Favorite Pilsners?

[Bill Poster]

Thanks Tongo,

Interesting read. I would like to know more about the different yeast and hops characteristics(how nerdy am I); if you know of any reading sources please could you post?

Regards Will

[TongoRad]

Thanks Tongo,

Interesting read. I would like to know more about the different yeast and hops characteristics(how nerdy am I); if you know of any reading sources please could you post?

Regards Will

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I'll try to find some interesting things for you, Bill. I've got a shelf full of books, but there are bound to be some great recources on line.

jesskidden- That Lew Bryson article you were refering to may be this one- How to Ruin a Good Beer. It's excellent, and I've got it bookmarked as a matter of fact. In addition to the lightstruck section, check out what he writes about heat and DMS- many continental lagers will contain trace amounts of it and with overheating it will become much more prominent. That can explain why some of these beers in an enclosed case will also give off a cabbagey aroma though they have not been exposed to light.

I like BA- I've met some very nice folks through that site, and it can be a great resource for finding stuff. The brusqueness is just Todd's style, and it can take a while to get used to though, but it'll happen .

[eje]

[...]The lack of any intended fermentation byproducts makes for a beer that is a pure expression of the malt and hops that it is made from, and in that regard those ingredients had better be quality ones.

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...don't have a lot of other things going on to HIDE the skunkiness.

I think these two quotes get to the essence of pilsener and many german lagers.

We're talking about beers, at least in Germany, whose components are very strictly regulate by law and tradition.

Water, malted barley, hops, and yeast. That's it.

It's about the naked ingredients and the skill of the brewmaster to balance them.

If there's a bit of an off taste or skunkiness in a beer like a "Hop Devil" or "Arrogant Bastard", odds are the consumer won't even notice.

To use a cocktail analogy, it's like the difference between balancing the flavors of a three ingredient cocktail, like an aviation, and making a planters punch. A quarter ounce one way or another in an aviation can throw off the balance of the whole drink. In a fruit juice driven drink, like a planters punch, (as it is usually made in the US,) a whole ounce of spirits one way or another doesn't make a whole lot of difference.

In any case, I was at a concert last night, (Elvis Costello and Alan Toussaint rocked!) and thinking about this thread. I happened to pass a person who had obviously been smoking some pretty poor quality weed and it occurred to me that that is exactly what I think skunked beer smells like. Yeah or no?

Or is that what pilsener is supposed to smell like?

edit - grammar.

Edited June 21, 2006 by eje (log)

[jsolomon]

Tongo, a thousand apologies. I blame too much work and not enough beer.

But, if you're all complaining about skunky beer, you're not thirsty enough.

[Bill Poster]

Skunked beer smelling like weed..Dunno but have you ever tried hemp/marajuana beer? I tried some in Copenhagen..not bad at all.

Edited June 21, 2006 by Bill Poster (log)

[jsolomon]

When I was at the Santa Rampage in Chicago a couple of years ago, we had Hazed and Infused to drink. I don't know whether the particular bottle I had was maltreated, or whether it's just shit beer.

But, I've never choked down another bottle. The only other beer I routinely turn down in chile beer. That stuff is atrocious.

[eje]

Skunked beer smelling like weed..Dunno but have you ever tried hemp/marajuana beer? I tried some in Copenhagen..not bad at all.    

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Humboldt Brewing makes a hemp ale which I've never tried. I used to like their Red Nectar, but, haven't had it for a couple years now. Hmmmm... It appears they were acquired last year by Firestone-Walker.

I don't mean the sort of nice resinous smell of decent weed, (which I do not recommend to children and have only ever experienced second hand, of course,) but the nasty smell of someone who has been smoking particularly awful ditch weed. Kind of grassy, bitter-ish and decidedly skunky.

[Jason Perlow]

I like Budweiser Budvar (Czechvar) a lot.

[Sneakeater]

I spent a summer in Hamburg fifteen years or so ago and (I'm so ignorant) I avoided ever ordering a Budweiser -- which was available, draft, just about everywhere -- because I didn't know what it was and thought, "Why go to Germany and drink Budweiser?"

I am such a fucking moron.

Edited June 21, 2006 by Sneakeater (log)

[eje]

I like Budweiser Budvar (Czechvar) a lot.

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I have really good memories of drinking this beer in London years ago, but, when I've tried it recently it's underwhelmed me. Maybe it's just the things taste better on vacation phenomenon.

Has anyone tried Trumer Pils? They've done some sort of partnership with a brewery in Berkeley and are brewing it here, now. Any good?

[TongoRad]

Thanks Tongo,

Interesting read. I would like to know more about the different yeast and hops characteristics(how nerdy am I); if you know of any reading sources please could you post?

Regards Will

←

OK- I'm back. Some good places to start may be the BJCP Study Guide, just scroll down for the hops and yeast sections, and the Wyeast Product List. Wyeast is not the only place a brewer may get their supplies, but there is some good info on that page.

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We apparantly have a lot of skunks here in the Northeast, because I have smelled that odor quite a few times in my lifetime, usually as a result of driving through an area where a car has turned one into an ex-skunk. The resemblance to that quality in a light-struck beer is uncanny (and no, it doesn't really smell like Otto's jacket ). If you don't mind wasting a beer you can do it yourself quite easily just by leaving it out in direct sunlight, in a clear glass, for about a half hour. In the right conditions it can take just seconds- you'll know when it happens.

jsolomon

Tongo, a thousand apologies. I blame too much work and not enough beer.

Sadly that may be a common malady.

My gut tells me that the Hazed and Infused that you had was not the good stuff. I've had it before and it definitely isn't a shit beer. Quite hoppy, too.

[Jason Perlow]

I like Budweiser Budvar (Czechvar) a lot.

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I have really good memories of drinking this beer in London years ago, but, when I've tried it recently it's underwhelmed me. Maybe it's just the things taste better on vacation phenomenon.

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Like any Pilsner, it tastes really good with very spicy food or on a really hot day.

[barcelona]

Troegs Sunshine Pils is quite tasty, maybe because it's closer to pale ale than pilsener

[BrentKulman]

Troegs Sunshine Pils is quite tasty, maybe because it's closer to pale ale than pilsener  

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I agree, Sunshine Pils might not taste like a classic German Pilsner, but I don't think it tastes like a Pale Ale. To me, it clearly tastes like a lager but its unusual fruity esters bend the category.

Edited June 22, 2006 by BrentKulman (log)

[eje]

Picked up a sixer of Radeberger Pils from Dresden.

It's lighter in body than most other Pilseners I've tried. Definitely got that grassy, herbaceous hop thing going on. I didn't detect much skunkiness, as I understand it. But, they nicely bottle in brown.

A refreshing beer that I might drink on tap on a hot, humid day. Beats the heck out of Pabst or Budweiser (US). Don't think I'd buy a six pack again, as there are much more interesting beers around for less cash.

[Susan in FL]

"What you might call skunked due to lack of knowledge could be a tasty German-style Pils to another."

But, I dunno about that statement, though.  Perhaps it's just the condescending attitude, though.

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I agree with your problem with the article's "attitude" -I was actually looking for a different article which I *thought* was by beer writer Lew Bryson which was the best, in-depth article on light-stuck beer I'd seen but couldn't find it after a quick Google, so the Beer Advocate article was an easy (yet difficult) default. The facts are there but I, too, don't care for some of BA's methods.

I *will* say that "skunked" is a term that is often mis-used to mean any off-taste in a beer, often attributing it to age- beer that's past it's "best by" date- or mis-handled. True "skunking" can occur with minutes- ever have a nice hoppy ale in a glass, outdoors on a sunny day? Doesn't much matter if it came out of a brown bottle, aluminum can or keg, or from the brewery the day before, it can get lightstrunk that quick.

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Thanks Tongo,

Interesting read. I would like to know more about the different yeast and hops characteristics(how nerdy am I); if you know of any reading sources please could you post?

Regards Will

←

I'll try to find some interesting things for you, Bill. I've got a shelf full of books, but there are bound to be some great recources on line.

jesskidden- That Lew Bryson article you were refering to may be this one- How to Ruin a Good Beer. It's excellent, and I've got it bookmarked as a matter of fact. In addition to the lightstruck section, check out what he writes about heat and DMS- many continental lagers will contain trace amounts of it and with overheating it will become much more prominent. That can explain why some of these beers in an enclosed case will also give off a cabbagey aroma though they have not been exposed to light.

I like BA- I've met some very nice folks through that site, and it can be a great resource for finding stuff. The brusqueness is just Todd's style, and it can take a while to get used to though, but it'll happen .

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I'll just add that I too really like Victory Prima Pils and Tupper's Hop Pocket Pils.

Lew Bryson is a member of the eG Society, though he hasn't posted anything for quite a while. Perhaps he will contribute to this interesting discussion.

When I was at the Santa Rampage in Chicago a couple of years ago, we had Hazed and Infused to drink.  I don't know whether the particular bottle I had was maltreated, or whether it's just shit beer.

But, I've never choked down another bottle.  The only other beer I routinely turn down in chile beer.  That stuff is atrocious.

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I've gotten three or four of those bad bottles of Hazed and Infused. They were terrible. However, when it's good, it is very very good!

[SheenaGreena]

bumping this post because its almost summertime and I'm still looking for that schwelmer pislner equivalent. I noticed after drinking quite a few pilsners that I'm looking for the ultimate eastern european pilsner. I tried zyweic and a handful of other easther european ones...any other suggestions?

[Rich Pawlak]

I still favor pilsners from Victory, Saranac and Sly Fox. You should be able to get at leat the Victory and Saranac in your neck of the woods.

[eje]

Not many Pilsner style lagers made on the West Coast.

Moonlight Brewing makes its Reality Czeck. It's really a very, very good lager for a micro-brew. If you're on the San Francisco area, and see it on tap, I'd definitely recommend it.

A few of the mid-size breweries, like Biersch and Sudwerk, bottle them. Haven't tried to comment on their quality.

[Malkavian]

For US pilsners I love Victory Prima pils. Otherwise I stick to Pilsner Urquell or Warsteiner. Sometimes Trumer but I don't find it here too often.

I'm not often in the mood for a (possibly floral/grassy) clean tasting beer with a crisp/short finish unless I'm either extremely thirsty or eating food that I don't want to overwhelm.

Edited June 10, 2007 by Malkavian (log)

[TBoner]

Weihenstephaner.

That's all.

Other pilseners are good, but once you have this beer, all others seem to be reaching for what this achieves: the pure, clean expression of malt discussed upthread, the crisp, refreshing flavor so generically co-opted as a marketing term, and the bitter, hoppy backbone that allows the beer to be drinkable sip after sip, glass after glass, ad infinitum.

I tend toward ales, generally, but Weihenstephaner is a life-changer.

[kpzachary]

Here in Germany, I like Radeberger, and Berliner Kindl. I don't know that they are available in the States. I don't recall ever seeing them, but if you do, try them.

[plattetude]

Radeberger started popping up here in NYC in the past year or so. Another German pilsner I've just had here very recently was Mahrs Brau, which was nice, but not as crisp and balanced as I prefer -- a bit flabby and nondescript. Of course, it may well have been the fault of the bar, which has a few too many draught lines (a whopping 66) to be sure they're all clean and fresh...

But Berliner Kindl Weiss (yes, it's also available here if you look hard enough) is hardly a pilsner.

Christopher

Edited June 27, 2007 by plattetude (log)

[Peter Green]

Beer Lao.

The story I had back in the early 90's was that, when things changed hands, the Lao got lucky and the boys from Pils Urquell came in from the Eastern Block to look after things. The result is (in my opinion) probably the best beer you can get outside of a microbrewery in South East Asia (I am partial to Brewerkz XIPA and Mougwai in Singapore).

This started showing up in Bangkok last year. Before that, one of my friends was working in Lamphun and getting a case a week delivered from across the border (somehow).

On the street in Bangkok - in cans - it was quite good, and tasted like it does in Laos. But in Penh it tasted off. I don't know if that is due to poor storage, or if they were adding formaldahyde to help keep it for export (like the Egyptian beers in the 80's).

The dark was new when I went back, but quite satisfying.

Best option is to fly to Vientiane and get it on tap.

But, if it's being exported to Canada or the US, I'd like to hear about it!

[jesskidden]

But Berliner Kindl Weiss (yes, it's also available here if you look hard enough) is hardly a pilsner.

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He didn't say the "Berliner Kindl *Weisse*"- he meant, I take it, the pils from Berliner Kindl - http://www.berliner-kindl.de/ - "Berliner Kindl" being the name of the brewery- or, at least, the former name of the brewery- the parent company merged it with it's former rival, Schultheiss , so now it's the officially the Berliner-Kindl-Schultheiss-Brauerei.

And, unfortunately, the Weisse is no longer exported to the US, so if you know of a supply, pick it up before someone else (like me <g>) finds it.

Edited June 27, 2007 by jesskidden (log)