essvee

Thanks all.

I know from bitter experience the results of overproofing the second rise for bread. But what about the first? How tied to the "let rise until just doubled" rule do I have to be for the first proof? Thanks in advance.

judec, I've been using Stone-Buhr bread flour.

paul, my big problem is that both my All Clad and Calpholon saute pans, over ten years old the both of them, have basically stopped releasing food. I eat a lot of chix fricassee, and both pans will not release the skin no matter what I do. Heat the pan first, whatever. They both used to release better; the All Clad always better than the Calpholon. I have a Calpholon non-stick saute pan I bought at Macy's as a loss leader for 100 bucks a couple years ago. It is doing OK, but the idea that I could use metal utensils on the T-Fal Ultimate seems seductive.

Just loafing, it is a great loaf. I have left out the sugar before, which sharpens the molasses flavor. It makes superb, albeit a bit crumbly, toast.

Thanks, Celeste, and for all replies. Good information about oats and bread. I will stop making the oatmeal loaf for sandwiches. Let me refine my question. I want to make sandwich bread, but I want them to be multigrain breads. Pain de mie is not what I'm looking for. So I'm looking for suggestions on how to make multigrain breads that will hold together enough for sandwiches, like the loaves you can buy in the store and also the bakery. Perhaps the answer is as simple as: use the recipes in Clayton's book that call for nonfat dry milk. Are there any other ways to 'strengthen' a whole grain or multi-grain loaf? I hope I am not coming across as obtuse, and I truly appreciate the prompt responses, which don't happen for most questions I post. Thanks again.

Thanks, Celeste. I just purchased B. Clayton's bread book, and I noticed that a lot of his loaves call for powdered milk. Now I know why. I also noticed, in his 'French and Italian' section, that he references a pinch of ascorbic acid to strengthen the cellular formation. Hmm. Can anyone speak to that? I do allow the loaf to cool completely. The bread I make the most often is a heritage recipe from my great-great-granny-- oatmeal molasses. I recently made Clayton's Roman Meal bread, but substituted Uncle Sam cereal for the Roman Meal cereal. Both breads are sturdy and handsome, but they fall apart when used for sandwiches, or even if you butter them too excitedly after toasting. Here's the oatmeal bread recipe. No sponge, just two risings. Thanks for your help. 1 cup oats in 2 cups boiling water add 1/3 cup molasses 1/3 cup sugar 1 T salt 3 T veg oil 6+ cups flour 2 t yeast in a little warm water

Sorry for the awkward title. Couldn't figure out how to word it concisely. Here's my dilemma. I have worked hard, studied hard, and have finally after many travails been able to consistently produce a good loaf of sandwich/pan bread. The problem is, unlike storebought or even bakery bread, my bread is not very durable for lack of a better word and falls apart when used for sandwiches. Wah. I have used both all-purpose and bread flour with no discernable difference. Any suggestions? Thanks.

Thanks all. I looked around online and saw that T-Fal Ultimate looks like their high-end line. Gordon, do you know which T-Fal line your friend has? Has anyone used that T-Fal Ultimate saute pan? Does Anolon have different lines as well? Thanks for all replies.

Hi all. I have always, without any evidence for or against except for price point, looked at T-Fal and Anolon as inferior to the All-Clads and Capholons of this world. How surprised was I to see that Saveur recommended an Anolon saucepan and a T-Fal nonstick saute pan in their most recent top 100 issue! Can anyone speak to the quality/durability of these brands? Are there different lines within each brand that are more worthy than others? How well do they stack up to the top of the line brands? Thanks.

Great ideas, Skipper. Do you have any suggestions for a cabbage and/or mushroom filling?

It helps a lot. I only had the pirog at Cinderella once. It's entirely possible that I am mis-remembering the puff pastry. Do you use short crust instead? Do you think that I am mis-remembering the salmon and sturgeon together? That it is one or the other? Lastly, is it possible that the bakery might have used some kind of a binder, maybe sour cream and beaten egg, to hold the filling together? One more question-- are there any options besides S+P for seasoning? Bay, thyme, nutmeg or mace? Thank you very very much. You have made a new mother very happy. I will make this dish for her tomorrow!

Thanks, you two.

There is a Siberian restaurant in San Francisco name of Cinderella. It makes something it calls pirogi, also Siberian style pie. One version is a baked dish of salmon, sturgeon and glass noodles with puff pastry. My sister in law grew up eating there with her Siberian grandparents. She really wants me to make this dish for her. I haven't been able to find a recipe. Can anyone help? Thanking you. essvee

Anyone else? Union Hotel, good or gross? Cafe les Jumelles? Bueller?