"Beginner" Beer

[Susan in FL]

John, I'm glad you took my post in kind, or at least so it seemed. I was kidding and serious, both. And yours were great suggestions for "beginner beer" as the original post asked!

Yes definitely, we know more than the masses about good beer (well put!), and I have to remind myself about "to each his own" and "it's a matter of personal taste," etc. My husband has also reminded me not to be snobbish about beer, like many are about wine. I love wine, too, but I have pride in that there seem to be less beer snobs than wine snobs in this world.

I also want to add that the Mexican beers are like they are for a reason and lime goes well with them for a reason. I prefer heavier beers; as all my beer friends know, I'm a serious hophead; I love drinking stouts, especially in the morning; I love barleywine. But, living in Florida where it's hot more months than not, I have learned that there are times that all one can do is quickly toss down a lighter beer,* and Corona surely has its place. I think it's sort of like the good tasting ice water or lawnmower beer of the tropics.

* For me lighter beers do exclude Coors Light, Bud Light, etc. I can't stomach them.

Edited October 27, 2004 by Susan in FL (log)

[jsolomon]

Susan, I'm going to say--and be struck down by some--that the beer that is eternally refreshing in those types of climes are the IPA... India Pale Ales, with their inherent lightness and hoppiness are amazingly refreshing.

Of course, as I type this, I'm drinking warm michelob from on TOP of the refrigerator. I grok all beer.

[Susan in FL]

Susan, I'm going to say--and be struck down by some--that the beer that is eternally refreshing in those types of climes are the IPA... India Pale Ales, with their inherent lightness and hoppiness are amazingly refreshing.

Of course, as I type this, I'm drinking warm michelob from on TOP of the refrigerator.  I grok all beer.

←

IPA is still my most frequent choice, no matter how hot it is outside, except for when I am doing yard work or something like that. And water or Mexican beer if I am doing such a thing.

[joey madison]

I'd like to echo the commentary of those suggesting Belgians as good beginner beers. I have several friends who are not big beer fans whom I occasionally draft into service as drinking buddies. I've had them try Maudite by Unibroue in Quebec and New Glarus Beglian Red from Wisconsin, and they always love it.

Sometimes weiss beers can be a good suggestion. I know Sprecher and Great Dane here in Wisconsin make some excellent wheats that would be a treat even for those who aren't accustomed to beer.

[john b]

John, I'm glad you took my post in kind, or at least so it seemed.    I was kidding and serious, both.  And yours were great suggestions for "beginner beer" as the original post asked!

Yes definitely, we know more than the masses about good beer (well put!), and I have to remind myself about "to each his own" and "it's a matter of personal taste," etc.  My husband has also reminded me not to be snobbish about beer, like many are about wine.  I love wine, too, but I have pride in that there seem to be less beer snobs than wine snobs in this world.

I also want to add that the Mexican beers are like they are for a reason and lime goes well with them for a reason.  I prefer heavier beers; as all my beer friends know, I'm a serious hophead; I love drinking stouts, especially in the morning; I love barleywine.  But, living in Florida where it's hot more months than not, I have learned that there are times that all one can do is quickly toss down a lighter beer,* and Corona surely has its place.  I think it's sort of like the good tasting ice water or lawnmower beer of the tropics.

* For me lighter beers do exclude Coors Light, Bud Light, etc.  I can't stomach them.

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When it's hot (and it doesn't really get Florida hot in NJ), I like beers like Hoegarden, Victory Whirlwind Wit, etc. Something about the lightness, slight yeastiness and hint of lemon/citrus is pefect on hot days.

[2roost]

Since it appears you are in Phoenix, I would suggest you try out.

http://www.porterhousepub.com/# or http://www.sonorabrew.com/home.html

Spend a bit of time at the Bar, chat with the Bartender - start with the Pale Ales or the Maibock and "find your groove"

Good luck and happy tasting.

[Chrisser]

WOW how snotty. My Corona suggestion was aimed at the non-beer drinker, and I think you're all crazy to suggest someone start with a heavy Belgian brew. I'm Canadian and I can't do coors light and bud, my favorite beer is Smithwicks personally. AND I don't care what the mexicans call it, it is a good starter beer!

[Okbrewer]

Most "non-beer drinkers" or those who think they don't like beer, use as their frame of reference beers like Corona, Bud, Miller, Coors, etal, fizzy light lager beers that have no real taste. With that being the case, introducing them to something that doesn't taste like they expect a beer to taste like, usually is an eye opener. Belgian beers aren't all 'heavy' beers! But, Belgian beers are typically full of flavor and aroma that one doesn't get from a mainstream beer. Many Belgian beers even taste more like wine, and non-beer drinkers often will drink wine when they think they don't like beer. Point is, we all, all of us beer snobs, have to do our part to educate the poor as yet unenlightened masses. Identifiying and introducing them to a 'transitional' beer is the first step. That obviously depends on the individual's personal preferences and on what is available. So get out there and do your part to initiate folks to the wonders of beer, and enough of this in-fighting!

[Chris Amirault]

Most "non-beer drinkers" or those who think they don't like beer, use as their frame of reference beers like Corona, Bud, Miller, Coors, etal, fizzy light lager beers that have no real taste.  With that being the case, introducing them to something that doesn't taste like they expect a beer to taste like, usually is an eye opener.

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This seems very smart. Non-beer-drinkers -- and particularly ones who find their way to eGullet, of all places -- probably think of beers in precisely this way. So perhaps something with intensity, flavor, body... perhaps that is precisely where to start.

I might have missed this suggestion in another post, but while travelling though Virginia last winter we stopped at a brew pub that had a great idea: they served six, 2 oz servings of each brew in small glasses. We got an IPA, a scotch ale, a pilsner, a Christmas ale, a porter, and ... well, I'm proud to get five. My wife, who is not a big beer drinker, would have gagged if I had described what scotch ale tastes like, but actually by tasting it she realized she liked it.

I fixed a spelling error -- CA

Edited November 4, 2004 by chrisamirault (log)

[Chrisser]

Those are excellent points and thanks for not being rude! Read back you'll see I never intended to "fight".

Staying away from your beer snobbery threads, thanks.

[Okbrewer]

My wife, who is not a big beer drinker, would have gagged if I had described what scotch ale tastes like, but actually by tasting it she realized she liked it.

My wife is exactly the same way. She does not like beer, or so she thought, until I introduced her to a Belgian Framboise! Then a Kriek! Then the Peche! Then we moved away from the fruity stuff into more malty sweet beers, and she realized that it was HOPS she didn't much care for (in fact she may even be a bit allergic to hops) and not 'beer' in general. You just have to explore, find something you like and then that may lead to other explorations! Ain't beer grand!?

Chrisser! Don't go away mad! You have much to contribute and this is a great place to also learn about beers. Even though we may be beer snobs, we're FUN beer snobs!

[Chrisser]

MMMMMM Belle-Vue Kriek, with chocolate.

At first I too had a tough time with hops, quickly discovered I prefer a maltier, more molasses-flavored brew. As you're into Belgians, can you suggest a dark ale on the sweet side for me to try? As I mentioned earlier, my favorite beer is Smithwicks. (Former Irish Pub employee)

OK, OK.... YOU're friendly.

Edited November 4, 2004 by Chrisser (log)

[Okbrewer]

Chrisser.

One of my most favorite Belgian breweries is De Dolle, and just about anything they make I like! But to satisfy your sweet tooth, and to kinda get in the holiday spirit, you might want to try Stille Nacht. It is caramelly sweet with a subtle, soothing alcohol burn. Or if you fancy something with a bit more of an alcohol bite, their Tripel, Dulle Teve (Mad Bitch) is good. You could also go with the biers from Rochefort. Try the 6, 8, and 10 and do a side-by-side comparison. You will probably like the 10 pretty well! Let us know what you try and how you liked it.

[StudentChefEclipse]

I am busily printing out this topic! Such great info. Tasting notes to come.

[El Ron de Cuba]

If we're talking mass market beer, I do actually like the Mexican brews. Although I appreciate a good microbrew (we have a decent brewpub here in Morgantown), I usually go for the "heavier" (if you could call them that) Mexican beers.

I agree with the above posts about the yukkiness of Corona; I think it would be fine as a thirst quencher...if it were priced at a point against Bud Light!!!!!

The Mexicans I would recommend are Negra Modelo (Viennese lager style) and Tecate (a light lager). I hear Carta Blanca is good, too, but can't say from my own experience.

Bruce

[alphaiii]

If we're talking mass market beer, I do actually like the Mexican brews.  Although I appreciate a good microbrew (we have a decent brewpub here in Morgantown), I usually go for the "heavier" (if you could call them that) Mexican beers.

I agree with the above posts about the yukkiness of Corona; I think it would be fine as a thirst quencher...if it were priced at a point against Bud Light!!!!!

The Mexicans I would recommend are Negra Modelo (Viennese lager style) and Tecate (a light lager).  I hear Carta Blanca is good, too, but can't say from my own experience.

Bruce

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For Mexican beer I like Dos Equis alot. Tecate wasn't too bad, I had alot of that when I was in Mexico this past spring.

[BrentKulman]

As you're into Belgians, can you suggest a dark ale on the sweet side for me to try?

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Just stumbled across this thread, but I'll make two suggestions for Belgian Strong Dark Ales: Nostradamus and Delirium Nocturnum

Both have deep fruity flavors, a good bit of alcohol and are best served only slightly chilled. Nostradamus tastes of dried dark fruits such as raisins, figs and dates with a hint of floral and butterscotch flavors. It has a slight sourness to balance the primary sweet flavors. Delirium Nocturnum is a similar sweet and sour blend, but has more of an apple and caramel flavor. Both are highly carbonated, so be careful when you pour.

As these beers warm in the glass, I find they are wonderful to sip, just as you would an after dinner liqueur.

Oh, and the bottles are great fun to look at, too.

Edited November 10, 2004 by Brent Kulman (log)

[Susan in FL]

I agree with you, and especially on this, which is the case we often encounter...

...fine as a thirst quencher...if it were priced at a point against Bud Light!!!!!

[malarkey]

I think you'd do fine to add a Belgian Wit to your sampling. It certainly fits the 'dramatically different from how macros taste' department. And its a Belgian that isn't heavy.

Look for Hoegaarden, Unibroue's Blanche de Chambley, Delirium Tremens I *believe* is also wit style.. oh, and La Chouffe Golden.

[BrentKulman]

Look for Hoegaarden, Unibroue's Blanche de Chambley, Delirium Tremens I *believe* is also wit style.. oh, and La Chouffe Golden.

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Delirium Tremens is actually a Belgian Strong Dark Ale and is a wonderful brew.

Witbiers are a very different style, with their bananas, orange peel and coriander characteristics. Personally, I'm not a big fan but I don't generally care for wheat beers. A lot of beer connoisseurs love them and also a lot of folks who don't generally like the taste of beer like them, too.

Guess that's what makes the world go 'round.

[prasantrin]

Most "non-beer drinkers" or those who think they don't like beer, use as their frame of reference beers like Corona, Bud, Miller, Coors, etal, fizzy light lager beers that have no real taste. 

I've never been too fond of beer, but I have to admit, those were the ones I kind of liked.

Now that y'all know I have no taste in beer, for a non-beer drinker, which would you recommend: Guinness or Kilkenny? Those will be my only two choices, and I feel I must choose one. Either that, or go for water, and I'm in the mood to stretch my horizons.

I'm not very fluent in beer-speak, but I don't care much for bitterness. I do, however, like that malty aftertaste that can be found with some beers. Are either Guinness or Kilkenny low on biterness but heavy on malty aftertaste?

Help this neophyte, please!

[Angeline7270]

They had Hacker-Pschorr Weisse on tap at the restaurant I used to work at. I really enjoyed that beer, no bitter aftertaste at all. I'd recommend it for someone who thinks they don't like beer.

[mtigges]

Most "non-beer drinkers" or those who think they don't like beer, use as their frame of reference beers like Corona, Bud, Miller, Coors, etal, fizzy light lager beers that have no real taste. 

Now that y'all know I have no taste in beer, for a non-beer drinker, which would you recommend: Guinness or Kilkenny? Those will be my only two choices, and I feel I must choose one. Either that, or go for water, and I'm in the mood to stretch my horizons.

Are either Guinness or Kilkenny low on biterness but heavy on malty aftertaste?

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Both of those beers are among the lowest bittered beers you can find (at all, not just for the style). But neither is a particularly good example of the style. (Caveat if you're in Dublin drinking real Guiness.)

I would suggest to try both, since they are not at all alike. Kilkenny is a malty pale ale usually served with nitrogen, some people consider Kilkenny an Irish Red Ale, but I am unsure if that style has a good enough definition. Guiness is a stout and is almost always served with nitrogen.

So, how about the bitterness? As I said, both are quite low in bittering. Kilkenny is perhaps a bit higher, but it will not likely seem so. The reason for that is that being a stout, Guiness shows some roasted flavours. So, it gets some bitterness from the black malt, and roast malt that is in it's grist. Think the kind of bittering that you get in coffee. The bittering in Kilkenny is solely from the addition of hops early in the boil. Guiness also has a bittering hop addition, but it is not predominant in the style.

One more thing, you will likely be told that Guiness is a heavy beer. Despite the name stout this is completely untrue. There are many different versions of Guiness available all over the world. Some are heavy, most are not. You will likely get a version that is very light. Think Michelobe extra. Most Guiness available in north america is brewed by Labatts, and is around 3.5% and is in fact quite dry. It definitely qualifies as a low carb beer. The predominance of stout flavour though makes it a much more satisfying experience than gagging down a some of the other diet beers.

After all that, Kilkenny is definitely higher in malty after taste.

If you're only after pure advocacy, I would always choose an unchallenging fresh locally made beer over anything that was produced in a factory. Typically, women will like wheat beers (Hefeweizen, Weisse, Wit), or fruit lambics like Kriek, and men will like something that is close enough to macroswill - just with more taste, like Kolsch, Marzen, Pale Ale, Dort Export.

[prasantrin]

Thanks for the replies! I wish I could find Hacker-Pschorr Weisse, but I'm going to an Irish pub (in Japan, no less) and all they have are Guinness and Kilkenny, and a number of whiskies, but I like whiskey even less than I like beer.

I think I will try Kilkenny first--it's the higer malty after taste that pushed it into first place. And then if I have room, I'll hit the Guinness. Having never finished a beer in my 36 years, though, that might be too much for one night!

Thanks again, and I'll let you know if I enjoy my first foray into beers!

[prasantrin]

I tried the Kilkenny, and I liked it! It was creamy, slightly sweet, and not very carbonated--perfect for someone like me! I don't know if this is the usual flavour of Kilkenny, or just the flavour of the Japanese version, but I really liked it. I'd have had another, but I had work to do after dinner and I needed to stay sober (I'm a cheap drunk, what can I say?). Next time, I may even get a whole pint! Or try the Guinness, too!