Chowdah/Chowder--Cook-Off 20

[Chris Amirault]

What is the major purpose of the salt pork, as a source of cooking fat or as a flavour. Would a good substitiute be a combination of salted fat back and bacon?

Both, I'd say. It's definitely to provide some cooking fat, but salt pork also has a distinctive, if relatively mild flavor. In my opinion, to be really traditional you don't want smokey flavors in a chowder (salt pork is not smoked). So I wouldn't use bacon, unless you're talking about a nonsmoked bacon.

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That's what I'll be using: some nonsmoked bacon from the Charcuterie thread action.

[Susan in FL]

Vongole is Italian for "clams" -- so I think you're doing just fine.  It's unlikely you'll find truly traditional clams for this dish, however.  Chowder is traditionally made with "chowder clams" or quahogs.  These are very large clams (the shell larger than the palm of your hand).

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When I read Sam's reference to the palm of your hand, I thought I would illustrate.

Whenever Russ goes to Delaware, he brings home either 50 or 100, and we scrub them and freeze them.  It was a wonderful discovery when we realized that when they thaw, they open just so nicely, eliminating that dreaded job of opening those tightly-shut big ol' live chowder clams, like we did for so many years.

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All this discussion is appetizing me, so our clams are thawing. I'll try to remember to snap a shot when they have thawed and opened for us.

[johnnyd]

I went nuts today and did the unspeakable. I added Celery to my otherwise unadulterated Chowder!

I've been tweaking a "Cape Cod" chowdah recipe for a couple years that calls for celery. It's a great idea. I started adding a cup of diced fennel as well, especially if there is cod involved.

As for Salt Pork, I render it completely so I can saute my onion, celery and fennel in it, then apply the salt pork "cracklings" on top of each bowl as a garnish.

[Jason Perlow]

I went nuts today and did the unspeakable. I added Celery to my otherwise unadulterated Chowder!

I've been tweaking a "Cape Cod" chowdah recipe for a couple years that calls for celery. It's a great idea. I started adding a cup of diced fennel as well, especially if there is cod involved.

As for Salt Pork, I render it completely so I can saute my onion, celery and fennel in it, then apply the salt pork "cracklings" on top of each bowl as a garnish.

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Celery is frequently used in Red chowder recipes. Most Manhattan clam chowder served in this area (NY/NJ/CT) of the country has it.

[Jensen]

I've been reading this thread and realising how different the chowders discussed are from the chowders of my youth. All chowders were made with bacon or ham--smoky flavour is good! Celery was de rigeur and the broth was definitely tomato-based. None of that fancy cream soup for us!

And so, I dug out my "recipe book" and tracked down the two recipes I have. When I was in my 20s, I borrowed my mum's recipe box as well as a huge shoebox filled with recipes on notecards and scraps of paper from my grandmother. These were the two chowders that were made in our houses. Anyone from the Lower Mainland or the Island will recognise the name of the first one however I should say that this recipe was from the early days of the ferry system--before my time when there was no cafeteria and the restaurant on the ferry was a sit-down place with table service. The second one is from the Princess Mary, a landmark for Victorians.

Both recipes were printed in the Colonist (before it was the Times-Colonist, which should give some idea of the time frame we're looking at here ) and were adapted for home kitchens. For the non-BCers reading this, "clam nectar" is like clam juice but is sold in large tins (and it's cheap!), not the piddly little glass bottles I see on the shelf of my local Raley's.

And, like most old recipes, there are no real instructions. If you want to try them, you'll have to wing it...

BC Ferries Clam Chowder

This was the preferred chowder in our house.

1/4 lb. bacon, diced

1/3 c. diced onion

1/4 c. carrot, diced

1/4 c. celery, diced

1/4 c. green pepper, diced

2 T. flour

2 c. clam nectar

2/3 c. potato, chopped

1 14-oz. tin tomatoes, chopped with liquid

1 T. tomato paste

1 can clams, with liquid

1/2 tsp Worcestershire sauce

pinch of thyme

salt and pepper to taste

No instructions whatsoever but I do remember my mum always made a flour and water slurry to thicken chowder (if that helps).

Princess Mary Clam Chowder

3 slices bacon

1 tsp thyme

dash sage

1 c. onion

3 c. potato

1/2 c. chopped celery

2 tsp. salt

2 tins baby clams

1 tin tomato soup

1-1/2 c. chopped carrots

5 c. hot water

3 c. clam nectar

1 lg tin tomatoes, chopped, with juice (28 oz, I think)

1/2 tsp pepper

1 T parsley

This one actually has instructions:

Cook. Thicken with flour and water.

[nacho]

And of course, you DON'T have to use clams to make a chowder. Any kind of seafood can be used. In Brooke Dojny's book, she has mussel chowders and fish chowders featured from restaurants in different parts of New England as well. In the Caribbean, they use conch.

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I was actually thinking that the next time I make the Sara Moulton oven baked chowder, I'd use the package of crawfish tails sitting in my freezer. Any ideas from anyone about if any other recipe modifications should be made with crawfish?

[Jason Perlow]

Well if you can make Gumbo with crawfish tails, no reason why you can't make Chowder. I'd lean towards a red chowder though instead of a white one, just because of the amount of fat that crawfish tails have in them.

[johnnyd]

I make a lot of chowder. I usually have about four quarts in my freezer at any given time. Those of you who missed my foodblog: "Dining Downeast" can follow this link to the chowder making chapter.

I happened to have taken a couple pints of a January "brew" out to thaw just before this thread began so we're going to have one for lunch.

I also happen to have a few leftover fresh shrimp to throw in this batch, which was made with two pounds of "chowdah fish" from Harbor Fish Mkt here in downtown Portland. (The chowdah fish offered that day was swordfish, haddock and halibut - for $3.99/lb.)

Note the liquid on top of the thawed chowder pint. The brew that makes it into the freezer is un-creamed and thickened only by fish and potato that has broken down in the cooking.

Therefore, I make a small roux...

...and slowly pour in the broth with a touch of water if it's too gloppy (I hate chowder that makes your spoon stick straight up - but today I wanted it a little on the thick side).

Once it reaches a simmer and it's uniformly heated (never boiled) I add a spoonful of Creme Fraiche and a splash of half n' half (no cream in the fridge today so these work instead).

Add garnish of salt-pork cracklings...

...and serve!

[Jason Perlow]

A more conventional presentation of the seafood chowder we made the other night:

We had this tonight with some shrimp cocktail. The chowder was definitely more intense tasting, after having a night to "cure" in the fridge.

[Sara Moulton]

and I am determined to prepare a kosher chowder  ... probably using salmon (in place of clams or oysters) ...  now must find something to replace the fatback ... and not schmaltz, I assume!

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I am a new englander to the core. Even though I grew up in new york, my folks and their families going way back were from new england/rhode island. So I ate lots of chowder growing up. My grandmother, ruth, made it with haddock on the bone so that the water in the recipe would become a fish stock while the fish was poaching. Anyway, 2 thoughts here:

1. I love Jasper Whites little book which is called (I think) quite simply "Chowder"

and

2. I have a recipe in my first book for smoky salmon chowder with lemon pepper crackers. It has both fresh and smoked salmon in it and is very tasty in my opinion. You soften some chopped onion in butter, add a little bit of flour and cook it a bit. Then whisk in some milk, peeled and cubed boiling potatoes, and finally, when the potatoes are almost tender, a pound of salmon fillet in one piece. After about 5 minutes poaching it is done. You remove and flake it and then return it to the pan with some chopped smoked salmon, dill and lemon juice. The soup might look a little curdled. If you substitute cream for milk, it won't but I think the cream is too heavy.

[Dave the Cook]

Sounds tasty, Sara.

The soup might look a little curdled. If you substitute cream for milk, it won't but I think the cream is too heavy.

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It seems to me that there's probably a fat level between milk and cream that would minimize the tendency to curdle. Maybe sub some half-and-half for the milk? Is that still too rich?

[little ms foodie]

oh man! johhnyd and jason, both of those look soooo good!!!

so on the freezing of chowders, don't freeze if you have added your cream?

[gini]

oh man! johhnyd and jason, both of those look soooo good!!!

so on the freezing of chowders, don't freeze if you have added your cream?

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This semi-relates, so....

I used to work in a seafood shack in NH and we kept the fish/potato/what-have-you mixture seperate from the milk/cream aspect. (We made both clam and fish chowder) Every morning we would take a couple cupfuls of the fish mixture and mix it in a huge pot with some whole milk.

So I'd say keep the non-cream part seperate and freeze, but I don't see any reason why an already made pot won't freeze fine even with cream in it.

[Chris Amirault]

When I read Sam's reference to the palm of your hand, I thought I would illustrate. 

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I went to Whole Foods today to ask the fishmonger if he had quahogs. He said, "Um, yeah, we've got those. ... Steamers, right?"

Thanks to Sam and Susan, I had the "palm of my hand" simile ready to go. But for fuck's sake, is it asking too much of a Whole Foods fish salesman to know what a quahog is? In Providence? In New England?

Yeesh.

[johnnyd]

Yeesh!

Yeesh is right!

I used to work in a seafood shack in NH...

I spent a little time in a surf n' turf in VT and the exec chef made about ten gallons of chowder "base" that was like a grey glue studded mightily with freshly-chopped quahogs (steamed open). A quart of this muck made about 5gals of chowder when mixed (slo-o-wly) with milk.

I froze a batch that I had added dairy to and it separated when thawed - very unappealing. Then I read somewhere that milk/cream goes in the very last to gently incorporate with the chowder. This has brought the best results for me as the dairy is heated to point and not given a chance to break down. It's a triple whamy when dairy is heated then frozen, then heated again - the molecules just don't survive that activity.

[little ms foodie]

Alright, chowder on the menu for tomorrow. The in laws are coming over so there won't be any left to freeze anyway!!

What does everyone serve when chowder is the main part of the meal?

We are warming up sourdough bread and making a nice big green salad.

[Chris Amirault]

Head's up: Jen's two recipes from this post are now in RecipeGullet: BC Ferries Clam Chowder and Princess Mary Clam Chowder. Enjoy!!

[Susan in FL]

Wendy, salad and bread sounds good to go with it. Monday night we had bread and Beaujolais-Villages with our dinner of clam chowder. Sometimes we have a special sandwich when the chowder is a main course.

Here is a pictorial of my participation in this Cook-Off, picking up where I left off. Since there was quite a bit of discussion about salt pork, or "side meat," I'm including a couple photos of the package of what I used this time. I'll let the pictures tell the story. Questions are welcomed, though!

Whenever Russ goes to Delaware, he brings home either 50 or 100, and we scrub them and freeze them.  It was a wonderful discovery when we realized that when they thaw, they open just so nicely, eliminating that dreaded job of opening those tightly-shut big ol' live chowder clams, like we did for so many years.

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All this discussion is appetizing me, so our clams are thawing. I'll try to remember to snap a shot when they have thawed and opened for us.

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[little ms foodie]

looks great Susan, hmmmm.... a little sandwich might be fun!

[johnnyd]

What does everyone serve when chowder is the main part of the meal?

A ham sandwich was my pairing the other day,

Nicely done Susan! That looks delicious.

Edited March 8, 2006 by johnnyd (log)

[Chris Amirault]

With chowdah? Clam cakes, of course!

[little ms foodie]

hmmm...now I'm actually thinking of crab cakes on a bed of greens....

[Susan in FL]

hmmm...now I'm actually thinking of crab cakes on a bed of greens....

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That sounds real good to me, Wendy. Chris's idea is cool, but I tend not to do two preparations of one thing. I'm hung up on odd numbers in menu planning. I might have a clam cake (only we call them clam fritters ) sandwich IF I had say, clams on the half shell for a first course. Then the menu would be a Clam Three Ways dinner. But if not three, I would make the ingredient be something different. And mmmm, a crab cake sandwich or crab cake on salad greens sounds wonderful!

[Shalmanese]

However, the contentious Australians at the Sydney Convention & Exhibition Center offer this brief definition:

Creamy soup originating from the west coast of the USA, usually made with corn, potato and shell fish.

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Uh... I order to make up for my Australian brethern, I present this chowder I made a few months ago:

We don't have clams in Australia so I used the local equivilant which is pippies. I also added some sundried tomatos which didn't thrill me in the end and will probably be left out of the next version.

[Chris Amirault]

Just so's weah cleah: clam cakes in RI means clam fritters, deep-fried walnuts of clammy goodness. It's the classic side for chowdah heah.