THE BEST: Fries

[dimitri steinberg]

Some of the best fries in the City are at Cite / Cite Grill. It is a huge portion and they are delicious.

[alacarte]

Too bad there isn't a sane way to gather all the frites together for a tasting. They'd be cold 'n soggy.

otherwise, I'd be in for a frite-tasting, for sure!

[danger_doug]

Sorry, guys-- Nathan's Coney Island! Inconsistent as hell, but when they're done right, f'in brilliant. Plus, they have the fork. Outside of that, Chat 'n' Chew has some pretty excellent Sweet Potato fries...

[Bux]

Jubilee, a little French restaurant in the fifties near 1st Avenue makes great fries. I've not been tempted to order anything but their mussels and frites. You could get mussels and salad if you're on a no carb diet, but that's not the point of this thread, is it?

I had incredible fries at Blue Smoke, but on a return visit, they were just sort of okay.

Balthazar has been pretty consistent and very good.

I had good fries in a place one stop into Queens on the 7 train. Steak frites at place called Tournesol.

[elyse]

Too bad there isn't a sane way to gather all the frites together for a tasting. They'd be cold 'n soggy.

otherwise, I'd be in for a frite-tasting, for sure!

I'm with you.

[SobaAddict70]

Oh, don't get me wrong.

PF's frites ARE quite good, but I'd be interested to know what's the lead time in between frying cycles. I mean, the frites aren't exactly fresh....but on the other hand, they're pretty good imo. I'd say about a 7 to 7.5 on a scale of 1 to 10. The topping sauces are another story though.

And FG, your description is exactly that.

Not sure when I'll get in that neighborhood again, but probably soon.

Soba

[Jason Perlow]

I had the French Fries at Peter Luger today for the first time (as we almost always opt for the German Potatoes or occassionally baked), and I must say, they are damnned good.

[Blondie]

Oh, don't get me wrong.

PF's frites ARE quite good, but I'd be interested to know what's the lead time in between frying cycles.  I mean, the frites aren't exactly fresh....

The things I do for you guys

A few more details I gathered last night. They are fried at the same temperature both times. The first time for 5 minutes where they stay quite light in color. Then into the refrigerator before frying the second time. I'm not sure how long they're held in the fridge, but I wouldn't call them not "fresh" because of it. There's almost no lag between the frites leaving the oil after the second frying before they're in your hands. Fresher than you'd get anywhere, I'd say.

The place is tiny, but you can sit in the back, by the sacks of potatoes, on an old church pew. Rustic wood plank tables have vertical drillings to hold the paper cones.

I think the nominal hours are 11am-1am, but they were open later on Friday night.

Pommes Frites

[Holly Moore]

A few more details I gathered last night. They are fried at the same temperature both times. The first time for 5 minutes where they stay quite light in color. Then into the refrigerator before frying the second time. I'm not sure how long they're held in the fridge, but I wouldn't call them not "fresh" because of it. There's almost no lag between the frites leaving the oil after the second frying before they're in your hands. Fresher than you'd get anywhere, I'd say.

I'm surprised as the single temperature for twice frying Typically the fries are fried the first time at 325 F or so only until they become limp and just start to crisp on the outside. The potato is mostly cooked, but little or no color. Cooking the first time at the finishing temp of 375 F would undercook the potato lest they become too brown in the first cooking.

Immediately prior to service the fries are finished off to a crispy golden crust, just one portion at a time, at 375 F. The single portion at a time is to minimize the drop in the shortening temperature when fries hit oil. And yes, serve immediately.

Today, Loie bravely attempted pomme frites out of doors, at the Rittenhouse Row Festival on Philadlephia's Walnut Street. Fairly good, but not crisp enough. Because of the long lines they were putting both baskets in the fryer at a time for the second cooking. Fries were not as crisp as they could have been.

However one of the sauces was whole grain Dijon mustard. Gave it a try. Quite good. Thanks for the heads-up, whoever it was who offered it.

Edited May 10, 2003 by Holly Moore (log)

[Blondie]

Holly, I was surprised too, but that's what I was told. They're good enough that I'll be over there again very soon. Once I go back to the boondocks, no frites for me.

Some of the worst fries in New York are a few blocks south on Second Avenue at A Salt & Battery, the faux chip shop. Soggy fries, the fish was past its prime and the service was obnoxious. A must to avoid.

[Fat Guy]

That process sounds more like reheating than twice-frying, since the two different temperatures (and sometimes even two different oil formulations) is the whole point. But I'm telling you with as much certainty as an eyewitness can muster (i.e., I could be wrong as eyewitnesses often are, but I believe I'm right), I have seen them go directly from raw to fryer to customer. Perhaps it's a question of how busy they are, perhaps the procedure has changed in the past year, perhaps it depends on who is making the fries, but they have this machine that cranks out fresh fries from whole potatoes (which, by the way, I dislike because it doesn't get the potato properly aligned and therefore cuts too many short stubby fries across the potato) and I've seen those go right from the cutter, into a big square plastic tub, over to the fryer, out of the fryer maybe 6 minutes later, into a metal bowl where they're salted, and served in paper cones.

[Blondie]

I'm just repeating what I was told by a woman who works there. It was clear the fries I saw going into the oil were not raw. My experience is limited to two nights in the last week, very late. One night it was busy, one not.

The waffle-cut fries at Crif's Dogs on St. Mark's are pretty good too

[tommy]

to add more potato to the oil, Pommes Frites was featured today on a Food TV program (the one with that big tall guy Gordon). the owner stated that they are fried twice, the second time at a higher temp.

[Felonius]

I'll cast my best fries vote for Les Halles.

I like the fries at Tartine quite a bit too.

[Fat Guy]

to add more potato to the oil

Groan.

[mjc]

Stopped by Pomme Frites on Sunday afternoon and sat for a long time watching them make the frites. We never saw them fry the potatoes more than once, but the ones that came from the back did look like they may have been fried very very briefly or perhaps just coated in oil. Overall we thought that these frites were nothing special and not very crispy, though the place is incredibly popular.

[Suzanne F]

To add another venue: as I recall, Markt had pretty good frites (Belgian) to go with good moules and good steak tartare. But I haven't been there in quite a while.

Les Halles (downtown) is very good; and I have to agree that while Nathan's at Coney Island is inconsistent, when they are good they are very, very good. Never crisp throughout the whole portion, but they taste good.

[bloviatrix]

Some years ago I undertook a tasting of fries as every stadium and arena I went to. Although this was a national tasting, I found that Madison Square Garden has the best fries locally. This may have changed, as I don't know if the Garden still uses the same food-service vendor.

Overall, the best fries are to be found at Pac-Bell in SF.

I ended my quest for the perfect "sports" fry about 3 years ago so this could have changed.

Edited October 7, 2003 by bloviatrix (log)

[eatpie]

The fries at Broom St Bar are definitely not twice cooked but they are potatoey goodness. Not to mention they also have one of the finest burgers in town...if you can deal with the pita.

[dr_memory]

My vote for the best american-style (ie: mcdonalds-size) fries goes, hands down, to the Odeon on West Broadway. They're pretty close to my platonic ideal of the french fry: perfectly consistant crispy/chewy ratio, and not at all oil-sodden (and at >$10/plate, they'd better be).

[wesza]

I became involved with a perfectionest who operated a restaurant that opened featuring Fish and Chips, as well as Alder Wood Broiled Salmon and Chowder. The place becamepopular often serving as much as , 3,000 pounds of French Fries per weekend. This was with self service 75 seats under roof and about 50 on a deck plus take out. It's located near a Marina and Fishing Pier.

We tested many types of Potatoes, finally settling on what's sold in 100 pound bag's as ,"Washington State Spud's" a long Russet potato weighing close to a pound each. We hand peeled the sides, leaving the skin on the ends. After many experiments we settled upon a 3/8th Inch Cut.

After washing and cooling the potatoes in iced water. they were peeled and put into 5 gallon plastic food service containers, with a wedge cut in the sealed lids for drainage. The water added to these containers was also iced with a antioxyitent to keep them while under refrigeration until cooking.

Each container carried about 30 pounds of peeled and cut potatoes. We stacked up about 100/120 containers prior to the weekend rush in the Walk in Reefer.

We had 2 large capacity high BTU gas Fryers set up side by side with Large Frying Baskets. We used a high temperture liquid frying oil with a non foaming additive.

The fryer on the right side, farthest from the pick up window was pre heated to 350 degrees. The other fryer was preheated to 375 degrees. The tempertures were checked daily before begining service for accuracy.

The start of business 5 buckets were removed from refrigeration. Initally 2 were inverted to drain on a stand in close proximity to the the fryer placed over a floor sink built in to drain the fluid.

The Potatoes were placed into the Baskets [3] and allowed to drain. Then the potatoes were placed into the 350 degree hot oil. Shaken often to keep them from sticking and fryed until there was no steam or moisture coming from the hot oil, when this happened the potatoes would begin to turn golden brown. After they browned they would be permitted to drain in the basket, then placed into the 375 degree fryer to brown off and finish prior to being placed to a serving station with infra red heat lamps in a mest container, vented and continuing drainage. Scooped and placed into ,"Pressed Pulp Containers", for pick up. There were ample baskets, and drainage racks able to keep rotation for service.

These Potatoes were so well recieved that it wasn't unusual to have as many as several hundred a la carte orders daily.

The only information i'm not providing was that we kept as many as 400/500 Bags of Potatoes in Ventelated, Temperture Controlled Storage and utilized the same 'BRIX", control formula used by most potato chip manufactures. This must be done as the potatoes fry best with optimum brix. It's been more difficult for them to maintain constant supply sine the potatoes suppliers are over irrigating the potatoe, providing potatoes that have to much moisture and two little taste. Irwin

[Suzanne F]

Wow! Having no experience with such high volume, I found it really fascinating, Irwin. Thank you for the information.

Is the retaurant still going? Can you tell us where it is, so it can go on someone's list of "Must check out?"

[wesza]

Suzanne: The original owner died. I had some friends purchase it and take over. They stayed in Business several years, then wished to sell their operation. I assisted with the sale, as their landlord is a close friend, renegotied the lease. The new owners renamed the place and consolidated the previous business with their own that operates in several other locations. Its located is "Des Moines, WA."

If you were impressed with that volume I should relate the sales from when I worked at, "Nathan's" in Coney Island, NY when it was really busy one summer or the ,"New York Worlds Fair". Irwin

[Holly Moore]

The only information i'm not providing was that we kept as many as 400/500 Bags of Potatoes in Ventelated, Temperture Controlled Storage and utilized the same 'BRIX", control formula used by most potato chip manufactures. This must be done as the potatoes fry best with optimum brix. It's been more difficult for them to maintain constant supply sine the potatoes suppliers are over irrigating the potatoe, providing potatoes that have to much moisture and two little taste.

Great info. Thanks.

I worked Product Development for McDonald's just as they were changing over from fresh cut to frozen (the first of many operations compromises). Back in the fresh cut days they used to keep mountains of bags of fries in the basement of the stores and would rotate them. I know it had to do with sugar content, but never really understood the process.

Could you go into greater detail on the potato storage/curing and the brix? I'm assuming the storage process is to convert some of the starch to sugar. How long should russets be stored and what is the idea brix. In fact, how does a restaurant measure a potato's brix?

Marketing has it that Idaho Russets are strictly controlled. Do you know by chance if over irrigation is also a problem with Idaho's?

As a side note, I'm amazed that more restaurants don't take the time to fresh fry potatoes.

[wesza]

The only information i'm not providing was that we kept as many as 400/500 Bags of Potatoes in Ventelated, Temperture Controlled Storage and utilized the same 'BRIX", control formula used by most potato chip manufactures. This must be done as the potatoes fry best with optimum brix. It's been more difficult for them to maintain constant supply sine the potatoes suppliers are over irrigating the potatoe, providing potatoes that have to much moisture and two little taste.

Great info. Thanks.

I worked Product Development for McDonald's just as they were changing over from fresh cut to frozen (the first of many operations compromises). Back in the fresh cut days they used to keep mountains of bags of fries in the basement of the stores and would rotate them. I know it had to do with sugar content, but never really understood the process.

Could you go into greater detail on the potato storage/curing and the brix? I'm assuming the storage process is to convert some of the starch to sugar. How long should russets be stored and what is the idea brix. In fact, how does a restaurant measure a potato's brix?

Marketing has it that Idaho Russets are strictly controlled. Do you know by chance if over irrigation is also a problem with Idaho's?

As a side note, I'm amazed that more restaurants don't take the time to fresh fry potatoes.

Holly: I've been following your writting's for years in the media, as well as more recently on the internet. In all it's various guises.

If you worked product development with, "Roy Croc", and McDonald's your aware of how the production of Frozen French Fries evolved from 'Simplot", actually building the first Fries Factory, based basically on the consolidation of the then about 700 [i Think] McDonalds Restaurants that were all making their fries from scratch, not consistantly produced as management craved. Simplots done so well that he now owns over 85,000 Acres of Irrigated Potato Farms as well as a Beef Ranch in Oregon thats 65 miles wide by 163 miles long, plush many manufacturing plants and he's no longer the largest.

This factory in a very short time was operating 24 hours daily servicing 3000 McDonalds and other operations utilizing Frozen French Fries. Now there are 3 major operators controlling about 85/90% of the market. Simplot even has potato farms and factories in China. The only proplem with Idaho's and Russet's is that in the marketplace they are one and the same. There's insignifigent amouts of Russets varieties grown, or other types of potatoes in the Idaho/Oregon/Washington Region, especially the so called Potato Belt. There are independant growers who are succeeding with Organic as well as different types. But the big growers are quick to adapt to any appearent marking success IE; Yukon Gold.

Research has been proven that the Russet Potato Farmers have been over irrigating the potatoes during the last 5 years, resulting in potatoes with mimimum taste,flavor and character. Most suited for their major customers. The Fry and Chip Manufacturers. Insiduiously this resulted in [to me] the abomination of so called Flavored Products. To me the addition of flavors only add's the taste of chemicals, salt and maybe what they advertise. It's even gotten into Taco Chips. There has even been marketed in Seattle, over irrigated tasteless, Red, Yukon Gold and other type potatos from the bigger growers.

The most important thing in any potato utilized for french fries [Which originated in Belguim] is that it have a high Starch, low Sugar Content. This should be stored in a dark, well ventalated area, temperture controlled to 55 degrees. I'm not sure what the correct Brix is, i'd need time to dig out the information. But do know that it's very important since you receive Potatos from storage year round and they are rarely delivered to the recipient in controlled temperture/athmosphere trucks as the big producers require or won't buy as the potatos are inspected and checked prior to unloading. When any refuse the delivery, it's dumped price wise into the local market. then you'll suddenly see supermarket sales.

The best potatoe for French Frying are the "Bintjes Potato" or "Matrrist Piper", [also known as the Yukon Gold]. They are the ones used by the more authentic purvayors of "Belgium Frites" and thru out Europe and most recently in America. The finest commercial Restaurant Potato Frying System is the ,'Rubbens Fryers".

If you have any other questions I will try to answer on any hotel, restaurant or food topics, since i'm no longer bound by outdated confidentiality agreements since being semi-retired from consulting. Irwin