gravy

[fsuedu]

my first post here and an odd question....somewhere, sometime on some cooking show a host recommended making a "dough" of fat (butter) and flour and rolling this into balls to keep in the frig and use to thicken gravy when the time came. i think these were to be added to pan juices or broth and that because they were pre-measured, that the flour/fat ratio would be correct. has anyone else ever heard of this and if they have, does it work? sounds like a good idea, but like most good ideas, may have some drawbacks.

sorry if this is really silly, but i promise i saw this (or something really similiar) on tv (don't hold me to it, but i think it was sara's secrets)....

thanks!!!!1

[balex]

It's called "beurre manie". The drawback is you can get a floury taste.

[jackal10]

You might like to review the pan sauces section of the famous eGCI Non-stock sauces unit.

[tommy]

conversely, you could just make a roux, in which case you'd hopefully be cooking off the raw taste of the flour.

edit: "flower" hehe

i also use a cornstarch mixture at the last second. to me, it's not as gummy as flour can sometimes be.

Edited November 15, 2003 by tommy (log)

[essvee]

Two words. Gravy Master.

[gus_tatory]

my first post here and an odd question...

welcome to eGullet, fsuedu!

you can make a roux of butter and flour, let it get golden over medium heat for a bit, then refrigerate it for a week or so, just using a spoonful whenever you need it. this also eliminates the flour-y taste mentioned.

but also do as jackal10 suggested, and go check out the sauce classes at the eGullet Culinary Institute--they're excellent!

regards...

[woodburner]

Two words. Gravy Master.

woodburner

[elyse]

my first post here and an odd question...

welcome to eGullet, fsuedu!

you can make a roux of butter and flour, let it get golden over medium heat for a bit, then refrigerate it for a week or so, just using a spoonful whenever you need it. this also eliminates the flour-y taste mentioned.

but also do as jackal10 suggested, and go check out the sauce classes at the eGullet Culinary Institute--they're excellent!

regards...

I suppose you could also ball those up or put them in ice cube trays and freeze them for longer.

[Dave the Cook]

essvee and woodburner: Please make the case for Gravy Master. I've never tried it.

[woodburner]

essvee and woodburner: Please make the case for Gravy Master. I've never tried it.

Gravy Master concentrate, contains carmel coloring and concentrated flavorings.

I give whole oven roasted fowl a generous rub of the liquid all over the exterior skin proir to roasting . During the cooking process, I do baste at periordic intervals. I'm always very pleased with the visual appeal, that the carmel coloring contained in Gravy Master places all over the skin.

After the removal of avain from the roasting pan, and the highly touted rituals of gravy making begin, more splashes of GM are doused into the fat and flour to make a dark colored gravy, containing a robust of flavors.

I recall as a young child the same little bottle sitting in my grandmothers pantry, and still to this day finding it perched in my mom's spice cabinet.

woodburner

[essvee]

I was kind of joking and kind of not. I can't make Thanksgiving dinner without Bell's Seasoning and Gravy Master. Gravy Master basically gives the gravy a luscious, rich color, as turkey gravy can often be kind of gray. Makes it taste better by making it look better. Don't use too much, though, or else your gravy will be the color of black coffee. Kitchen Bouquet is the same thing.

[woodburner]

essvee and woodburner: Please make the case for Gravy Master. I've never tried it.

Perhaps you could now make the case, on why you have never tried it?

woodburner

[jackal10]

Is Gravy Master like Bisto? ("Ahh...Bisto!"as the adverts have it). Cornflour, sugar, salt, caramel and MSG?

I prefer to add mine from Maderira and dark Soy (about a Tbs each); I also prefer flour thickened gravy, well cooked out, to cornflour. Cornflour is great for chinese food, but leads to a sort of too tranparent gravy. Flour adsorbs the fat for the roast better, somehow.

Stay with roux or Beurre Manie.

[elyse]

Cornflour there = corn starch here.

[Jim Dixon]

In the Dixon household, where many aspects of the traditional Thanksgiving meal are hotly debated, gravy remains sacrosanct (altho' mom never did baste with dark beer, a NJ Italian addition to the process and one that results in really good gravy).

We thicken our gravy with a paste made by mixing flour into cold water. That goes into the roasting pan, along with stock made from the neck or other parts, maybe some canned stock, water, a touch of milk, creme fraiche if I've got it (the dairy, added in small amounts, seems to help keep the gravy from separating, and it adds a nice mouthfeel), and a few splashes of Kitchen Bouquet. Gravy ties the meal, or our version of it anyway, together, and there's nothing worse than running out a few days into leftovers, so I make at least a couple of quarts.

My late Aunt Margaret never used anything but a spoon to stir the gravy, but a stick blender helps if you get any errant lumps.

JIm

[eskimoted]

Can't say I'm a personal fan of the proprietary gravy things, although I expect some of them could have some good flavours. Adding a small amount flour the cooking fats and then making a dark roux with that is a good way of doing it.

An even easier way, in a sense, is to make a really stiff espagnole sauce and freeze it into portions. Then just deglaze the pan with some wine and then add a portion or two of the espagnole to the deglazed juices. Because the espagnole has already spent a good amount of time "deflouring" (as it were) the roux, you'll see the benefit of the thickness without the nasty mouthfeel of adding corn starch or flour at the last minute.

Of course, you have to have been bothered to make the espagnole in the first place!

I definitely don't recommend beurre manie for a pan gravy. But it works well to thicken a thin gravy in slow cooked dishes like a boeuf bourguignon. Add it at towards the end, because the often the sauce will thicken naturally during the cooking process. Remember though that you'll need at least 30 minutes further cooking time to deal with the flour.

Edited November 18, 2003 by eskimoted (log)

[wawairis]

i also use a cornstarch mixture at the last second. to me, it's not as gummy as flour can sometimes be.

But doesn't cornstarch break after it reaches a certain temperature?

[tommy]

i also use a cornstarch mixture at the last second.  to me, it's not as gummy as flour can sometimes be.

But doesn't cornstarch break after it reaches a certain temperature?

i add it off the heat. i wouldn't recommend adding cornstarch if you're going to continue to simmer the gravy.

[Marlene]

I have in the past, used Bisto, Kitchen Boquet, and Gravy Browning (probably the same thing as Gravy Master). Now what I do delgaze the pan first with white or red wine depending on what type of meat I've roasted, usually mix flour and cold water, add to the deglazed pan, and add about a tsp of demi glaze (found at William Sonoma). The demi glaze gives the gravy the nice rich colour I'm looking for without adding a lot of salt that can be found in some of the other browners.

Then as the gravy thickens, I'll add extra water as needed.

[elyse]

i also use a cornstarch mixture at the last second.  to me, it's not as gummy as flour can sometimes be.

But doesn't cornstarch break after it reaches a certain temperature?

i add it off the heat. i wouldn't recommend adding cornstarch if you're going to continue to simmer the gravy.

I've done it and never had a problem. But I only use corn starch when I've screwed up.

[Toliver]

Does anyone have a tried and true recipe for a good milk gravy like the gravy that is one gets from fried chicken? I haven't seen it covered in the eGCI.

The gravies I've made do look like milk gravy but tend to be flavorless and who wants to put that on a good batch of homemade mashed potatoes?

Should I "cheat" and throw in some chicken bullion or broth to help give it flavor?

[prasantrin]

Can a roux-based gravy be frozen and successfully reheated? I've been reading conflicting opinions. My plan is to make Swedish meatballs with gravy (no cream), and then freeze most of it (IQF-type of freezing). When reheating portions of gravy, I'll add some cream for a bit of richness.

[PopsicleToze]

IMHO, no, a roux based gravy cannot be successfully frozen. You can freeze it and then probably doctor it back together somewhat, but it won't be the same.

There is definitely a conflicting opinion.

Rhonda

[prasantrin]

IMHO, no, a roux based gravy cannot be successfully frozen.  You can freeze it and then probably doctor it back together somewhat, but it won't be the same.

There is definitely a conflicting opinion.

Rhonda

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Could you tell me a little more about how it would change? Is it the texture? Or would it separate completely (more than what a quick whisking would fix)?

I'd be willing to sacrifice some quality, but if I have to do a lot of work to it, then I won't bother.

[PopsicleToze]

There are people that can answer a lot better -- but here goes

It is a texture thing. It doesn't completely separate but does separate. When it freezes you can even look at the top of it and it appears "fluffy". Texture maybe similar to freezing wine. You can freeze wine, but the alcohol keeps the wine from freezing solid so it's still kindof slushy and off.

I'm sure you could bring pull it back together and make it work. But if you want to make it ahead, why wouldn't you just make and freeze the meatballs ahead and then make your gravy the day of service?

Rhonda