Masa and Bar Masa

[loremipsum]

How does lunch (@175) compare to the dinner in terms of quality and value?

Has anyone been there for lunch?

cheers,

andrew

[ducphat30]

You know, I think I have an idea for Mr. Bourdain's next Food Network series: $400 -- no make that $1000 (Or More) A Day. Yes, it's the upscale version of Rachael Ray's show. Tony Bourdain tours the world and shows you where to go if you have an unlimited budget and want to eat the best of the best. Even more important, he explains what makes a great restaurant great.

And of course, if Mr. Bourdain ever needs a researcher or dining companion, I gladly volunteer my services.

I'd like to officially submit my resume for "roadie".

Side note: Are there any four star joints in Morrocco, I feel a return to the desert would make a great show.

[bpearis]

Adam Platt reviews Masa in the April 26 issue of New York Magazine.

Masa is a curiously refracted experience, one that changes in subtle ways depending on where you dine, what time you dine, and even who you’re dining with.

Edited April 16, 2004 by slkinsey (log)

[Fat Guy]

"Masa is a curiously refracted experience, one that changes in subtle ways depending on where you dine, what time you dine, and even who you’re dining with."

And that makes it different from every other restaurant in the universe how?

[SobaAddict70]

And that makes it different from every other restaurant in the universe how?

It's all about Masa's aura of "ambiance" and "exclusivity", don'cha know.

Soba

[bpearis]

Moira Hodgson, in Monday's Observer, says Masa is good but maybe not worth the price (to paraphrase):

If I want great sushi in a more romantic atmosphere, I’ll go to Jewel Bako or Megu

[bloviatrix]

Moira Hodgson, in Monday's Observer, says Masa is good but maybe not worth the price (to paraphrase):

If I want great sushi in a more romantic atmosphere, I’ll go to Jewel Bako or Megu

Along those lines, the reviewer at the NY Sun, said that although it was the best sushi he's ever eaten, the only way he would return to Masa is if someone else picked up the tab.

[twodogs]

after reading the ny times review today (or was it just an account of someone who got paid to eat at the most expensive restaurant in the city?) i am floored. does this mean all of amanda's previous reviews are shall we say up in the air and to truly be decided by frank bruni. i here spice market then may get four stars.

thoughts on our wasted times.

cheers

[oakapple]

The Amanda Hesser era ended today with her final New York Times review. Masa received no rating, but Hesser said:

Masa is my last review as the interim restaurant critic. After several visits, my impressions are firm: four stars when dining at the sushi bar and three stars at the tables. If forced, I could settle on one, but I would rather not. Instead, I will look forward to reading, in the future, what The Times's new permanent critic, Frank Bruni, thinks of it.

The review on the Times website ends with four question marks where the rating would normally go.

Her view that the experience varies tremendously depending on whether you sit at the sushi bar or the tables echoes curiously Adam Platt's comment in New York Magazine mentioned earlier in this thread:

Masa is a curiously refracted experience, one that changes in subtle ways depending on where you dine, what time you dine, and even who you’re dining with.

Edited June 2, 2004 by oakapple (log)

[oakapple]

thoughts on our wasted times.

I don't consider it a waste at all. Presumably we look forward to the reviews for their text, not just for the number of stars at the end. Now, if you think the review is poorly written, that's fair enough (although I saw nothing wrong with it). But if you feel the review is a waste without stars, then we might as well kill the Asimov reviews and the Friday Diner's Journal columns, none of which have stars.

Does this mean all of Amanda's previous reviews are shall we say up in the air and to truly be decided by Frank Bruni?

Any review reflects no more than the critic's opinion that day, and is subject to be re-evaluated at some point in the indefinite future - either by that critic, or his/her successor. Obviously, we can reasonably expect a Frank Bruni look at Masa within the next half-year or so. Others she reviewed may not be revisited for a very long time, if ever.

Edited June 2, 2004 by oakapple (log)

[bleudauvergne]

I read it and got this incredible sense of deja vu.

It is nice to see the story of how Madame Hesser has developed a relationship with the proprietor and his wife and her descriptions of them coming through. It seems she is a regular there. I got to wondering how many times a week she has a meal in their restaurant.

A few courses later comes tempura. On one visit, it was fried wild watercress, sent by Mr. Takayama's mother in Japan,

Sometimes it is a wisp of halibut, a fish distinguished by its crunch, brushed with nikiri sauce. Or calamari, sprinkled with sea salt, and yuzu. On various visits, I have had shiitake; grilled scallop; sweet shrimp; mackerel; and ume, shredded shiso and sesame seed rolled into a slender and crisp sheet of toasted nori. All of it has been pristine, vibrant and utterly delicious.

The talk of stars at the end got me a little bit confused, though. Has this restaurant been awarded a rating based on this review?

Edited June 2, 2004 by bleudauvergne (log)

[SobaAddict70]

Any impressions on whether the rating, or lack thereof, will have any impact on future diners who may not have had the experience or wherewithal to have dined at Ginza Sushi-ko (Masa's former establishment in Beverly Hills)?

Soba

Admin edit: All threads relating primarily to discussion of Masa and Bar Masa have been merged.

Edited June 2, 2004 by SobaAddict70 (log)

[bloviatrix]

Although I think it was a cop-out not to give any stars, I actually thought Hesser wrote a fantastic piece. IMO, this was probably the strongest of all her reviews.

[greenfield]

I don't consider it a waste at all. Presumably we look forward to the reviews for their text, not just for the number of stars at the end.

Ditto.

I thought it was a fantastic review. Not only do I have a very good idea of what dining at Masa is like, but also I got a tip on what to avoid. I think it was one of Amanda Hesser's best reviews. I definitely want to go to Masa now, but I don't think it is something I can afford right now.

For an interesting related article, check out Eric Asimov's review of Ginza Sushiko in his regular $250 and over column in the May 17, 2000 edition of The Times, And when $300 would feed a crowd? The column name was a joke, of course; it appeared in the dining section next to an article discussing rising restaurant prices and prompted by Alain Ducasse's new restaurant. I apologize if the link doesn't work; you can find the article on The Times's website by searching for Ginza Sushiko in the archives.

[bpearis]

I have a feeling that AH's dining experience may not be the one most people get. I think those known to Masa are the only people complaining that it is too much food.

[oakapple]

Any impressions on whether the rating, or lack thereof, will have any impact on future diners who may not have had the experience or wherewithal to have dined at Ginza Sushi-ko (Masa's former establishment in Beverly Hills)?

I would guess not. Masa isn't exactly catering to the type of diners who bring up the Times website on a whim, to see what the paper is recommending these days. Although no formal rating was assigned, anyone who reads the final paragraph will see that AH considers it a four-star experience, provided you sit at the sushi bar.

Although slightly off-topic for this thread, it's questionable under what circumstances any NYT review significantly affects a restaurant's bottom line. It has been more than three months since Hesser gave Asiate just one star, but it remains a hot restaurant. I suspect the hip places that "everyone's talking about" aren't much affected by what the Times says - at least not in the short term.

Where I think the Times review does matter a lot, is for those restaurants that aren't on anyone's hot list. I'm sure Wallsé's bookings picked up significantly after Hesser's recent review, even though all she was doing was to re-affirm a two-star rating the paper had previously given.

So, to bring it back on-topic, I doubt that what Hesser said matters much to Masa. And if there were an effect - positive or negative - it would only be temporary, as the paper is all but promising a second review early in Bruni's tenure.

[Pan]

It was indeed odd for Ms. Hesser not to settle on a star rating, but the conclusion was an effective piece of theatrical suspense to prepare the grand entrance of Mr. Bruni. I agree with others that this was a great review, though, and Hesser's best as Interim Critic - and that's more important to me.

[Timo]

the conclusion was an effective piece of theatrical suspense to prepare the grand entrance of Mr. Bruni

still... the piece did leave me with a slightly bitter aftertaste of hessergate...

[SobaAddict70]

Next might come a tiny coupe glass, filled with a dollop of toro, a heap of osetra caviar and a squeeze of sudachi (a variety of lime, tiny as a kumquat). You are given a red lacquer spoon to spread it onto crisp toasts cut into perfect dominoes.

Hum. I must ponder this.

Soba

[AndrewG]

Had dinner at Masa Sat. nite. This is not a full review but some quick comments (with reference to a few previous posts).

Yes, it was that good. Yes, it lives up to the hype. It was far and away the best sushi I have ever head (caveat: I have only had top notch sushi in NY, nowhere else). It blows away Sushi Yasuda or Kuruma Zushi. We were indeed served, as Hesser states, too much food (an immense amount of fantastic toro). I was actually praying towards the end of the meal that the food would stop coming.

Was it worth the money? No. My girlfriend and I had the exact same reaction: if it were $200 less expensive, it would be worth it. But for that amount of money, we’d rather go to Per Se or ADNY and still have enough left over for a couple of lunches at Blue Ribbon Sushi. Having said that, if money were no object I’d never eat sushi again anywhere else in NY.

Does Masa deserve 4 stars? This is a question that has been stuck in my mind since about halfway thru our dinner. I think it does (though this is based only on one meal at the sushi bar). I think Hesser got it exactly right when she said, “No matter how exquisite its food, a three-star restaurant does not have this power to transport you.” My experience at Masa was as “transporting” as any meal I have had in the U.S.

[richl2214]

Nice little synopsis. What was your total bill if you say it was too expensive? Did it include drinks ie sake? Is it a price fixe meal?

Finally, how would you compare the quality of the sushi to Blue Ribbon which I consider well above average quality?

[AndrewG]

What was your total bill if you say it was too expensive? Did it include drinks ie sake? Is it a price fixe meal?

The food charge was $300 per person. There is no menu; they just start placing food in front of you. We had two carafes (for lack of a better term) of sake. I think one was $18 and one was around $50. They include an 18% service charge in the bill. Total bill, including tax and the service charge was about $850 for two people.

Finally, how would you compare the quality of the sushi to Blue Ribbon which I consider well above average quality?

I like Blue Ribbon a lot but I’d go as far as to say the difference between Masa and Blue Ribbon is probably about the same as the difference between Blue Ribbon and one of those all-you-can-eat sushi places for $9.99. I’m not an expert on sushi (or on anything else for that matter) so I can’t really speak specifically to the quality of the fish. What I can say is that I’ve never had toro or mackerel or horse mackerel or blue fin tuna or sea urchin (or frankly, anything else that we ate) anywhere near this level of mouth-watering goodness. I can still taste it!!! But, it is not just the quality of the fish that differentiates the sushi (and its not just sushi: we had among other things, fois gras, soft shell crab, grapefruit granite for dessert…) It’s also the quality of the grated wasabi, the grated yuzu, the rice, etc.

[sashimi]

Andrew -- thanks for the great review!

Would you mind going over what you actually ate? I have friends that have dined at Masa recently and the overwhelming consensus is that they left wanting more. Now, either you have a very tiny tummy, or Masa has started serving more food (thankfully). If you dont mind me saying so, I am betting most of what you ate was sushi?

Anyway, your input would be greatly appreciated. Much thanks!

[oakapple]

It's interesting that Andrew says:

Yes, it lives up to the hype. It was far and away the best sushi I have ever head (caveat: I have only had top notch sushi in NY, nowhere else). It blows away Sushi Yasuda or Kuruma Zushi.

...and yet...

Was it worth the money? No. My girlfriend and I had the exact same reaction: if it were $200 less expensive, it would be worth it. But for that amount of money, we’d rather go to Per Se or ADNY and still have enough left over for a couple of lunches at Blue Ribbon Sushi. Having said that, if money were no object I’d never eat sushi again anywhere else in NY.

I am not criticizing these conflicting emotions, just remarking how unusual they are: "lives up to the hype" and "blows away" the competition; yet, by a considerable margin, not worth the money.

Is Masa still filling up every night? The conventional wisdom is that a restaurant's long-term survival depends on repeat business. How many people love this experience enough to be return customers for an out-the-door cost of $400-$500 a head?

[AndrewG]

I am not criticizing these conflicting emotions, just remarking how unusual they are: "lives up to the hype" and "blows away" the competition; yet, by a considerable margin, not worth the money.

I had a feeling that someone would question this. I really don't view my comments as conflicting emotions at all. The "lives up to the hype" and "blows away" the competion are clearly emotional responses to the food but my "not worth the money" comment is anything but emotional. Everything has its (comparative) value. As good as the experience was, it was not quite worth $850 to me. That doesn't mean its not worth $850 to others nor does it mean that it wouldn't be worth $850 to me if I were wealthier. Moreover, I said that for about $200 less it would have been worth it. On a percentage basis, thats less than 25%, not necessarily what I would call a considerable margin.

Is Masa still filling up every night?

I have no idea but I can tell you that all of the seats at the sushi bar were filled when we arrived (9:00 pm). I couldn't see the tables but I know at least some of the them if not all were occupied.