Dining Talk 2002

[Jason Perlow]

I'm moving to San Francisco in January. What restaurant/s would you recommend for my first "official" meal/s as a resident? I'm looking for a restaurant that sort of epitomizes the San Francisco experience...Any suggestions would be appreciated.

Bill Daley

Bill, you going over to the Chronicle?

As to SF experience... Taditch Grill. Oldest restaurant in town. Cioppino was born there.

I actually like the cioppino at Aliotos on the wharf better though.

The actual SF experience is sitting down at the wharf, finding a cheap vendor right there with some crabs and some chowder in a sourdough boule, and getting your hands dirty.

[Stone]

The actual SF experience is sitting down at the wharf, finding a cheap vendor right there with some crabs and some chowder in a sourdough boule, and getting your hands dirty.

The thought of sending someone to Fisherman's wharf for the actual San Francisco experience seems to me like sending someone to South Street Seaport for the actual New York experience. The wharf is for tourists.

[Mebutter]

Yes Jason, I'm going to the Chronicle. I'll be reviewing "ethnic" in the city itself and doing other food writing as well. I'm very excited about it and plan to hit the ground eating.

Many thanks for the suggestions and thanks, also, to Dstone001, for the picks. I'm looking forward to trying them all.

Bill Daley

[Fat Guy]

Bill, that's great news for San Francisco (and sad news for Hartford). Congratulations!

[Jason Perlow]

The actual SF experience is sitting down at the wharf, finding a cheap vendor right there with some crabs and some chowder in a sourdough boule, and getting your hands dirty.

The thought of sending someone to Fisherman's wharf for the actual San Francisco experience seems to me like sending someone to South Street Seaport for the actual New York experience. The wharf is for tourists.

Yes, but you cant actually get decent seafood in South Street Seaport. I'm talking about the Pier where Aliotos is where all the street seafood vendors are. You can actually eat quite well there.

[SobaAddict70]

Having seen FW first hand, I can personally attest to Dstone's view. It's even less than that. Think of a group of loud, obnoxious smelling seafood stands with shrimp, shellfish and fried stuff catering to out of towners and a few shops selling schlock. Throw in a seal sanctuary (for real) and that's all you get. Actually, the seals are the best part. Everything else (seriously...) is just for show/tourists.

Dstone, correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the seal sanctuary slightly outside FW? My sense of geography isn't up to speed.

Thanks.

SA

[Mebutter]

Thanks Steven. I'm not sure if it will be sad news for Hartford. I can think of a couple of restaurateurs who will be jumping for joy.

Many thanks, also, for the posting about East Buffet on the New England board. It was one of the most memorable places I visited this year.

Bill

[Jason Perlow]

Having seen FW first hand, I can personally attest to Dstone's view.  It's even less than that.  Think of a group of loud, obnoxious smelling seafood stands with shrimp, shellfish and fried stuff catering to out of towners and a few shops selling schlock.  Throw in a seal sanctuary (for real) and that's all you get.  Actually, the seals are the best part.  Everything else (seriously...) is just for show/tourists.

Dstone, correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the seal sanctuary slightly outside FW?  My sense of geography isn't up to speed.

Thanks.

SA

You are so wrong on this, Soba. I know plenty of foodies in SF who eat at the wharf to grab crabs and chowder all the time. Hell to get my crab fix, I do this every time I am in town.

Yes, its loud. Its touristy. But its got good fucking crabs and chowder, what the hell else do you want?

[Stone]

If you're doing "ethnic" please check out Helmand and Alborz.

Helmand offers exceptional Afghan cuisine (and happens to be owned by Hamid Karzai's brother) in the heart of North Beach.

Alborz, in a cheesy location on Van Ess that looks like the lobby of some suburban hotel, has terrific Persian food. It's been a while since I've gone, but they have a chicken in pomegrant sauce that is one of the most interesting flavors I've ever had. Not at all sweet like I would have imagined, with a smokey, almost chocolately undertone.

Maybe I'll start reading the Chronicle.

[Dave the Cook]

fucking crabs and chowder

This is a delicacy with which I am not familiar. I have so many questions.

[Jason Perlow]

fucking crabs and chowder

This is a delicacy with which I am not familiar. I have so many questions.

They have them on sale at Fairway Market.

[SobaAddict70]

You are so wrong on this, Soba. I know plenty of foodies in SF  who eat at the wharf to grab crabs and chowder all the time. Hell to get my crab fix, I do this every time I am in town.

Yes, its loud. Its touristy. But its got good fucking crabs and chowder, what the hell else do you want?

Maybe you're easily impressed, Jason.

I wasn't.

My reaction: Is that all there is? I was expecting so much more.

Quite a let down if you ask me.

As for fucking crabs, etc., let's not go there, ok? hehe

SA

[fredlet]

Yes, there are tourists (though the bulk of them are at Pier 39 along with the seals.) on Fisherman's Wharf, though they are mostly across the street at the schlock shops.

Get a sourdough bowl with chowder and a dungeness crab cocktail at the vendors on the bay side and eat as you walk along the pier... its heaven.

[Jason Perlow]

Bill:

you should go visit the ITS-IT factory. Its the definitive San Francisco novelty ice cream. I dont think they even use modern manufacturing methods.

[Stone]

fucking crabs and chowder

This is a delicacy with which I am not familiar. I have so many questions.

They're like dancing prawns, but, you know, fucking.

[Stone]

Bill:

you should go visit the ITS-IT factory. Its the definitive San Francisco novelty ice cream. I dont think they even use modern manufacturing methods.

Also, Mitchell's for ice cream in the outer Mission, not to be confused with Mitchell Brothers for . . . well, I'll let you find that out yourself. And the original Swensons up on Russian Hill.

Edited December 16, 2002 by Dstone001 (log)

[Jason Perlow]

Maybe you're easily impressed, Jason.

It really doesnt take too much to make me happy. A good bowl of chowda, and a heap of crab meat. I dont care if its in the most touristy part of San Francisco or in the middle of Beirut. If its got Chowda, with edible sourdough bowls, and heaps of crab meat, I'm there.

[Mebutter]

"QUOTE (Jason Perlow @ Dec 16 2002, 02:58 PM)

fucking crabs and chowder

This is a delicacy with which I am not familiar. I have so many questions. "

Dave the Cook's turn-of-phrase is one of the reasons I like eGullet so much. You never know what's going to happen next. Thanks for turning a snowy-gray-kid's got a bug-afternoon into something enjoyable.

And thanks to all of you for your ideas/suggestions. This is perfect.

Bill Daley

[Fat Guy]

I'm looking for a restaurant that sort of epitomizes the San Francisco experience...

Okay, let's focus on the original question here. A restaurant that epitomizes the San Francisco experience would need the following credentials:

1. The waiters would have to think and act as though they're working at the best restaurant in the world, and they'd have to lecture you constantly about how much better restaurants in San Francisco are than New York restaurants. Bonus points for saying

a. "I went to New York and ate at Daniel's and I wasn't impressed,"

b. "We have some New York-style restaurants here like the Fifth Floor but they're for tourists,"

c. "We have such great produce and seafood here; you could never get anything like it on the East Coast," or

d. "You can get good food in New York but it's so expensive; here in San Francisco there are thousands of great restaurants with $20 entrees."

2. Each dish on the menu must include an Asian ingredient, whether or not it helps the dish.

3. The desserts have to be terrible. Preferably, there will be no professional pastry chef associated with the restaurant.

[Stone]

Seared ahi tuna and mango chutney.

[SobaAddict70]

It really doesnt take too much to make me happy. A good bowl of chowda, and a heap of crab meat. I dont care if its in the most touristy part of San Francisco or in the middle of Beirut. If its got Chowda, with edible sourdough bowls, and heaps of crab meat, I'm there.

Heh, touche.

I thought FW had something like tall ships (SS has a couple docked, so I was expecting something along those lines). But that's just my opinion. I may be wrong, but that was my perception of the famous FW -- all myth and no substance.

I like my crabs in a heap, on top of lots of newspapers and with bibs and crab picks provided. Best like they do it down South (although they also do it in Chinatown and in the Philippines and elsewhere.)

We won't go into what makes me happy.

SA

[Dave the Cook]

Maybe you're easily impressed, Jason.

It really doesnt take too much to make me happy. A good bowl of chowda, and a heap of crab meat.

And fucking, well, that's like, dessert.

[Jason Perlow]

Maybe you're easily impressed, Jason.

It really doesnt take too much to make me happy. A good bowl of chowda, and a heap of crab meat.

And fucking, well, that's like, dessert.

Especially if you can watch the crabs do it. Okay, I'm done with that.

[SobaAddict70]

This is one of those "I don't know the name of the restaurant but I know where its located".

A Vietnamese place on Divisadero one block away from Gamescape. (Gamescape is a game/hobby shop between Oak and Page on Divisadero.) Its on the SE corner of Divisadero and Page, I think.

A Vietnamese/Thai place on Larkin, within 3 blocks of Geary, on the left side of the street as you're heading towards Market. I highly recommend it for their pho and jap soi (sp).

Can't think of others right now, but I'm sure something will pop up eventually.

SA

Edited December 16, 2002 by SobaAddict70 (log)

[Margaret Pilgrim]

Sea Lions, no seals.