Viking versus KitchenAid – For bread

[maxmillan]

I presently have a 5-quart lift-type lever KA which has been great for the 5 years that I've used it. However, I saw a 7-quart 1000 watt Viking stand mixer for $700 Canadian!...at my local kitchen store.

I was told that if I plan to do heavy breads regularly (which I am starting to do) my KA's motor would not last as long than a more powerful motor.

I would like to keep my stand mixer for many more years and not have to deal with repairs and plan to give away my KA and replace it with the Viking.

Viking.http://www.vikingrange.com/whatsnew/stand_mixer_press.html

Not only does it have a large quart capacity, with adjustment you can make a small amount of whipped cream.

Does anyone have any knowledge or experience with the Viking? I know all I need to know about the KA and only need info on the Viking.

Thanks for your help.

[chezcherie]

the viking was just introduced last year, so it will be difficult to compare long-term track records.

one advantage i noticed (when i saw the viking at the gourmet product show) was the wheels! they put wheels on the back end of the monster, so you can easily move it on the counter to clean under it. i played with it a bit, to see whether the mixer seemed like it would move "on its own", say, under the velocity of a double batch of wheat bread, but it semed pretty stable...you have to tilt the mixer back to engage the wheels.(sorta like those kids who wear the shoes with wheels in them...not sure how those work, either, but they sure race around costco in an annoying manner!)

still love my ka...12 years of hard labor, and going strong!

[Dave the Cook]

The wattage rating on an electric motor only tells you how much power it consumes, not how much power it puts out. Generally speaking, input and output are related -- a motor that consumes more power can usually be relied upon to actually be more powerful, but it is not always the case. And when it comes to motors that are coupled to gear trains and transmissions (stand mixers have both), a lot of power can be lost through inefficent design. All of this is to say: wattage isn't everything.

As for the Viking, I have only second-hand information. I recently visited the kitchen of a chef who had one for evaluation. The motor burned out while mixing a batch of pasta dough. Admittedly, this guy makes really dense dough, but it was a bit surprising to hear that this supposedly powerful machine had died such an unseemly death.

Whether or not Viking makes decent ranges is another debate, but knives, cookware, refrigerators and mixers are not their traditonal business. Overall, I've not been impressed with any of their forays away from the range and into the rest of the kitchen. If I were you, I'd keep looking.

[eatrustic]

I've also had my eye on the new Viking (probably the same cookshop as you!) and would give it a try if I was in the market for a new mixer. I have a Kenwood Major which is in the same league as the Viking as far as power and capacity. (Probably not available in N. America any more).

As the others have stated it is too soon tell if the Viking has the durability for years of use but the style tells me it would probably be superior to the KA for kneading dough. I find the KA is not powerfull enough for most serious dough kneading and the style of the dough hook never quite gets the job done to my satisfaction.

The Viking has a power control that is like my Kenwood in that you can increase power gradually, unlike the KA which clicks into each power setting often causing flour to jump out of the bowl (who uses those bowl covers anyway!). It also has a nice spiral hook.

Shop around and see if you can find a store in town that has a good return policy (and hopefully better pricing) and give it a try at home.

Good luck and let us know what you decided.

[maxmillan]

Thanks for your input. Think I will wait until I hear some more about the Viking.

I spoke to the sales person at the City Square Mall in Vancouver and he sounded

very enthusiastic about the Viking over the KA.

A problem with the KA's tilt design is that the bread dough can make it difficult to

tilt the head back because the dough tends to rise up the paddle.

The Viking's bread paddle is designed so that the dough stays down and tilting the head should be easy.

Plus, a KA rep bought the Viking model (we suspect he was going to test it against the KA in a lab.)

I lifted the Viking 1000 watt model and it was surprisingly light. To Dave the Cook, I agree that may be due to a possible compromised design in the engine (non-metal parts, maybe?)

Reading thru past threads, I hadn't realize that Hobart use to produce the KA and now another company is making them. Hopefully the model I bought was a Hobart offspring.

I don't know of any store that will allow a refund once the unit is used.

To eatrustic, to prevent flour from jumping out of the mixing bowl, I hold a clean towel around the bowl and turn it on low. Then I simply shake the towel inwards towards the bowl once the flour spray has ceased...works all the time with no mess.

[Steve Klc]

Max--I'm not sure what you mean by the KA's "tilt design?" Are you trying to do bread in the model where the bowl attaches at the base--and not in a model where the bowl snaps in place and is raised and lowered by a lever?

[Dave the Cook]

I lifted the Viking 1000 watt model and it was surprisingly light.  To Dave the Cook,  I agree that may be due to a possible compromised design in the engine (non-metal parts, maybe?)

. . . or aluminum rather than the expected steel. IIRC, the housing on the Viking is aluminum; that alone would account for a significant weight differential.

There's not necessarily anything wrong with design compromises, as long as you know how they affect performance, and you're comfortable with those effects. For instance, if the housing is indeed aluminum, how does the lighter weight and difference in flexibility affect the rigidity of the body? On the KA, the housing is integral to the head of the mixer, and lends overall strength, helping to keep the machine stable. If Viking has a design that doesn't rely on the housing for structure, it can be made out of anything -- including plastic -- that will keep dust and dirt and grime away from the motor, and it might not affect performance or durability at all.

[bigwino]

Did anyone see that Hobart is now selling a home mixer through Williams-Sonoma?

It's a 5 quart capacity mixer for a mere $2,000!

This link might work...

[Dave the Cook]

Nice catch, bigwino. I think that's the same one that's on sale at Big Tray for $500 less -- and they'll ship it for free.

BTW, I'm pretty sure there's a misprint in the W-S item. The motor is almost certainly 1/6 HP, not 16 (!). Incidentally, horsepower is a much better way of describing the output of a motor than is the wattage/consumption.

[chromedome]

A problem with the KA's tilt design is that the bread dough can make it difficult to

tilt the head back because the dough tends to rise up the paddle.

Pet peeve. I bake bread a couple of times a week, most weeks, and I'd rather anticipated that my KA would ease the process.

What a pain in the ass. A lot of the time I wind up just dumping the dough out onto the table and finishing it the old-fashioned way. Don't get me wrong, I love my KA, but it just doesn't do bread very well. Unwinding the dough from around the head unit is a standard part of making bread at my place, these days. Grrr.

[maxmillan]

Initially I was going to give my sister my old KA and buy myself the Viking. But after much consideration, I went and bought a new KA from Cosco for her. I can wait for more consensus on the Viking (or other better mixers within my budget.)

It was a good price, too. $400.79 (Canadian) for a 350-watt lift-bowl design, only in white. I was almost going to compromise on the Artisan series for the same price but glad I looked around.

To Steve Klc, yes, the tilt model is where the bowl is snapped in place on the bottom, and the other one is the lift-type where the bowl snaps on two arms on the side.

Thanks again for all your input.

[FWED]

In the last couple of days I have seen a new mixer and I thought I would revive this thread. The name of the mixer is the "Electrolux Assistant DLX Mixer" ( also known as the Magic Mill DLX 2000 by Electrolux. I have also seen it in the Baker's Catalogue and the Williams Sanoma catalog from time to time. It has two bowls. An eight quart bowl for bread and a six quart for cakes and cookies and whipping. The motor in under the bowl so the entire top is open. The look and concept is very different from most other mixers on the market. Has anyone ever used this mixer and what has been your experience with it?

[clothier]

My Dad ( the bread baker since he retired) bought the viking, and took it back the same week.

Granted, he's 72, and a bit of a stick in the mud as far as change goes, but he said it just didn't work for him as well as the his K.A.

He said it it seemed to him that it felt to light, and not only didn't it mix as fast, but he was afraid to mix a heavier dough in it because it might "dance" accross the counter.

[mamster]

FWED, I've wondered about the Magic Mill, and also about this very expensive mixer made by Bosch, which seems specially geared toward making bread. I've been using an old KA K45, and I know it's going to explode one of these days.

The Bosch is also available in an in-counter model. Now that would be cool. Until it broke.