Café Gray Pre-Opening Discussion

[alanamoana]

i agree with marcus on the possibilities for inconsistency at most restaurants in nyc. there definitely is favoritism on all counts, which stinks if you are a special occasion diner and happen to end up eating at a restaurant when "vip"s are present.

but...

cafe gray is meant to be a more casual dining experience than adny or per se. this is not to say that it won't be formal at all, just think about the chef and the physical restaurant itself, but that the kind of food he is attempting to execute may be a tad bit easier on the kitchen than what he was producing at lespinasse.

also, trust me when i say that every line-cook, prep-cook, dishwasher, etc. is being hand picked and culled through as we speak. people have been waiting months for the restaurant to open with little or no income. they have as much invested in the success of this place as kunz.

another thing, i don't believe they'll open for the projected seven days a week, three meals a day thing right away. it is usually the case that a restaurant opens six days a week for dinner only and gradually introduces the other options. it is a way of breaking in the staff as the initial turnover and needs of the kitchen become apparent.

Edited April 2, 2004 by alanamoana (log)

[Fat Guy]

A 120 restaurant open 7 days with 3 dinner seatings is common in NY, it may be no big deal, but in my view it has yet to be done successfully to produce excellence with consistency.

It's no big deal anywhere for a cafe or brasserie or steakhouse to have twice that many seats and as many sittings. I agree that nobody in New York has pulled off a fine-dining restaurant at that number without compromises -- and in fact I think your formulation is exactly correct and the best statement of the issue I've heard in that regard -- but Cafe Gray isn't modeled after Gramercy Tavern, where the opening promise was that it would be the first four-star American restaurant. Cafe Gray is modeled after the cafe-brasserie axis. It seems to me that Gray Kunz is trying to capture the high end of that formula. And, although I had some initial suspicions that Cafe Gray would be pulled in a fine dining direction, I'm reasonably certain after talking to the chef that he's a true believer in the upscale cafe concept. I suppose he'll satisfy his higher-level creativity at the chef's table and perhaps in a future fine-dining venture. But as for the main part of Cafe Gray, I think the proper operational reference points lie somewhere on the spectrum between brasseries like Pastis-Schiller's-Balthazar and the new-breed upscale steakhouses.

[Jinmyo]

all of Kunz's little twists on the formula (the way several ribs are butchered to give the appearance of one big rib, the cooking under weight/pressure, the saucing) yield what scores of seasoned veteran diners have declared the definitive short rib dish of all time. Now, you'll be able to sidle up at the Cafe Gray bar and get that dish any time, and at lunchtime you can get a sandwich version -- basically the same meat preparation but done panini-style. I find that prospect appealing.

I find that appealing too.

Steve, where can I find [will you please find for me] further information on the menu?

[Fat Guy]

The menus are in draft form. There hasn't been any sort of formal pre-release or anything like that. I know the risotto and short ribs are locked in not only because they're Gray Kunz's major signatures but also because they've purchased specialized bowls and silver pots for the risotto service and they've devoted some effort to developing the best butchering system for the short ribs. But if you look at the draft menus they have taped to the wall in the temporary office, there are all sorts of notations and colors, dish descriptions are in constant flux, they're still meeting with suppliers (as I was leaving the meat guy was coming in), etc.

The breakfast menu looks like it will take an ingredients-centric approach to that meal. The emphasis is on products from Ronnybrook, Emmi (yogurt from Switzerland), Vermont Butter & Cheese Co., and Knoll Krest (eggs). The thing that jumped out at me from the lunch menu was the short rib panini-style sandwich, but that menu seemed to be in a much earlier stage of development than the others. At the bar, there's some overlap with the main menu items as well as pomelo crusted scallops with pickled ramps and some sort of fancy low-acidity sherry-like vingearish substance that I tasted a capful of (it was excellent) and grilled shrimp and green mango salad with kaffir remoulade. I believe the scallops will be sold by the piece at the bar (I think they were looking at $3.50 a piece) and as a portion of 6 on the main menu. The tentative price on that shrimp dish was, I believe, $18. The dinner menu had a range of stuff including some trout (I think) from Tasmania (big article on Tasmania in this month's Saveur), Dover sole, the short rib dish, I think the maple-shallot chicken dish he developed with Peter Kaminsky is still on there, the risotto as an appetizer, and a bunch of other stuff. I took a few notes on the menus but quickly realized it would be premature to report in detail on a bunch of dishes that may never see the light of day, especially since, with delays, the restaurant is probably going to open with a spring menu and then move quickly into a summer menu.

The only thing I actually ate were some of pastry chef Chris Broberg's signature lavender-scented white-chocolate-crunch petits fours. But I only ate about 30 of them.

I'm going to sit in on an actual menu-planning session in a couple of weeks. As I mentioned above, this is all primarily about research for my book, but I'll share whatever I'm allowed to share here. If the chef asks me not to share menu details pre-opening, I'll have to respect that. If not, I'll tell you everything I know.

[Jinmyo]

Thanks, Steve.

[herbacidal]

The only thing I actually ate were some of pastry chef Chris Broberg's signature lavender-scented white-chocolate-crunch petits fours. But I only ate about 30 of them.

Glad to see you're cutting down.

[bloviatrix]

FG, who is their target audience for breakfast -- Time Warner execs? Guests from the Mandarin?

[Fat Guy]

Me!

[bloviatrix]

Me!

And the other 119 seats?

[Daniel]

Does anyone have the phone number?

[Fat Guy]

They're listing 212-343-1551 on the under-construction Web site http://www.cafegray.com

[Bux]

The few meals I had at Lespinasse were among my best in NY. They were certainly the best by far, of anything that could be described as fusion and I might blame Kunz for being the one who gave me hope I might soon find other good fusion food. That led to a lot of disappointing meals. I felt Kunz's identity was all wrapped up in the Asian inspired spicing and flavors until I dined at Lespinasse in the company of someone who had met Kunz professionally. The meal he cooked for us, was almost devoid of fusion influences, although not devoid of creativity by a long shot. Short ribs and short rib sandwiches at lunch doesn't strike me as an unusual way to go for a mature chef who's already proven one kind of point. There's a whole generation of Parisian chefs who came out of haute cuisine restaurants and started a bistro revival movement cooking old fashioned sometimes rustic and always affordable food. It's reported that Yves Camdeborde who owns one of the most notable of these bistros--la Régalade--has sold his restaurant and plans to open a small place serving brasserie stule food for lunch only.

[Fat Guy]

You've got to remember that Gray Kunz comes by his fusion organically. He was born in Asia and grew up with those flavors, and he also cheffed at the luxury end of the Asian hotel industry. Those flavors and that palate are simply part of his culinary toolkit, just as is his European training under Girardet, and the American sensibility he has developed here.

And as Peter Kaminsky helped Gray Kunz express so clearly in his cookbook, the Kunz style is very much the product of a flavor balance and tension system that transcends any sort of geographic sense. The creativity you might see in an identifiably French Kunz dish and in an identifiably Asian-fusion Kunz dish are, to Kunz I think, the same thing.

This brief narrative, from Kaminsky's New York Magazine article on Kunz and Keller, is a telling demonstration of the Kunz creative process. This is a description of what happened when Kunz and Kaminsky went to a regular old supermarket in order to do a chicken dish demonstrating the aspect of bitterness:

“Bitter, okay, let’s start with almonds,” he said and flipped a pack of shelled almonds into the shopping cart.

“Now to balance it, something fruity,” he mused as his gaze lit on dried cranberries. “These will be exactly right because cranberries have a bitter edge but some sweetness.”

Shallots came next, because Kunz likes shallots whenever he can work them into a recipe. They broaden flavor with their aroma and underscore any sweetness in a dish. Leeks work to similar effect but are a little more focused, so he picked some of them, too. He was getting up a head of steam at this point. “Okay, some vinegar for acidity,” which brightens taste. “I think we’ll use cider vinegar because apples are a fall item and so are cranberries.”

He paused to consider his next move. “Apple-cider vinegar, cranberries. It feels New Englandy. Let’s go for sweetness with maple syrup to balance things out. And nutmeg—that will give it a bouquet that keeps the flavors from getting too diffuse. Anyway, when I think of New England in the fall I like apple cider with a grating of nutmeg.” Finally, butter, because such a hearty, rustic dish cries out for nuttiness.

http://www.newyorkmetro.com/nymetro/food/features/n_9682/

[slkinsey]

Thanks for the link, Steven. I found this one of the most interesting things Kunz had to say:

"What I tried to do at Lespinasse I want to do at Café Gray in a more casual and affordable way,” he explains. “Not dumbed down, just not truffled up.

I, for one, await the opening of Cafe Gray with great anticipation, and look forward to experiencing it more than any of the other TWC ventures.

[hshiau]

They're listing 212-343-1551 on the under-construction Web site http://www.cafegray.com

Sorry if this question has been previously asked but I'm new here. Are they taking reservations?

[Fat Guy]

They don't have an opening date yet. I believe they'll start taking reservations shortly before opening.

[Jinmyo]

You've got to remember that Gray Kunz comes by his fusion organically.

Exactly so.

[cbarre02]

With a front kitchen like that, there is plenty of space to feed all those people (and feed them well). There is also plenty of space to build a great, and large line team (i know i would love to work that line, stainless beauty). Plus the prep area, wich i am sure will be worked all day long. All they need are a few hard working sous chefs, who are after prefection as much as Chef Kunz. I am quite sure that he has made it part of his business, to find those kind of people. This is a very doable project, and i think that it will be well executed. Over time Chef Kunz notices a young mind that he trusts and makes them chef de cuisine, and then the restaurant has a new breath. Yet it is still bound in Kunz food. It is not one man going at this alone (or at least i doubt), put hard working prefectionists, who get along, in a kitchen together and the restults could be amazing.

Edited April 3, 2004 by cbarre02 (log)

[Fat Guy]

One of Gray Kunz's former Lespinasse sous-chefs is the chef-de-cuisine (or executive chef; I'm not sure what title system they're using), and I recognized a few other Lespinasse names on the staff list (most notably beverage director Alexander Adlgasser) but I need to figure out how to spell everybody's name before I post any of that info. I met so many people so quickly there wasn't time to get it all down.

[alanamoana]

Larry Finn is the Executive Chef

[Fat Guy]

If you look in the fourth photograph above, Larry is the guy in the blue shirt and blue jeans. Obscured by Larry, in the yellow sweatshirt, is Jimi Yui the kitchen designer. Gray Kunz is the man in the sportcoat. And the guy with his back to the camera is Chris Broberg, the pastry chef. Jimi and Chris are more visible in the fifth photo. The other two key kitchen manager types seemed to be the two guys on the far right of the fifth photo. I have to get their names.

[Fat Guy]

Well . . . there have of course been some delays. It's looking now like an August opening. I was in today and the dining room is still quite a ways away from being completed. The good news is the kitchen is working.

The menu is in an early stage of development, and there is a story to tell about the evolution of the dishes that would be inappropriate for me to tell without the perspective of the final plates. Gray Kunz's experiments, flights of fancy, and mistakes, however, put most chefs' signature dishes to shame. We had some amazing food at today's menu tasting -- the kitchen team was kind enough to make a couple of extra plates of all the dishes they tested today, so that Ellen and I could sample them. The tastes brough back memories of what I so love about Kunz's food: you take a bite and, after processing its fundamental deliciousness, you say "What the fuck is in this sauce?" And then you take another bite and say "Holy shit is that fennel? And is it pickled?" And each time you take another bite you experience the dish in a whole new way. You definitely don't want to dine with non-foodies at a Gray Kunz restaurant, because you really need everybody to shut up so you can experience the commanding presence of the cuisine.

So, more to follow as the menus take shape. What I will say right now for the record is: Gray Kunz is back.

[MonsieurSatran]

Any updates on when Cafe Gray will open?

[Fat Guy]

Well . . . I was in touch with the pastry team last week and got a heads-up that "things are really starting to happen now." So far I don't think there has been any revision to a projected August opening. I'll try to visit this coming week and see what I can learn.

[sammy]

An amusing piece on Cafe Gray's false starts since February in today's NY Post.