Poor electric burner performance

[Shel_B]

Yesterday I experienced something quite strange: the burner that I most frequently use wouldn't boil water.  I was making some spaghetti in a skillet, and it seemed that the water wasn't quite coming to a boil. Later on, I tested my observation by using plain water in the skillet and taking the temp with the Thermopen. The water never got above 210-deg F, and took a very long time to even reach that sub-par temp.

 

I did some checking and learned that the heating elements can degrade and wear out. I never knew that. So, I took the rarely-if-ever-used element from a back burner and swapped it for the poorly performing front burner, and I was amazed at the difference.  The element heated very quickly by comparison, and got the water up to temperature faster than any time in recent memory.

 

So, a cautionary tale: electric burners degrade and one might do well to check and replace them every now and then.

 

Additional comment: I was cooking some onions in a Le Creuset earler this morning, and had the heat set to medium, where it's usually been. Surprise! The new burner was strong enough that I had to turn down the heat to prevent scorching.

 

Edited Monday at 04:21 PM by Shel_B
Additional information (log)

[KennethT]

2 hours ago, Shel_B said:

Yesterday I experienced something quite strange: the burner that I most frequently use wouldn't boil water.  I was making some spaghetti in a skillet, and it seemed that the water wasn't quite coming to a boil. Later on, I tested my observation by using plain water in the skillet and taking the temp with the Thermopen. The water never got above 210-deg F, and took a very long time to even reach that sub-par temp.

 

I did some checking and learned that the heating elements can degrade and wear out. I never knew that. So, I took the rarely-if-ever-used element from a back burner and swapped it for the poorly performing front burner, and I was amazed at the difference.  The element heated very quickly by comparison, and got the water up to temperature faster than any time in recent memory.

 

So, a cautionary tale: electric burners degrade and one might do well to check and replace them every now and then.

 

Additional comment: I was cooking some onions in a Le Creuset earler this morning, and had the heat set to medium, where it's usually been. Surprise! The new burner was strong enough that I had to turn down the heat to prevent scorching.

 

If you have a multimeter, you can check the resistance of the heating element and compare it with other elements of the same size/power rating.

[Tropicalsenior]

3 hours ago, Shel_B said:

So, a cautionary tale: electric burners degrade and one might do well to check and replace them every now and then.

You're right. They do degrade and they do wear out. I've had my stove about 25 years and I've replaced the burners several times. I don't know about up there but I can find replacement burners in the hardware stores here.

[Shel_B]

2 hours ago, Tropicalsenior said:

You're right. They do degrade and they do wear out. I've had my stove about 25 years and I've replaced the burners several times. I don't know about up there but I can find replacement burners in the hardware stores here.

There are many choices here from a variety of sources.  I'm starting to learn about the differences in burner design and hoping I can find some that are more efficient and less expensive to operate.

[Tropicalsenior]

2 minutes ago, Shel_B said:

There are many choices here from a variety of sources.

You have a lot more resources there than I do. The main requirement here is if it fits, buy it.

[KennethT]

1 hour ago, Shel_B said:

There are many choices here from a variety of sources.  I'm starting to learn about the differences in burner design and hoping I can find some that are more efficient and less expensive to operate.

Within the realm of resistive burners, the only thing that will make one more efficient over another is how well it contacts your pan since the heat created is proportional to the burner's resistance.  So a burner that uses less power will also make less heat - so to bring a given mass of water to a boil (for instance) a less powerful burner will take longer to get there while using less energy per minute, basically ending up a wash.  To get to be much more efficient, you need a different technology, like induction, but that requires a whole new burner system, not just a part replacement as you may be aware.

[Shel_B]

33 minutes ago, KennethT said:

Within the realm of resistive burners, the only thing that will make one more efficient over another is how well it contacts your pan since the heat created is proportional to the burner's resistance.  So a burner that uses less power will also make less heat - so to bring a given mass of water to a boil (for instance) a less powerful burner will take longer to get there while using less energy per minute, basically ending up a wash.  To get to be much more efficient, you need a different technology, like induction, but that requires a whole new burner system, not just a part replacement as you may be aware.

OK, I get what you're saying. I have a question, though. I recall reading somewhere that coil burnes with thinner coils were more efficient than the, at the time, older, wider coils>  Is there some/amy truth to that?

 

Would more, narrower windins make for quicker heating of the pan?

 

Is there any design that makes for more efficient use of the electicity that's being consumed, such as (just guessing) thinner coils that heat up quicker?

[KennethT]

36 minutes ago, Shel_B said:

OK, I get what you're saying. I have a question, though. I recall reading somewhere that coil burnes with thinner coils were more efficient than the, at the time, older, wider coils>  Is there some/amy truth to that?

 

Would more, narrower windins make for quicker heating of the pan?

 

Is there any design that makes for more efficient use of the electicity that's being consumed, such as (just guessing) thinner coils that heat up quicker?

From my understanding of the physics of resistors, all resistive elements are 100% efficient in converting electricity to heat - their efficiency differs in how that heat gets transferred to the pan.  That can vary based on how much of the "tube" cross section makes contact with the pan, the total flatness - meaning, how much of the coiled tube doesn't contact the pan at all, etc.

 

Most stove elements are  of the "calrod" type - meaning that a thin wire is helically twisted and encased in an electrical insulator which is then further encased in a metal sheath.

 

I imagine that the manufacturers of the heating elements would be able to supply data on their elements' performance.

[Shel_B]

4 hours ago, KennethT said:

[...]  all resistive elements are 100% efficient [...] their efficiency differs in how that heat gets transferred to the pan.  That can vary [...] Most stove elements are  of the "calrod" type - meaning that a thin wire is helically twisted and encased in an electrical insulator which is then further encased in a metal sheath.

 

Your information is appreciated. I didn't know just how the coils were heated.

 

From what you're saying, it's how the heat is transferred to the pan that effects the final efficiency. If the metal sheathing upon which the pan rests is of a design or of a material that transfers heat more effectivly, the hob overall would be more efficient. And if heat transfer through the sheathing could be improved by design or material, then less electricity would be needed to heat the pan to a certain point.

 

I'm just trying to see if I understand how the heating coils wrk. Do I have the concept correct?

Edited Tuesday at 04:39 AM by Shel_B (log)

[Maison Rustique]

I've never had the stovetop burners degrade, but twice I've had the oven burners go bad--two different ovens. The second one literally fried--I saw a flash in the oven and shut it down quickly. The guy who came to repair it said I was lucky not to have had a serious fire. Who knew this kind of stuff could happen! And they say gas ranges are bad for you. Hunh!!!

[KennethT]

8 hours ago, Shel_B said:

Your information is appreciated. I didn't know just how the coils were heated.

 

From what you're saying, it's how the heat is transferred to the pan that effects the final efficiency. If the metal sheathing upon which the pan rests is of a design or of a material that transfers heat more effectivly, the hob overall would be more efficient. And if heat transfer through the sheathing could be improved by design or material, then less electricity would be needed to heat the pan to a certain point.

 

I'm just trying to see if I understand how the heating coils wrk. Do I have the concept correct?

That's pretty much it.  I don't know how much difference there is in materials from manufacturer to manufacturer as the technology is old and pretty much standardized by now, but I haven't researched the various manufacturers, so it is definitely possible. 

[chromedome]

22 hours ago, Shel_B said:

Yesterday I experienced something quite strange: the burner that I most frequently use wouldn't boil water.  I was making some spaghetti in a skillet, and it seemed that the water wasn't quite coming to a boil. Later on, I tested my observation by using plain water in the skillet and taking the temp with the Thermopen. The water never got above 210-deg F, and took a very long time to even reach that sub-par temp.

 

I did some checking and learned that the heating elements can degrade and wear out. I never knew that. So, I took the rarely-if-ever-used element from a back burner and swapped it for the poorly performing front burner, and I was amazed at the difference.  The element heated very quickly by comparison, and got the water up to temperature faster than any time in recent memory.

 

So, a cautionary tale: electric burners degrade and one might do well to check and replace them every now and then.

 

Additional comment: I was cooking some onions in a Le Creuset earler this morning, and had the heat set to medium, where it's usually been. Surprise! The new burner was strong enough that I had to turn down the heat to prevent scorching.

 

I have the opposite problem with my range. The coil element periodically will have a "runaway" moment, when - no matter what setting the dial is turned to - it will suddenly go full blast, for no discernible reason. This appears to be a function of the wiring to that position, rather than the coil itself, because I've swapped them and it still recurs in the same spot (the much-used front large burner, of course...). I discovered this a couple of years ago when I left the room to rummage for something in the freezer, and came back to discover that the burner had actually melted a hole in the bottom of my multi-ply Paderno Dutch oven.* The burner itself had melted out in that spot, breaking the circuit and preventing any further damage.

I haven't gotten around to looking this up online and doing some troubleshooting, so I use the less-convenient large burner in the back corner a lot more and only use the problematic one when I'll be in the room and giving it my full attention.

*Some of you will remember that I'd watched the price on that specific set for several years before finally acquiring it at a blowout clearance price, so I was especially miffed.