Wine recommendations

[docsconz]

It has been discussed at length the effect Robert Parker has had on wine prices and wine buyers, and the Wine Spectator's practices and influence have been discussed in another recent thread. There are a lot of people offering wine advice via publication, online or through sales. I have personally developed an eclectic approach to buying and collecting wines. Ideally, I would like to have tried them first - store tastings or wine dinners are good sources for commercially available wines. Unfortunately, however, some of the more interesting and often more expensive wines are not available that way. For wines that I generally enjoy and collect, I will usually purchase at least a few bottles either from a mailing list offering or from a reliable retailer. For wines that I am not particularly familiar with, I will occassionally take a flier and purchase some on the recommendation of a source I have come to find reliably shares my taste (yes, at times it does include RP - though not for all wines).

This particular forum with the new approach to Tasting Notes should become an interesting source for recommendations, but that will probably take time to synchronize palates to know which recommendations match tastes.

Anyhow, how do you purchase wine?

[Bill Klapp]

Dear docsconz: Many approaches are possible, and in a perfect world, with far fewer wines, you would merely taste through them. Last time I checked, however, there were between 10,000-15,000 wines competing for your attention. It seems to me that the single most important factor is developing a track record with someone whose palate you can use as a baseline. Being a lawyer, in order to teach myself about wine in the first place and later, as a hobby, I created a spreadsheet which tracks the periodic evaluations of Robert Parker, Steve Tanzer, the Wine Spectator and Gambero Rosso (Italian wines only) for about 2,000 wines. (I once had 10,000 wines on the spreadsheet, but as I learned what I liked and what was truly good, whether I liked it or not, I winnowed down the list.) I also read the tasting notes of those sources. Over time, I was able to make sustainable generalizations about each of the sources (for instance, I find Tanzer to be the most conservative with the fewest blind spots, Parker likes huge, fruity wines but has blind spots for more subtle and difficult wines such as red burgundy and Brunello, WS is a team rather than a person, with inconsistent quality of evaluation, and GR often rewards effort rather than absolute quality, to name a few). Ultimately, it does not matter if you hate EVERY wine Parker praises, as long as he is sufficiently consistent in his views to allow you to sustain your dislikes. Certainly, if you develop a taste for rare and hard-to-find wines, such publications are essential to allow you to get a jump on the pack that will be hot on the trail of those wines. Beyond that, it is largely a matter of tasting wines and sorting out your favorites, with one important caveat: I know few people whose palates do not develop over time, so that the cheap, fruity wine that pleases you today may seem flat and one-dimensional five years from now after you have sampled a much better example of the same wine or a different wine which suits you better. And, of course, the immutable law of wine collecting is that the more complex wines you grow to appreciate are almost invariably more expensive!

[Carema]

Never learned to use Excel, but as a wine buyer for a small shop I am lucky to taste about a hundred different wines a week (sometime more sometimes less). I have a good palate memory however and this helps me. I have customers who only go by Parker and Spectator scores, and then we have customers who see the light a bit differently- they learn to develop flavor profiles for themselves (I like acid/I do not like acid, I like red fruits/I like deep brooding black fruit etc...) Buying wine can be an incredible crap shoot (my maderized bottle of 1995 Araujo taught me that, a 98 point wine according to Parker) luckily it was free (the bottle I mean). I do think that developing a trusting long-term relationship with a wine merchant who has integrity and is intersted in your happiness and enjoyment, and not deals is an essential tool for wine buying. The wine industry is full of people who only see dollar signs in the skies at night (not stars). Small is good. Find an honest seller with a good palate. That is my, albeit prejudiced, advice.

[Bill Klapp]

Fair point, Carema, but with one quibble: there are some retailers out there who try to shape customer tastes based upon what they have, not necessarily what is good. But I think my basic point still applies: find one or more reference-point palates you can trust. It need not be Parker or Tanzer.

[Carema]

Point taken Mr Klapp. It is always in the best interest of the customer to have as varied of a store as possible. But in the case of "I need a wine from Tasmania for a tasting group" I have to send them along to someone else. Besides to some, something like Savenierres is an austere, apple juice night mare that reeks of hibiscus. to others it is the nectar of God. So you make sure that is not the only Chenin in stock!!!!

[docsconz]

I agree that the best wine buying strategy is developing a relationship and working with reputable merchants with palates that you understood and even better, those who understand your palate. The latter is harder to find. Because I'm interested in a number of different harder to find wines, I've tried with generally good fortune to cultivate several sources, two relatively local and two from a distance.

I guess the other part of my question that may not have been explicit enough is which, if any, of the nationally and internationally recognized "experts" do you look to for guidance re: the more esoteric or more difficult to find wines? Is there a new Parker developing a reputation and weight in the industry? Bill, I agree with you about Parker. His value is with his consistency. If you can relate your palate to his, he is pretty reliable. If you think a wine of a certain type is an 85 and he thinks it is a 95 and vice versa for a similar style wine, it is a fairly good bet that another RP "95" of the same type wine will still be an "85" to you (if your palate is consistent). Of course, one of the greatest difficulties is having a consistent palate with so many factors such as storage, weather, food, company, mood, etc.

[Michael Laiskonis]

In my experience, perhaps as important as aligning yourself with particular critics or merchants, it can be helpful to pay attention to who is importing the wine (with emphasis, obviously, on old world regions). I, too, tend toward 'adventure', looking for the best of the little known appellations, the young up-and-coming winemakers, and, in general, small-scale producers. Round up your favorite bottles and notice the names on the back... I've fallen out of the habit of reading the guides, though, luckily, I get to taste and discuss a lot at work. In an unfamiliar shop, I know that if I see something new from an Eric Solomon, Peter Weygandt, Christopher Canaan, Fran Kysela, etc., it may be worth a try. I tend to side with the little guys, who know the wines and the region, and, including the few of the above that I've met, are serious and passionate about what they do. If I remember correctly, the Advocate usually drops the name of the importer... perhaps you will notice your own patterns with regard to scoring.

[docsconz]

In my experience, perhaps as important as aligning yourself with particular critics or merchants, it can be helpful to pay attention to who is importing the wine (with emphasis, obviously, on old world regions). I, too, tend toward 'adventure', looking for the best of the little known appellations, the young up-and-coming winemakers, and, in general, small-scale producers. Round up your favorite bottles and notice the names on the back... I've fallen out of the habit of reading the guides, though, luckily, I get to taste and discuss a lot at work. In an unfamiliar shop, I know that if I see something new from an Eric Solomon, Peter Weygandt, Christopher Canaan, Fran Kysela, etc., it may be worth a try. I tend to side with the little guys, who know the wines and the region, and, including the few of the above that I've met, are serious and passionate about what they do. If I remember correctly, the Advocate usually drops the name of the importer... perhaps you will notice your own patterns with regard to scoring.

Good points and good advice.

[ErinB]

docsconz, What mailing lists do you use?

[docsconz]

Kistler and Pahlmeyer

[rich]

I always believed there was only one guaranteed method:

Try a bottle.

If you like it, buy more.

[Florida Jim]

Anyhow, how do you purchase wine?

I buy producers.

I don't mean to oversimplify but I have tasted enough good wine to know who does the job on a consistent basis.

I do not read the reviewers you mention, although I do read Claude Kolm and Allen Meadows. When I do, I search for reviews of wines made by the producers I like.

My cellar is sufficiently full that I do not need to buy much. When I do, I buy porducers - period.

Best, Jim