Favorite places to get the [definitive] New York hot dog

[R Washburn]

"or Papaya Dog (175th st.)" Worst of all the papya places, it was very late and I was starving yet I could not eat more then a bite or two of that horrible dog.

I am pretty sure they are serving the same hot dogs as the other Papaya places. The ones I have had from their seemed identical to Gray's..

[M.X.Hassett]

I am pretty sure they are serving the same hot dogs as the other Papaya places.  The ones I have had from their seemed identical to Gray's..

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It may be the same dog, as has been noted in this thread most papya places use Marathon, but the prep of it is what matters imho. Hell give two people a dry aged ribeye and some will cook it well, others will not. Product is essential, but so is method.

As Holly Moore said

Granted the dogs are from the same source.  Buns might be too.  My experience with Grays - maybe a half dozen visits and not much by native New Yorker standards: the grilled dogs from Gray's are not as glistening, don't have the snap.  The buns are not toasted enough to caramelize.  The finished product is just thrown together.  Papaya King, just the opposite.  A consistently excellent dog

Edit: quote

Edited October 10, 2005 by M.X.Hassett (log)

[R Washburn]

I am pretty sure they are serving the same hot dogs as the other Papaya places.  The ones I have had from their seemed identical to Gray's..

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It may be the same dog, as has been noted in this thread most papya places use Marathon, but the prep of it is what matters imho. Hell give two people a dry aged ribeye and some will cook it well, others will not. Product is essential, but so is method.

I have only been there at lunch time, but there was nothing wrong with them then. I will report back if they are "different" late at night.

I am more curious about the hamburger's they recently added to the menu. A decent burger in the neighborhood would be a major find.

[jgould]

where are a few places, in addition to 2nd av deli, where empire natl (kosher) are served?

where are hebrew natl 'dogs' served in manhattan? &

are they, by definition "kosher" also?

does nathan's make their own?

are vienna beefs, the chicago dog-of-choice(??), served within manhattan?

what brand is considered the "best" to purchase & grill? niman's?

Edited October 10, 2005 by jgould (log)

[John]

Empire National Franks are served at Ben's Best in Rego Park Queens and Tabatchnik's Deli in Union, N.J. as well as 2nd Ave. Deli. I'm sure that they're served elsewhere in Manhattan. Just ask. Maybe the Carnegie?

Hebrew National are indeed kosher and quite common in N.Y. There is a cart somewhere on 6th ave. that serves these dogs grilled.

Nathan's does not make their own. They are made by SMG meats out of Chicago, I believe. For awhile, Marathon made them.

The only place I know of in Manhattan that serves Vienna beef hot dogs is the Shake Shack. Vienna Beef is also available in the food courts at Target, but it is a different and inferior dog.

What brand is best to grill is a matter of opinion. I like Best's, Nathan's, Sabrett, Usinger's, and Boars Head. Empire National and Hebrew National are good too.

[jgould]

Empire National (kosher) are served at 2nd Ave. Deli.

Hebrew National (kosher) and quite common in N.Y. There is a cart somewhere on 6th ave. that serves these dogs grilled.

WHERE ON 6TH? 

Nathan's made by SMG meats out of Chicago, I believe.

in Manhattan, Vienna beef hot dogs at the Shake Shack.

Sabretts @ papaya king & gray's papaya

What brand is best to grill: Best's, Nathan's, Sabrett, Usinger's, Boars Head; Empire & Hebrew National are good too.

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please excuse the abbreviated quoting, & thx very much - much appreciated (SEE QUESTION above)

[BeefCheeks]

Ah, Pastrami King in New Hyde Park? A frequent haunt during my formative years in Great Neck. Yes, very good dogs.

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I'm not sure, but I think the original was on Union Tpke and Queens Blvd, right at the foot of the LIE. And while we're on the subject, does anyone have anything bad or good to say about Ben's franks?

[menton1]

Katz's Deli lower eastside, there is snap and a sort of crisper skin outside and the flavor I like better than Gray's.

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They are good dogs, but its pointless to eat anything else there other than Pastrami and their kasha knishes. You don't schlep down to the LES for hot dogs. The dogs are there basically if you drag a kid with you and they don't want Pastrami.

Now if you are going to go on an adventure for hot dogs.. may I suggest the original Nathan's on Coney Island.

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If you wouldn't schlep to the LES for dogs, why in heaven's name would anyone go another hour to Coney Island? Nathan's hot dogs are ubuquitous now, there are Nathan's everywhere, uptown, New Jersey, even on the Turnpike and Thruway rest stops!

N.B. I think John, the hot dog expert, has indicated that Marathon makes all of these hot dogs; Papaya King, Gray's, Katz's, and Nathan's. I like PK the best because the hot dogs are really served hot! (temperature) as well as a slightly toasted and very warm bun.

[jgould]

N.B. I think John, the hot dog expert, has indicated that Marathon makes all of these hot dogs; Papaya King, Gray's, Katz's, and Nathan's.  I like PK the best because the hot dogs are really served hot! (temperature) as well as a slightly toasted and very warm bun.

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is sabrett's the same as marathon?

Edited October 10, 2005 by jgould (log)

[M.X.Hassett]

Sabrett® is a registered trademark owned by Marathon Enterprises, Inc., a major regional supplier to the food service industry with an enviable reputation for quality and service dating back to 1916. Our frankfurters are sold nationally under the Sabrett® label.

http://www.sabrett.com/about.cfm

[Jason Perlow]

Marathon, based in East Rutherford, NJ, is a commercial manufacturer of sausage products. They contract manufacture hot dogs for a number of companies in a number of brand names. Sabrett is what they sell as their packaged brand. Its kind of like Anheuser Busch, who sells Budweiser and a number of other beers, but who also makes microbrews for other small beer companies. I am not sure if they market anything under a brand name other than Sabrett, but they also supply "generic" unbranded dogs to delis and hot dog stands and such.

[Jason Perlow]

Katz's Deli lower eastside, there is snap and a sort of crisper skin outside and the flavor I like better than Gray's.

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They are good dogs, but its pointless to eat anything else there other than Pastrami and their kasha knishes. You don't schlep down to the LES for hot dogs. The dogs are there basically if you drag a kid with you and they don't want Pastrami.

Now if you are going to go on an adventure for hot dogs.. may I suggest the original Nathan's on Coney Island.

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If you wouldn't schlep to the LES for dogs, why in heaven's name would anyone go another hour to Coney Island? Nathan's hot dogs are ubuquitous now, there are Nathan's everywhere, uptown, New Jersey, even on the Turnpike and Thruway rest stops!

If you don't understand why you wouldn't go to the original Nathans location for hot dogs, then you are not a hot dog enthusiast. There is a -very- big difference in the hot dog you recieve at the original location than one at any Riese's food court at the mall or at a Turnpike rest stop. It has to do with the care taken in the grilling of the dog and how they fry their french fries there.

Its kind of like asking Muslims why they make a pilgrimage to Mecca when they can just go down to their local Mosque. Its all about making the journey.

[M.X.Hassett]

I recall hearing that the Nathan's dogs sold at some franchises and in g.stores are different than the one sold at the CI location and some of the tristate franchises.

[Jason Perlow]

I recall hearing that the Nathan's dogs sold at some franchises and in g.stores are different than the one sold at the CI location and some of the tristate franchises.

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I heard this as well, but I was never able to verify it. There is no question however that the CI Nathans and some of the original franchises (like the one in Yonkers, which I think is actually still owned by the parent company) are vastly superior to many of the mall stands, etc.

As for the grocery store stuff, I always look for the natural casing Nathans dogs. The skinless stuff doesn't compare.

If you are relatively new to the site, check out this Supermarket Hot Dog shootout we did a few summers back:

Your Favorite Brand of Hot Dogs

[John]

I believe Marathon bought out Sabrett or bought out another company that bought out Sabrett. The original Sabrett plant was located at Cole and Henderson streets in Jersey City, N.J. Contrary to what many believe, Sabrett is a N.J. dog, even though they are produced at the Stahl Meyer factory in the Bronx. Marathon used to make a brand called House o Weenies. Now they concentrate on Sabrett and Sabrett's beef and pork dog wich is used at the Windmill, Callahan's, and Hot Grill in Jersey.

Nathan's natural casing dogs are the ones that are served at Coney Island and some of the better Nathan's locations, which include at least one on the Turnpike and the one at the Menlo Park Mall. They have a special at Menlo; 3 dogs for $3.33. This is good Fri, Sat, Sun, and Monday's. At these 2 locations, the dogs are prepared the right way.

You have to be real careful with Nathan's. Some use the skinless version. Some don't grill them on a griddle, but rather on the roller grill. And the 2 that use to be in my town used the right dog (with casing) and cooked them on the griddle, but they were always undercooked. I haven't enjoyed a Nathan's dog away from home until I discovered the 2 above mentioned locations. When done right, Nathan's is as good an all beef dog as there is.

[John]

Empire National (kosher) are served at 2nd Ave. Deli.

Hebrew National (kosher) and quite common in N.Y. There is a cart somewhere on 6th ave. that serves these dogs grilled.

WHERE ON 6TH?  

Nathan's made by SMG meats out of Chicago, I believe.

in Manhattan, Vienna beef hot dogs at the Shake Shack.

Sabretts @ papaya king & gray's papaya

What brand is best to grill: Best's, Nathan's, Sabrett, Usinger's, Boars Head; Empire & Hebrew National are good too.

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please excuse the abbreviated quoting, & thx very much - much appreciated (SEE QUESTION above)

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I think the location is 49th and 6th.

[menton1]

John, I'm confused. According to the NathansFamous website, all "Nathan's" use exactly the same hotdog. I have never seen them roller-cooked in NY or NJ, but they do have a lot of locations, although all the ones I've patronized are griddle-cooked. I also haven't noticed any difference in the several Nathan's I've been to in NJ.

The days when Coney Island was special are over. I remember the days of clams on the half-shell, real homemade clam chowder with whole clams in it, and no hamburgers!

P.S. The Nathan's in Yonkers (I think that's Corporate owned) on Central Ave still has, next to the sauerkraut, a help-yourself tray of grilled onions that are the best ever. I really pile those on when I'm there! I've never seen those at any other Nathan's!

[John]

When Nathan's website says that all their locations use the same hot dog, they mean the same recipe hot dog. But there is skinless and natural casing. And I've seen at least 2 or 3 Nathan's use the skinless version on a roller grill. One such location was in Rahway. It has since gone out of business. Other Nathan's such as the 2 in my town did use the natural casing dogs and griddle cooked them, but not for a sufficient time. One was in a Home Depot.

[jgould]

so, at the end of the day; one should look for 'dogs' in natural casings, & made by sabretts, which seems to be the only processor. much like the computer manufacturers, pretty much all made by 1-2 companies in china

[juuceman]

so, at the end of the day; one should look for 'dogs' in natural casings, & made by sabretts, which seems to be the only processor. much like the computer manufacturers, pretty much all made by 1-2 companies in china 

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not really.. depends on whether you prefer an all beef, or a beef and pork mix as well as what type of casing you prefer, and how you prefer to cook it..

John has written a great treatise on the topic, i believe it may be found on the above link, or search for Sabrett and/or marathon on Chowhound..

[Jason Perlow]

Actually, I find the Boars Head dog with natural casing to be on par or even superior to the Sabrett in many respects.

[John]

so, at the end of the day; one should look for 'dogs' in natural casings, & made by sabretts, which seems to be the only processor. much like the computer manufacturers, pretty much all made by 1-2 companies in china 

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Sabrett is far from the only processor or maker of natural casing hot dogs. Nathan's natural casing dogs are no longer made by Sabrett, and are a good alternative. I like both the all beef and beef/pork mix; preferably with casings. If you are talking about all beef dogs, there are many good ones available besides Sabrett. It all depends on your taste and what level of spicing you prefer. Boars Head, as Jason noted, is an excellent natural casing all beef dog that is available nationwide or pretty close. It also has perhaps the biggest snap from the tight casing. Other excellent beef dogs with casing besides Nathan's, Sabrett, and Boars Head are Best's (available only at the factory and restaurants that serve them), Usinger's, Lobel's, Niman Ranch, Empire National, and Hebrew National. For the last 2 kosher dogs, you have to go to certain places that sell them with collagen casings. These brands are usually available in the skinless versions.

[M.X.Hassett]

I like the Boars Head also, does anyone know of any places in NYC that have a good Boar dog.

[Jason Perlow]

I've never seen the Boars Heads in use at actual hot dog places. I generally just see them in cryopack in the deli section of supermarkets.

[M.X.Hassett]

I thought that I have seen a couple of carts in the city with BH umbrellas over the last few years, I can not recall where though.