BYOB - What's the deal in the Midwest?

[ulterior epicure]

Far be it from a teetotaler to start a thread on BYO, but what, exactly are the policies in the many and assundry states of our great Heartland? Let's start with Missouri and Kansas, shall we?

Can I bring my own bottle of wine to a restaurant in either of these two states? Or, is it by city ordinance? Would love to get clued in... don't all jump on me at once!

[Aaron Deacon]

Far be it from a teetotaler to start a thread on BYO, but what, exactly are the policies in the many and assundry states of our great Heartland?  Let's start with Missouri and Kansas, shall we? 

Can I bring my own bottle of wine to a restaurant in either of these two states?  Or, is it by city ordinance?  Would love to get clued in... don't all jump on me at once! 

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Great question. I think it's by municipality rather than state. In Chicago, you can BYO just about anywhere if you're willing to pay. And there are tons of good and great restaurants where you can do so for free.

In KC, I was recently told that BYO is not allowed on the Kansas side, and someone over on Chowhound just mentioned that you need to have a license of some sort on the Missouri side. It doesn't seem, from a first impression, that BYO has a lot of traction in this area, much to my dismay.

[chicagowench]

It's allowed on the KS side, because 40 Sardines does a no-corkage fee on Thursday nights BYO.

[tammylc]

No BYO at all in Michigan. :-(

But you can ask the restaurant to recork an unfinished bottle so you can bring it home with you.

Edited October 13, 2006 by tammylc (log)

[ChefCAG]

Kansas it's legal

Mo. Its' legal in the state but not in the city of Kansas City, Mo. It's really lame..... They want their tax dollars so the can figure out how to missuse it

Strange thing is Thats how I met Judy

[moosnsqrl]

Kansas it's legal

Mo. Its' legal in the state but not in the city of Kansas City, Mo. It's really lame..... They want their tax dollars so the can figure out how to missuse it 

Strange thing is Thats how I met Judy 

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'Twas a dark day, indeed. Leave it to you to remember that - no wonder I can't get a decent meal there

And, as mentioned on another thread, there are now bags with un-resealable (is that a word?) seals you can request if you wish to take home a partial bottle from a KCMO restaurant. Essentially your server seals it and you cannot open it until you get to your destination. The point being to discourage people from consuming it while driving home. It's all rather silly but at least there is the option now.

[Aaron Deacon]

Yeah, I guess I had it backwards, no BYO on Missouri side, no take-home bags on the KS side...is that right?

So are there good BYOs on the KS side, or is it common for mom-and-pop ethnic joints to be BYO?

[chicagowench]

Kansas it's legal

Mo. Its' legal in the state but not in the city of Kansas City, Mo. It's really lame..... They want their tax dollars so the can figure out how to missuse it 

Strange thing is Thats how I met Judy 

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Right, note to self- bring crazy straw to bluestem next time, not bottle.

Aaron, to be honest, I just call ahead and ask- more often than not, I've confused places down by me when I ask, save for restaurants like 40 and Cassis.

[Brad Ballinger]

BYO laws are usually based upon municipality, and not state. But there may be some state-wide cases. No BYO in Boston, for example, but you can bring your own in the suburbs. But Boston isn't the heartland, so. . .

I've never experienced a municiplaity that did not allow BYO in either Minnesota or Iowa. I've never tried in Wisconsin, so I have nothing to report there. Even though BYO may be permitted by law, however, doesn't mean that a restaurant has to allow it. I know a few that don't. It is also up to the restaurant whether or not to charge a corkage fee, and what that fee should be.

And although no one asked, a couple of decorum issues on BYO (you will find this topic addressed ad nauseum in the Wine Forum, with some volatile dissent to what follows). The main thing is not to bring your own wine just to appear cheap, and avoid paying the wine list prices. That means different things to different people, but usually it means not bringing something on the wine list, not bringing something like Yellow Tail, and -- depending on the size of your party -- perhaps also ordering something from the list (or by the glass).

Taking home wine in the bottle is also governed by municipality. It is against the law in Chicago (but some places look the other way).

[Aaron Deacon]

Aaron, to be honest, I just call ahead and ask- more often than not, I've confused places down by me when I ask, save for restaurants like 40 and Cassis.

Yeah, I don't have the kind of collection to bring a bottle to places with their own list. I'd say in Chicago, at least half my restaurant meals were at BYO, no liquor license places. Almost all the Thai places, non-Muslim middle Eastern, some really nice places like Schwa, and some good mid-range spots like Glenn's Diner or Dorado. There's just sort of a culture of BYO that I haven't noticed in the KC area.

[MSPD]

In Minnesota, the only significant pitfall is that you cannot BYO to any restaurant that doesn't have a liquor license.

[Leonard Kim]

No BYO at all in Michigan. :-(

But you can ask the restaurant to recork an unfinished bottle so you can bring it home with you.

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I have been to one restaurant in Michigan where I have definitely seen diners bring their own (and on multiple occasions, so it's wasn't just a fluke or mistake or something.) I don't know what the situation is there.

Edited October 17, 2006 by Leonard Kim (log)

[ChefCAG]

I don't mind BYO at all In my place, but again I hope it's a bottle we cannot get. Missouri is a franchise state which means if a distributor doesn’t provide it we aren’t allowed to sell it. For instance Megan and I are on the list for Williams Salem (sp?) winery. We get about 2 cases a year at home. Not only can we not get it anywhere in town, if we sell it on our list I think they could fine us. So I think it is unfair that we can’t take it to another place and enjoy it with dinner. Also I have been known to let people BYO on occasion and I will absolutely wave corkage if you buy something off our list too.

[MichaelB]

Ohio:

You can bring your own wine to a place that has no license.

I think you can bring your own wine to a place with a beer or a beer and hard liquor license. There are more of these places than you might think. In Ohio, each type of license is allocated to each municipality based on population. So, in a given place, the broadest license might not be available but a narrower license might be.

You are technically not permitted to bring your own wine to a place with a wine license. More precisely, the establishment cannot permit the consumption of anything that it could have sold you. This rule is almost universally ignored in finer places which will charge a corkage fee.

The rule gets to absurd results in cases, for example where a restaurant is hosting a charity event and a distributor wishes to contribute the wine for the event. The distributor has to sell the wine to the restaurant (and collect cash on delivery; no credit extensions permitted in Ohio) and then the distributor may make a charitable contribution to the charity and the charity must pay for the wine consumed at the event.

Geez!

[moosnsqrl]

I just stumbled upon this list for BYOB in KC area. It's clearly incomplete but it is a start and you can add places you might be aware of so, if we all cooperate, we could have a valuable resource at some future time.

You can also sign-up to receive emails with event updates (tastings, auctions and the like) so it's worth a look for that as well.

[2h74webere]

You can BYO in Wisconsin all you want, usually for a corkage fee.

You can also now (just passed this year!) take your unfinshed bottle of wine home with you! Yay! Wait, I don't have a problem finishing bottles of wine.... but it's a good law anyway

[tammylc]

No BYO at all in Michigan. :-(

But you can ask the restaurant to recork an unfinished bottle so you can bring it home with you.

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I have been to one restaurant in Michigan where I have definitely seen diners bring their own (and on multiple occasions, so it's wasn't just a fluke or mistake or something.) I don't know what the situation is there.

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They are breaking the law, and have just decided that they are unlikely to be reported.

http://www.michigan.gov/cis/0,1607,7-154-1...99198--,00.html

Q.  Can I bring my own bottle of wine to a restaurant and just be charged a "corkage fee" for serving?

A. No. All alcohol served at an on-premises licensed establishment must be purchased from that establishment. If the establishment does not hold a license, MCL 436.1913 clearly states that those establishments may not allow consumption of alcohol on the premises. Please direct specific questions to the MLCC Enforcement toll free line at 1-866-893-2121.

[daniellewiley]

No BYO at all in Michigan. :-(

But you can ask the restaurant to recork an unfinished bottle so you can bring it home with you.

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Is this a new law? Or is it just not enforced? We used to bring beer and tequila to La Fiesta Mexicana in Ypsi. This was in the late 90s.

[Leonard Kim]

I have been to one restaurant in Michigan where I have definitely seen diners bring their own (and on multiple occasions, so it's wasn't just a fluke or mistake or something.)  I don't know what the situation is there.

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They are breaking the law, and have just decided that they are unlikely to be reported.

http://www.michigan.gov/cis/0,1607,7-154-1...99198--,00.html

Q.  Can I bring my own bottle of wine to a restaurant and just be charged a "corkage fee" for serving?

A. No. All alcohol served at an on-premises licensed establishment must be purchased from that establishment. If the establishment does not hold a license, MCL 436.1913 clearly states that those establishments may not allow consumption of alcohol on the premises. Please direct specific questions to the MLCC Enforcement toll free line at 1-866-893-2121.

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Interesting how the law is worded to make both parties at fault. If I were a belligerent customer that absolutely insisted on bringing and drinking my own drink in a restaurant, yeah I'm breaking the law, but so is the restaurant. If the restaurant called the cops on me, it would be for something they're technically at fault for too (i.e., they'd be calling the cops on themselves.)

Compare this to a situation with less force of law behind it, say if some establishment (not a restaurant) had a "no food or drinks" sign posted (and assuming there were some obvious good reason for this), if I don't respect that, common sense suggests I'm at fault and not the establishment. But in this case, what this law is saying is that the establishment is also at fault for not enforcing the ban.

What surprises me is that, given this wording, it's a little unclear to me what purpose the law is supposed to serve. I would understand it if the patron only was at fault, i.e., this is a law to protect licensed and unlicensed businesses alike from people trying to frequent an establishment but bringing their own "goods." I suppose it is intended to serve a safety function (safe driving etc.) in that BYO reduces the control the establishment has over the amount of alcohol consumed.

I'm amused that, just a couple tables down from the BYO party, there was a table of uniformed police officers. But I guess enforcing compliance and reporting such violations isn't (or is it?) part of their everyday responsibilities. After all, there's an "enforcement toll free line."

The year of the regulation linked to by tammylc is 1998, but I'm assuming that it's possible that particular section could be older and just unrevised.

Edited October 20, 2006 by Leonard Kim (log)

[Brad Ballinger]

In Minnesota, the only significant pitfall is that you cannot BYO to any restaurant that doesn't have a liquor license.

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Not necessarily true. Or, perhaps, I should say not necessarily always practiced. I've successfully brought wine to restaurants in Minnesota that don't have liquor licenses.

[MSPD]

In Minnesota, the only significant pitfall is that you cannot BYO to any restaurant that doesn't have a liquor license.

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Not necessarily true. Or, perhaps, I should say not necessarily always practiced. I've successfully brought wine to restaurants in Minnesota that don't have liquor licenses.

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It is absolutely true.

MN statute 340A.414 states, "No business establishment or club which does not hold an on-sale intoxicating liquor license may directly or indirectly allow the consumption and display of alcoholic beverages, without first having obtained a permit from the commissioner." The dispensing or display of alcoholic beverages in such a business setting, without the proper license or permit may subject the business owner and employees to criminal charges, as well as liability issues.

Whether it's enforced is another matter. However, the restaurant would have ultimately responsible for your action. I personally would not put a restaurant I enjoyed at risk by doing that.

[Brad Ballinger]

Whether it's enforced is another matter.  However, the restaurant would have ultimately responsible for your action.  I personally would not put a restaurant I enjoyed at risk by doing that.

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In every case, the restaurant has offered; I have not imposed my will on them.

[MSPD]

Whether it's enforced is another matter.  However, the restaurant would have ultimately responsible for your action.  I personally would not put a restaurant I enjoyed at risk by doing that.

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In every case, the restaurant has offered; I have not imposed my will on them.

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Well...at least you now know not to do that any more. Regardless of who initiates it, you knowingly would be putting them at risk of committing a criminal act.