italian" sub gets you way too much low rent greasy salami and (shudder) boiled ham and tasteless industrial cheese with a tiny bit of vegetation. The further south you go, the worse it gets. Italian sub horror story repeated often in more southern regions (I know better, but over the years you have to take some for the team): You order an "Italian" sub and get asked not "pickles or peppers?", but the dreaded 2 questions - "Mustard or mayonaise?" and the worst - "You want that hot?" Oh, the humanity.

As for kielbasa, I have one recommendation if you ever find yourself in or near Baltimore. You've got to check out Ostrowski's in the Fell's Point neighborhood. Best fresh and smoked kielbasa I've ever had, really no one else close. Big John is the man! But then, I'm not a midwesterner, bet there's some good kielbasa in Chicago.

http://ostrowskifamous.homestead.com/index2.html

[MarketStEl]

I'll have to go along with the post that said a hoagie (as someone who grew up in northern Delaware, they'll always be subs to me) is more the sum of the parts.  I distinguish places based on whether they use good quality, flavorful meats and ingredients in the right proportions on a good roll. [...]

You folks who live in Philly (or northern Delaware) are blessed with many good places that use good ingredients.  I live in central Maryland and most sandwich places are inedible.  An "Italian" sub gets you way too much low rent greasy salami and (shudder) boiled ham and tasteless industrial cheese with a tiny bit of vegetation.  The further south you go, the worse it gets.  Italian sub horror story repeated often in more southern regions (I know better, but over the years you have to take some for the team):  You order an "Italian" sub and get asked not "pickles or peppers?", but the dreaded 2 questions - "Mustard or mayonaise?"  and the worst - "You want that hot?"  Oh, the humanity. 

You're the guy who recommended Capriotti's over on the DC/Delmarva board. Unfortunately for me, I suspect that at best, I'd have to phone in an order to go and hurry back to the office, for I'd be riding the bus from Rodney Square over to their shop on Wilmington's west side.

Frankly, if I had the time and the means of transportation, I'd go down to the Delaware Sub Shop in Rehoboth on my lunch hour.

As for mustard, I definitely am a hoagie heretic there, for I often request it on my sandwiches. But your Maryland horror story is truly disturbing. May God save their benighted souls.

As for kielbasa, I have one recommendation if you ever find yourself in or near Baltimore.  You've got to check out Ostrowski's in the Fell's Point neighborhood.  Best fresh and smoked kielbasa I've ever had, really no one else close.  Big John is the man!  But then, I'm not a midwesterner, bet there's some good kielbasa in Chicago.

http://ostrowskifamous.homestead.com/index2.html

←

I'm sure that a mediocre supplier in Chicago would have better kielbasa than I could hope to find anywhere around here except maybe Bridesburg. But I'll keep that Baltimore recommendation in my mental file should I find myself down that way.

[gbredben]

For me personally, I have been always satisfied with the sandwiches from Planet Hoagie. But I also enjoy sandwiches from Capriotti's, Casapulla's in North Wilmington, Gooey Louie's, Primo's, Chickie's Deli. Need to try the hoagie at Salumeria's. Even the neighborhood bar near me makes a pretty decent italian hoagie for the lunch crowd. Thumann's, Hatfield's, Dietz and Watson, and Boar's Head seems to be the ingredients of the better hoagie shops in the area. But the difference in taste and size also I believe allows for a wide variety not only of sandwiches, but also of sandwich types. An italian from Primo's and an italian from Gooey Louie's may be polar opposites, but both are great sandwiches with a lot of flavor.

[DTBarton]

"Frankly, if I had the time and the means of transportation, I'd go down to the Delaware Sub Shop in Rehoboth on my lunch hour." wink.gif

From Wilmington, that would be a loooong lunch hour. Go for the lunch weekend once the weather warms up! You definitely need to recruit a driver that needs consulting on where to eat.