Per Se

[gmi3804]

Turning half the tables means, simply, that any reservation before time X (say, 6:30) will have another reservation behind it (after, say, 9:30). The tables booked after time X can't accommodate a second sitting -- an 8:00 table would de facto be a single sitting...

Thanks for a fascinating post, FG!

Which is the other restaurant in NYC which you consider has Michelin 3-star quality?

And what is "ADNY"?

[Bux]

And what is "ADNY"?

Actually it's more often referred to as AD/NY, Alain Ducasse/New York. Ducasse's restaurant in Paris is referred to as AD/PA for Alain Ducasse/Plaza Athenee.

[Bux]

I think -- though I may be wrong -- that most anybody who has dined around France a bit will testify that the single sitting is either the most significant or one of the most significant factors differentiating Michelin three-star restaurants from the best restaurants in New York. It changes the whole feel and dynamic of the place. There's a whole life-cycle to the evening that you experience in a single-sitting restaurant that just doesn't occur when tables are being turned.

Even if it's the least significant factor, it's still very significant. I sometimes think dining is a concept that's not fully appreciated in the US. We'll tell a great chef we want the sauce on the side or a change of garnish for a dish whose ingredients is part of a complex creative work. Some Americans really love ordering the staff around, but we don't even think of protesting when we're told to arrive at a certain hour as if it was to mess in the army. There's no consideration for the unexpected in one's day, the inability to hail a cab or anything. Then we come to the factors that have been discussed--the odd hours from which one is forced to choose and the knowledge that your time is limited. Forget the star ratings for a minute, there are many members who don't get that the change in star levels should mean anything but better food. Dining at a two star restaurant in Paris is likely to be a more gracious and relaxing experience than at a four star in Manhattan.

The one other fact that's barely been touched on here is that size matters as well. There's a difference in the food when you're serving three hundred people a night and when you're serving sixty. I'll be the first one to defend the premise that a great kitchen can served a thousand covers better than a medicore one can serve fifty, but give that same great kitchen a smaller number of diners and they can do even better.

[slkinsey]

The one other fact that's barely been touched on here is that size matters as well. There's a difference in the food when you're serving three hundred people a night and when you're serving sixty. I'll be the first one to defend the premise that a great kitchen can served a thousand covers better than a medicore one can serve fifty, but give that same great kitchen a smaller number of diners and they can do even better.

Right... But of course if you give that restaurant half the customers, they are going to have to double their prices. This is one of the reasons most of the aforementioned three star single seating restaurants aren't making any money.

[robyn]

I think -- though I may be wrong -- that most anybody who has dined around France a bit will testify that the single sitting is either the most significant or one of the most significant factors differentiating Michelin three-star restaurants from the best restaurants in New York. It changes the whole feel and dynamic of the place. There's a whole life-cycle to the evening that you experience in a single-sitting restaurant that just doesn't occur when tables are being turned.

I agree with everything you said 100%. I am not a VIP (except to the extent that anyone dropping over $500 at a fancy restaurant is - or should be - a VIP). But I'm not going to eat at a time I don't want to eat just to say that I've been to a particular restaurant. I am at a stage of life where I don't do anything at a time I don't care to do things except for surgery and the occasional emergency plane trip.

And I am getting to the point where I don't want to spend really big bucks on a restaurant unless there's a single seating - or an explicit or tacit acknowledgement that if I have a reservation at 7:30 or 8 - I'm not going to get the bum's rush so someone can get seated at 9:30 or 10. In addition to 3 stars in France and ADNY - I've only experienced single seating by design in London and a couple of other restaurants in the US (The Dining Room at the Ritz Carlton in Buckhead and the Bizcaya Grill at the Ritz Carlton in Miami). We're going out of town tomorrow and have reservations at a place called Casa Tua in Miami. I understand that it is a single seating restaurant too.

I am currently planning the dining for our trip to London in May. Lots of people have recommended Gordon Ramsey - but it has an explicit policy that it reserves the right to get you in and out in 2 hours. Now I am a person who likes an apertif before dinner - and I like to linger over dessert and drinks after. Even if I'm only eating 3 or 4 courses - not 13 or 14 - it should take about 3 hours. I don't think I want to spend over $500 for a 2 hour dining experience. I'd rather drop the $500 at Neiman Marcus . Robyn

[bloviatrix]

While going through my ever-expanding pile of periodicals, I came across this article about Keller and Tihany's teamwork in designing Per Se. Although not the same is seeing the restuarant and eating the food, this should tide you over just a little bit.

Unfortunately, they don't have all the same photos as the hard copy. One of the great design details is a lamp designed with three international symbols for laundry care. It's classic.

[plpcolumbia]

3 part question:

1) Would Per Se be classified as "French" or as an "American" restaurant?

2) Would those who have already eaten there consider Per Se to be operating at a "4 star level" (NY Times definition - whatever that is)?

3) Does Per Se have a shot at becoming the first "4 star American restaurant" in New York City?

[rich]

3 part question:

1) Would Per Se be classified as "French" or as an "American" restaurant?

2) Would those who have already eaten there consider Per Se to be operating at a "4 star level" (NY Times definition - whatever that is)?

3) Does Per Se have a shot at becoming the first "4 star American restaurant" in New York City?

1. Both

2. Yes

3. Yes, if you consider it more American than French

[Fat Guy]

I had a 5:30 reservation on a Thursday and the "even exchange" concept was presented to me as though I had to take another 5:30 reservation on a Thursday. That worked fine for me, but I hope those who had 7:30pm reservations on a Saturday were given first crack at other 7:30pm reservations on a Saturday. Not that I'm clear on the math here, because it seems they're somehow going to manage to rebook two months of reservations into one month without turning tables, but I'm sure there's an explanation.

[AES]

Hmmm, excellent point. Did anyone on here have a date earlier than May 20th?

The woman yesterday did say they would reopen mid-May (can't recall if she said the 20th or not) and the "first few weeks" were already booked, so I should suggest June dates.

I might just call on May 1 and see if I can get a dinner that night.....

[adrober]

In my brief stint as a fine diner (with Charlie Trotters, Seegers and now Per Se under my belt) I have reached the following conclusion about fine dining. It goes like this: fine dining is like death.

Death is quiet. So is fine dining. Death is peaceful. So is fine dining. Death is infinite. So--it frequently seems--is fine dining.

Forgive my over-extended metaphor, but the reason so many people declare a fine dining experience to be "spiritual" is that it creates a sense of order: it says, with its confluence of waiters and busboys and hosts and hostesses, that there is a system out there, an ordered system, and that you are part of it. You are the star of it. We are here to make you well.

A good restaurant, then, creates this spiritual aura without alienating their customers. We want that sense of Divine inspiration without the formality of a temple. My dismay at Charlie Trotters version of fine dining is that it was too much a self-conscious religious experience. Charlie Trotter prostletizes. Thomas Kellar--I can say after tonight's Per Se dinner--offers forth. If you want to call it religious, go ahead, but that's not the point. Thomas Kellar isn't prostletizing, he is sharing.

I went tonight to Per Se with my parents. This, I worried, would be a dangerous formula. My mom likes to deconstruct a dish pre-service, ordering everything on the side; my dad fears any food that doesn't start and end with "steak and potatoes."

My fears were unfounded. But first, the arrival.

In case you're not aware, Per Se is located in the Time Warner center at Columbus Circle:

Apparently there are secret elevators that take your right to the restaurant, but we went the pedestrian way with the riffraff. Making our way up to the fourth floor, my mom declared: "I don't get this place. It's just a shopping mall."

"A billion dollar shopping mall," I offered, to no avail.

Finally, on the fourth floor, we approached the mighty blue door of Per Se.

Would I be wrong to point out the religious implications of a fierce intimidating door separating laymen from Nirvana? And how ironic that the door itself doesn't open: you go in through the glass sliding doors on either side.

Once inside--in case you forgot where you were headed--chrome letters spell out the restaurant's name:

We were greeted by jovial hostesses who rather tactfully asked us if we had a reservation. It became apparent why when a couple in shorts and baseball caps staggered in after us and asked if they had any tables for tonight. Clearly, these hostesses were having to deal regularly with well-meaning mall-goers who figured that Per Se was Time Warner's version of The Cheesecake Factory. "Sorry ma'am," the hostess said kindly to Lady Baseball Cap, "We have nothing available tonight."

Meanwhile, my mother began admiring the floor. I recalled an article that said Thomas Kellar tore up the floor three times until it was perfect. I took a picture for your pleasure:

I also admired the floristry. Everywhere there were beautiful flowers that gave off a lovely aroma:

Mom and I posed for a picture in front of the hostess stand:

Then we were taken to our table.

Here's where our night hit its first roadbump. The table was on the second tier, in a corner, by the bus station. It felt like the worst table in the house and probably was. I was facing a wall and mom and dad were facing the window, but not gladly. We were pretty far away.

"Should I say something?" asked mom.

Dad and I nodded. She called over a waiter.

"You know," said my mother, with her coquettish charm, "We're really not happy with this table. Would it be possible to sit near a window?"

I was pretty sure they would apologize and refuse. But I was wrong. We were quickly moved to a window table, with a gorgeous view of Columbus Circle and the Southwest tip of Central Park.

"Thank you so much," said my mother.

We began to admire the flowers on the table.

"These are beautiful," said mom, "I've never seen flowers this pretty that weren't fake."

We began by ordering cocktails. I went with the waiter-recommended champagne cocktail with orange bitters:

Mom ordered a cosmo and sent it back because it was too watery.

Dad was contented with a giant glass of gin and tonic.

Mom examined the wine list:

She marveled over its reasonableness.

"I can't believe how cheap some of these wines are," she declared.

We went with a 2002 Napa Valley Neyers Chardonnay which proved tasty and wildly efficient: it lasted quite fully for the whole meal.

Here I am reading the menu as the sun goes down:

The waiter returned and listened amused as we all ordered the same thing: Chef's Tasting Menu with Foie Gras for the second course (the only choice we had to make).

Mom and Dad posed for a picture:

After which our not-on-the-menu appetizers arrived: the French Laundry famous mini-ice-cream-cones with salmon tartare:

The insides were filled with creme fraich, and taken as a whole they were a textural and flavorful delight.

Next up was the "Oysters and Pearls" (the waiter gave me the menu so I can report accurately on each dish's contents): "Sabayon" of Pearl Tapioca with Island Creek Oysters and Iranian Ossetra Caviar.

This was a really nice dish. Everything worked well to complement everything else (a recurrent theme throughout the night). The "sabayon" tied everything together.

Next, was the "Peach Melba" / Moulard Duck "Foie Gras Au Torchon" Frog Hollow Farms Peach Jelly, Pickled White Peaches, Marinated Red Onion, "Melba Toast" and Crispy Carolina Rice:

This was such pretty presentation and all the flavors carried. I really liked the combination of peach and foie gras, another testament to liver's secret inner-candy life. The Melba toasts ran out and they were quickly replenished.

After which (or before which? I don't remember) we were served a lovely bread roll with two types of butter:

"Those look amazing," said my mother. "I don't normally eat bread, but here it goes."

I won't lie: she was a little disappointed, but mostly because it wasn't warm. Otherwise she--plus dad and I--scarfed them right up.

Next up was: Filet of Atlantic Halibut Cooked "A La Plancha." Extra Virgin Olive Oil Braised Fingerling Potatoes, Roasted Spring Garlic and Arugala Pudding:

This most reminded me of Charlie Trotter's. Very elegant, very professional, but almost drab in its perfection. This one didn't really do it for me.

After which there was the "Noilly Prat": Sweet Butter Poached Maine Lobster "Cuit en Sous Vide." Carmelized Fennel Disc, Crystallized Fennel Chip and Sauce "Noilly Prat":

This was really nice. I declared the lobster to be incredibly tender, my mom declared it to be incredibly tough.

"You're cutting it the wrong way," explained my dad to my mom. She was cutting it vertically instead of horizontally.

"Oh," she replied.

We all chewed gladly.

Then came the Pan Roasted Cavendish Farms Quail: "Puree" of Spring Onions, Apple Wood Smoked Bacon "Lardons" and Wilted Dandelion Greens.

I thought this was exceptional presentation. The sauce on the plate seemed incredibly expert. And the quail had perfectly crisped skin and a ton of flavor. Quite impressive.

After which there was the Elysian Fields Farm "Selle D'Agneau Rotie Entiere": Braised Shoulder, Fava Beans, Golden Chanterelles, Roasted Crosnes and Lamb Jus.

This, our waiter/interpreter explained, was lamb. My mom bit in first and said--quite shockingly: "Needs salt."

"Mom," I declared heatedly, "You can't ask for salt at Per Se! That isn't done!"

Assuming the fault was with my mother and not the lamb, I took a bite and instantly agreed. It needed salt.

Well, a few bites later I realized that there were depth-charges of salt unequally distributed throughout. Was this on purpose? Not sure.

And that was the conclusion of the entrees.

Then the cheese course: "Charolais": "Gelee de Pomme Verte," Satur Farms Red Beets and English Walnut Short Bread:

Here was my big moment. I am a certified cheesephobe, indoctrinated by my dad in the art of cheese hating. My mother has always been slightly more tolerant--sprinkling her salads with feta and bleau. Here at Per Se I took the leap and almost enjoyed my Charolais. The beets surely helped. But I would be a liar if I didn't say it tasted like a foot.

We forced my dad to take a bite and his facial expression was worth its weight in Charolais. He's still trying to get the taste out of his mouth.

That was followed by the Pineapple Sorbet with Braised Pineapple and Coconut Cream:

Refreshing, but not earth-shattering.

Next up was earth-shattering: "Tentation Au Chocolat, Noisette Et Lait"--Milk Chocolate "Cremeux," Hazelnut "Streusel" with Condensed Milk Sorbet and "Sweetened Salty Hazelnuts" and "Pain au Lait" Coulis.

Here was the great equalizer: we all kvelled in unison. Our trilateral "Mmmm"ing disturbed many a table. But it was that good.

We were then inundated with unordered, grudgingly welcomed desserts. The men were presented with yogurt, figs at the bottom:

The women (my mom) received creme brulee:

We found this Matriarchal dessert division to be deeply upsetting.

"I wanted creme brulee," said my dad sadly.

The waiter instantly obliged and all was well.

I felt on the verge of bursting.

And then there was more: "Mignardises."

The macaroons were outrageously good. So were the candies. I felt my insides begin a protest: "NO MORE!"

And then there was more. Chocolates!

A white flag waved from within. I snapped up one chocolate, popped it in my mouth, and called it a night.

And now before my forced conclusion, a brief note on the bathroom.

Per Se has 16 tables plus a large private dining room. There are two one-stall men's rooms and therein lies the problem. I have a tiny alcohol-affected bladder that forces me to the bathroom two to three times per fine dining experience. Tonight, each time I went, there was someone leaving just as I walked in. This gave the restaurant zero time to clean up and, unfortunately, bathroom maintenance became an issue. There were non-flushers (blech!) and the towels ran out. I was none too happy.

But, that aside, Per Se was a great fine dining experience. I agree with those who say it's still getting its leggings--we had a waiter present a course and forget his lines halfway through the presentation of what he was serving--but that will come in good time.

For my own purposes, I lump Per Se in with the other fine dining Deathstaurants. It's an experience--like seeing God--but I'm not ready to see God. One day, sure, but for now I'll stick to youthful exuberance. Who's up for fondue?

[mongo_jones]

In my brief stint as a fine diner (with Charlie Trotters, Seegers and now Per Se under my belt) I have reached the following conclusion about fine dining. It goes like this: fine dining is like death.

Death is quiet. So is fine dining. Death is peaceful. So is fine dining. Death is infinite. So--it frequently seems--is fine dining.

death can also be extremely painful and involve involuntary voiding of the bowels and bladder.

[Fat Guy]

Thanks very much for the report and the photos!

Do you happen to know how mom and dad got the reservation?

[Pan]

A.D., it was great to vicariously experience your dinner at Per Se, as I have a very strong feeling that I'll probably never experience it in person.

[Jason Perlow]

In my brief stint as a fine diner (with Charlie Trotters, Seegers and now Per Se under my belt) I have reached the following conclusion about fine dining.  It goes like this: fine dining is like death.

Death is quiet.  So is fine dining.  Death is peaceful.  So is fine dining.  Death is infinite.  So--it frequently seems--is fine dining.

death can also be extremely painful and involve involuntary voiding of the bowels and bladder.

So can a night after eating a particularly powerful Vindaloo.

[shelly59]

Thank you so much for that wonderful review, adrober. You told me everything I needed to know about Per Se. Much appreciated.

[slkinsey]

Now that Per Se is up and running, I have created a separate thread for discussion relating to the fire, including PR, reopening, rescheduling, and any other related discussion.

This thread will remain as the main thread for reviews and discussions about the food at Per Se.

[SG-]

what _do_ pomelo cells taste like?

Like a large grapefruit, but more floral and sweet with a slight hint of bitterness.

[dccd]

Now that Per Se is up and running, I have created a separate thread for discussion relating to the fire, including PR, reopening, rescheduling, and any other related discussion.

This thread will remain as the main thread for reviews and discussions about the food at Per Se.

Thank you SO much ... I was becoming so weary of everyone having reservations and "PR" concerns ... "When did they call you? Why didn't they call me? Oh they called me, when? How did YOU get a reservation and I didn't? If this were Danny..." Ugh...

I am so happy this place can be associated with food again!

Thank you.

[Big E]

My fiance and I had dinner last night at Per Se and I must say it was one of the best meals we've ever had. Simply spectacular. I'd give the full food report myself, but I think adrober has already given a better report than I could give, so I'm just going to give a personal response to his report.

Atmosphere: I thought this was a very comfortable atmosphere for such a high-end restaurant. It wasn't even close to "death". I too often dislike fine dining atmospheres, but I thought this was an exception to the rule. I was more comfortable at Per Se than I was at Bouley. The staff was extremely professional yet still very warm to the guests and while I think they are still working some things out with the service it was overall an excellent experience. The room itself is beautiful but not overdone. We sat on the first level which I think is superior to the raised second level (3 or 4 stairs up?).

Food: The chef's tasting menu which I had was identical to the menu served to adrober except that the lamb course was a chop rather than slices of braised shoulder and there was a different sorbet course (which was very refreshing but I can't recall the exact flavor right now). My fiance had the vegetarian tasting menu which she loved and gave us the ability taste a lot of different dishes that we otherwise would have missed. I thought it was a great way to do dinner for two. However, I will say that I think the chef's tasting is significantly better than the vegetarian menu. Overall, the quality of the food was just incredible and I really enjoyed everything on the menu. Favorites of mine were the oysters and caviar, the foie gras and the lobster. Also, I preferred the vegetarian menu dessert course to my own.

One last thing, we asked to take a tour of the kitchen after dinner which was amazing. The multiple kitchens are really impressive (I believe they said 8,000 sq. feet of kitchen space) and it was a great to see them in use during service.

Edited May 3, 2004 by Big E (log)

[Jinmyo]

Thanks, Big E. You should post a bt more frequently.

[robyn]

In my brief stint as a fine diner (with Charlie Trotters, Seegers and now Per Se under my belt) I have reached the following conclusion about fine dining.  It goes like this: fine dining is like death.

Death is quiet.  So is fine dining.  Death is peaceful.  So is fine dining.  Death is infinite.  So--it frequently seems--is fine dining...

I don't know whether you're too young - or too serious - or both!

Next time - leave the camera home. Maybe Mom and Dad too . Don't think about death. You'll have plenty of time for that later in life. And just enjoy. Have too much champagne. Too much rich food. Too much chocolate. Laugh. Or at least giggle.

By the way - when I look at all these pictures of food - I think about sex. Would anyone have fun with sex if they spent the whole time taking somewhat clinical pictures of it (as opposed to the pictures you'd never share in public )? You know - I bought a digital camera a while back - but - whenever I'm having a good time - even if I remember to bring the camera - I never remember to take pictures.

If you can't avoid thinking about death - think about Woody Allen's kind of death - as in Love and Death. It's more amusing than real death (which - at my age - is unfortunately what I have to deal with more and more). My father-in-law is in a nursing home here - and he was just diagnosed with pretty bad cancer. That's the bad news. The good news is he doesn't have to worry about things like gaining weight or his cholesterol anymore. So we're taking him to the best restaurants available here (such as they are) - and encouraging him to eat to his heart's content (he was always kind of a Golden Corral person before we brought him down here to live near us). Last night he had shrimp with pasta in a red pepper cream sauce. He ate every bit of the full portion with great gusto. And my husband and I smiled watching him eat. Don't wait until you're 84 and dying to enjoy. That's not a good way to go through life. Sorry to sound heavy and philosophical. Had a bad week. Robyn

[robyn]

P.S. The restaurant we ate at last night - Bistro Aix - was the featured "Saturday night" restaurant in the 36 Hours Jacksonville article in the NYT on Friday. It's a favorite of ours - and I'm glad to see that it finally made the "big time". Forgive this shameless plug for the restaurant . Robyn

[tissue]

Don't wait until you're 84 and dying to enjoy. That's not a good way to go through life.

I agree!

[Fat Guy]

I have a different perspective on the matter. Anybody -- well, pretty much anybody -- can have sex pretty much anywhere. Whereas only 64 people a night can eat at Per Se, and they have to come to New York to do it.

I was just hearing today about a group of cooks at a restaurant in Quebec, all gathered 'round their computer screen looking at adrober's photos of the food at Per Se. There are people all over the world who are dying to see photos of and read everything they can about the food at Per Se, and this is where they're coming to do that. So I have to thank adrober, on behalf of the site, for increasing our relevance and providing this service to so many visually hungry people.